Cost comparison SGR Kenya vs SGR Tanzania

Cost comparison SGR Kenya vs SGR Tanzania

Bantugbro said:
Mkuu ,

Subiri utapata habari zote mda ukifika, si unajua kuna watu hawakawii kwenda kuanza kupiga kelele wakijua in details jinsi tulivyojipanga.

Karata tumezishika karibu kabisa na vifua vyetu, tunakwenda kwa timing kali, kama tusingekua na pesa hatukua na haja ya kujenga Stieglers kabla hatujamaliza SGR...before end of the second quater tenda zote za remaining phases zitatangazwa kwa mpigo.

Kuna kajamaa kutoka kwa jirani kanachanganya mambo, SGR hii inayojengwa sasa inaelekea Mwanza, mipango ya ile SGR branch ya kutoka Isaka ICD kwenda Rusumo border ya TZ - Rwanda yenye urefu wa 310 km ni tofauti kabisa na hii.

Branch ya SGR ya kwenda DRC na Burundi itaanzia Uvinza kigoma hadi Msongati kama 240 km hivi...

www.theeastafrican.co.ke

Blow to Northern Corridor as Tanzania signs deal to link SGR to Burundi, DRC

Kenya had marketed its own SGR as the cheaper and more efficient route.
www.theeastafrican.co.ke www.theeastafrican.co.ke
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Twende taratibu hivi hivi mkuu kuna mipaka ya taarifa.utatumegea pale unapoona kadri inafaa kwa public consumption.
 
Geza Ulole said:
Hapo kuna $300 mln Barrickgold wamesaini juzi! Hawa majamaa hawajui GoT ina mfuko maalum wa ujenzi ambapo kila mwezi Tshs 2 bln zinawekwa humo! Then kuna jamaa wa Airtel wanatoa the same amount $1 mln/month kama agreement ya kulipa hasara walioipatia TTCL ambayo inaenda kwenye ujenzi health fund inayojenga hospitali!

Ushauri
Kwa hiyo $300mln, mimi namshauri aanzishe another phase ya SGR construction esp. Mwanza to Isaka! Au anunue cargo aircraft mbili! Au ajenge wagon ferries nyingine kama 8 hivi kwa ajili ya Lake Tanganyika na Lake Victoria na 2 cargo ships for Indian ocean!
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Geza kuna hii morogoro road kutoka apo kibaha ile barabara foleni itaanza mlandizi sasa kuenda kibaha...mimi ningeshauri waendeleze ujenzi wake hadi chalinze na waweke overpass kadri iwezekanavyo ili morogoro road iwe inapitika kiurahisi...
Huo mkwanja unatosha hyo project na unabaki kutanua new bagamoyo road kutoka pale Tegeta hadi bagamoyo kabisa kwa wale wanaoenda mikoa ya kask ambao hawana ulazima wakutumia Morogoro road kuingia jijini

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Geza Ulole said:
But Tanzania Railways is a customer right? BTW the cost of Dar-Morogoro is $1.2 bln n not $1.9bln! $1.9bln is the cost for Morogoro to Makutupora! As we speak Tanesco is building not less than 4 TL across the country n longer than Dar-Moro!
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Do you sometimes just pretend to be oblivious or is it an actual real thing? You seem to completely miss the point on this issue, I thought you would have got it by now, but you haven't.
This is not about if tanesco is building other TLs, this is about one specific TL built for the SGR and who should pay for it!


Kenya's SGR might not be elelectric, but from Mombasa-Nairobi there is a 32kv continuous power supply line (which is the equivalent of the 220kv TL bieng built by Tanesco) thats powers the sensors,traffic control systems, stations along the line, the cost of this continuous power line was part of the contract with CCCC/CRBC. even though the line is maintained by KPLC! This is what i'm talking about, where in Tanzania, its tanesco that will foot the bill of that TL thats is exclusively built for the SGR.

If you have never noticed, there are concrete electric poles inside the perimeter fence of Kenyas SGR, those power lines go from Mombasa the way to Nairobi, the cost of that power line was included in the contract together with other things, unlike in TZ where the construction contract excludes other expenses of which without them the rail won't work. e.g Trains, Wagons, TL...etc
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And all public articles say Dar-Moro is $1.9B, so if you have a problem with that number then bring evidence.
 
Ngokongosha said:
Kafrican is trying to show how expensive is tz sgr compared to the one in Kenya, but he need to know the followings,

1. Electrification
Saying tz sgr is expensive because some of the expenses are covered by Tanesco, eg TL, this is wrong
Because Kenya sgr is not electrified, so if they want to electrify it they gonna incur more cost, they will need a TL and the catenaries so the cost will jump rapidly,

2. Continuous welded
Kenya sgr is not welded, welding it means more cost.

Taking into consideration the two facts above still tz have got a better deal, if Kenya want to meet the standard of tz sgr by eg electrifying and welding their sgr the cost will increase tremendously.

So let us compare the cost at the same level without including the cost of the things Kenya sgr don't have like electrification
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Its almost as if you guys are in another dimension where you can't see things straight ..

Your thinking is backwards, right now everyone says, Kenya's SGR is expensive (while being Diesel powered) while TZ SGR is cheaper(while being electric)..... How they get to this conclusion is by dividing the Cost of the project by the Distance covered.

What I'm trying to explain to you people who won't get it is that in Kenya's case, the cost of the project also covers the expenses for the 56 trains, 1,600 wagons, 50 coaches... among other additional things.... While in Tanzania's case, the cost of the TL is not covered in the $1.9B contract with Yepi, The Trains and Wagons are also not part of the project etc ... Therefore if you want to find the real cost of TZ SGR, you might want to first find out how much the trains, TL, wagons, Coaches will cost....

And BTW,Bridges and back-filling of embankment which Kenya has in plenty cost way more than electrification and wielding combined! So that's not really a reason for argument....



Here is an abstract breakdown of Kenya's phase 1 SGR project cost - $3.8B
-----------------------------------------------

1580252200047.png




1580252502560.png



Ukiangalia hio screenshot ya kwanza, ujenzi wa reli na stesheni garama yake ni only $2.66B kutoka Mombasahadi Nairobi.. Kwahivyo kama ingekua tunajenga reli kama Tanzania, hio $2.66B ndo ingekua kwa kandarasi tuliao sign na mchina, Alafu tunge tuma wanafunzi kusomea reli huko nje kwa garama zetu, tungenunua vichwa vya treni na mabehewa yake kwa garama ya kivyake, ICD ingejengwa kwa garama yake kando..etc



Sasa ninachosema kuhusu reli ya TZ ni kwamba hio $1.9B ya Dar-Moro bado hamjaongeza hesabu za TL,Vichwa, mabehewa,..... Kwahivyo hata mimi siwezi nikakwambia kama reli ya TZ ni expensive au ni cheap, mpaka unipatie hizo garama za kando!!!!! Kwa ufupi ninachosema ni kwamba garama ya ujenzi wa tz SGR bado haijulikani kiuhalisia manake bado kuna vitu muhimu hamjasema bei yake na havijahesabiwa juu ya ile iliotajwa kwa kandarasi.
Kwa upande mwengine, garama ya SGR Kenya tunayoijua inahesabu kila kitu!

Natarajia kuna angalau mmoja wenu atakua amenielewa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Kama bado hamjanielewa basi naosha mkono!
 
Geza Ulole said:
DAR ES SALAAM, July 6 (Xinhua) -- Tanzanian authorities said on Saturday the first phase operation of the standard gauge railway (SGR) between the business capital Dar es Salaam and Morogoro covering about 200 kilometers was set to commence in December 2019.

Isack Kamwele, the east African nation's Minister for Works, Transport and Communication, said in a news conference in Dar es Salaam that procurement process for wagons and locomotive engines has been completed.

Kamwele said procurement of 1,430 cargo wagons, 20 locomotives, 60 passenger carriages and five sets of multiple trains has begun.

"We have already set some funds to purchase the engines and we expect by this December the maiden operation of SGR from Dar es Salaam to Morogoro will start," said him.

Kamwele directed the Tanzania Railways Corporation (TRC) authorities to ensure some local sub-contractors were paid on time to speed up the construction process and avoid corruption within the SGR project.

"The contractor of SGR project is so far doing a good job, unfortunately, I have been receiving some complaints from sub-contractors that the contractor was delaying to pay them," he said.

"Once local contractors do their work they should be paid on time to avoid delaying the SGR project," said the minister. Enditem


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Tanzania's SGR to commence operations in December - China.org.cn

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All of that is in a separate contract, separately paid on top of the cost of construction
 
Simon said:
kwanza nakushauri punguza ujuaji kwanza!!

pili, una uhakika hio transmission line inajengwa exclusively kwa ajili ya SGR tu?? .. kukujuza mim ni engineer nipo kinyerezi! .. nakushauri punguza ujuaji!!
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Usipingane na mimi, pingana na Yepi, Tayari kunazo transmission lines zinazopatikana kwenye hio route, Yepi waliangalia option zote including kusambaziwa umeme from the nearest existing TL along the route to each sub-station, lakini mwishowe wakamalizia kwamba the most reliable way ni wajengewe TL yao kutoka Dar hadi Moro ili wasisumbuane na usambazaji wa umeme kwa majumba ya watu.


1580254059896.png
 
Kafrican said:
All of that is in a separate contract, separately paid on top of the cost of construction
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Even that still ur diesel mtambo wa chang'aa is way expensive than electrical SGR in Tanzania
Geza Ulole said:
But why should transmission line cost be factored in the electrical SGR cost? Isn't transmission line the duty of an electrical company? Assuming we r factoring in the $150 mln for TL still the cost will be lower in comparison to ur diesel SGR! 1.2 bln + 1.9 bln=3.1+0.15= $3.25 bln! Then add says $400 mln for locomotives! then u get $3.65 bln for Dar-Makutupora (336+205) 541 km which less than the cost of $3.8 bln for Mombasa-Nrb diesel SGR of length 472 km!
Teargass Kafrican
Click to expand...
 
A Kenyan telling of a progress though 5 MU trains for PAX skipped!
www.pulselive.co.ke

Business Insider Africa

Read the latest news across entertainment, sports, business and more
www.pulselive.co.ke www.pulselive.co.ke
 
Kafrican said:
Its almost as if you guys are in another dimension where you can't see things straight ..

Your thinking is backwards, right now everyone says, Kenya's SGR is expensive (while being Diesel powered) while TZ SGR is cheaper(while being electric)..... How they get to this conclusion is by dividing the Cost of the project by the Distance covered.

What I'm trying to explain to you people who won't get it is that in Kenya's case, the cost of the project also covers the expenses for the 56 trains, 1,600 wagons, 50 coaches... among other additional things.... While in Tanzania's case, the cost of the TL is not covered in the $1.9B contract with Yepi, The Trains and Wagons are also not part of the project etc ... Therefore if you want to find the real cost of TZ SGR, you might want to first find out how much the trains, TL, wagons, Coaches will cost....

And BTW,Bridges and back-filling of embankment which Kenya has in plenty cost way more than electrification and wielding combined! So that's not really a reason for argument....



Here is an abstract breakdown of Kenya's phase 1 SGR project cost - $3.8B
-----------------------------------------------

View attachment 1338945



View attachment 1338946


Ukiangalia hio screenshot ya kwanza, ujenzi wa reli na stesheni garama yake ni only $2.66B kutoka Mombasahadi Nairobi.. Kwahivyo kama ingekua tunajenga reli kama Tanzania, hio $2.66B ndo ingekua kwa kandarasi tuliao sign na mchina, Alafu tunge tuma wanafunzi kusomea reli huko nje kwa garama zetu, tungenunua vichwa vya treni na mabehewa yake kwa garama ya kivyake, ICD ingejengwa kwa garama yake kando..etc



Sasa ninachosema kuhusu reli ya TZ ni kwamba hio $1.9B ya Dar-Moro bado hamjaongeza hesabu za TL,Vichwa, mabehewa,..... Kwahivyo hata mimi siwezi nikakwambia kama reli ya TZ ni expensive au ni cheap, mpaka unipatie hizo garama za kando!!!!! Kwa ufupi ninachosema ni kwamba garama ya ujenzi wa tz SGR bado haijulikani kiuhalisia manake bado kuna vitu muhimu hamjasema bei yake na havijahesabiwa juu ya ile iliotajwa kwa kandarasi.
Kwa upande mwengine, garama ya SGR Kenya tunayoijua inahesabu kila kitu!

Natarajia kuna angalau mmoja wenu atakua amenielewa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Kama bado hamjanielewa basi naosha mkono!
Click to expand...
and yet not electrified n SGR track not joint welded!

While Mombasa-Naivasha diesel SGR track length 609+120= 726 km is $3.8+1.5= $5.4 bln, our Dar-Makutupora SGR track length of over 700km (305km SGR I+409km SGR II) of electrified joint welded SGR is $3.1 (1.2 SGR I + 1.9 SGR II) bln as TL is not part of the TRC cost but part of Tanesco's costs! As for structures the Ruvu bridge across swampy Ruvu basin is 3 km n Dar viaduct is 2 km! As for tunnels there r also tunnels (whose lengths are T1 424 m, T2 1.031 m, T3 318 m and T4 847 m) for Morogoro -Makutupora with a total length of 2.6 km!
 
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