Elimu: Fundisheni Software Coding mashuleni

[Mzuvendi]

Mkuu shukrani kwa maelezo yako,
Labda ningeongeze na kudeclare interest kuwa mimi nimesoma Bachelor of science in Information Technology management.

Inshort haya masomo ya computer nionavyo mimi so far most ni wastage time, vitu vingi ni vitu ambvyo unaweza kujifunza baada ya kusoma vitu vingine, mfano hii ya coding nakuhakikishia huwezi kuw acoding mzuri kama hujuhi hiko unachokifanyia coding, kam ni software/application ya biashara au accountancy huwezi fanya vizuri kaa hujuhi accountancy au kam ni ya Afya, uwezi ifanya vizuri kam huijuhi afya.

so tukubaliane kuwa coding/progaraming tunaweza kuiweka mashuleni lakini iweni kama Topic/subject tu na sio major watu wasome kama wanavyo soma masomo mengine, kitu ambcho so far kinafanyika ila ni kwa wanfunzi wa masomo ya computer na It tu na inafanyika kw aubora zaidi kwa wale wanao major kwenye mambo hayo.

Tukubaline labda watoto waanze kufundishwa pasacal, c+, v basic wakiwa primary.

Actually you are misguided. It seems to me that when you look at Operating Systems such as Windows, Linux, and others you don't regard them as computer programs. It seems to me that when you look at programming languages such as visual basic, fortan you don't see them as a computer programs which require high level of thinking and programming to develop them.

Furthermore if you visit Microsoft, Apples or Google development centers, you will find more than 80% of employees have degrees that are computation in nature or require a very good level of computation. So when you say computer classes are a wastage of time, probably you went to a wrong a school or you don't know what you talk.

Coding isn't the only aspect of creating a working program. And for many highly skilled coder, before you start coding, the first thing you do is to a solution on paper, or to you have a conceptualized solution in your head. In other words, coding the use of tool (program language) to transform you solution into computer instructions.

In addition, people who have degrees in computer science don't work in a vacuum. They work with business analysts such as accountants or domain experts such as medical doctors to elicit system requirements. So they don't need to be experts in other areas to be fabulous coders. Besides, most coders who have attended computer schools are highly intelligent individuals. They can code any problem whose solution requires finite steps.

 

[Mzuvendi]

Nakubaliana na wewe kabisa,

Katika maisha yangu nimetumia programming languages nyingi sana na kuzimaster bila kuchukua kozi yoyote. Ninazokumbuka ni pamoja na Borland Pascal, Turbo Pascal, GW Basic, VBasic, Fortran, ANSI C, C++, C#,Java, JavaScript, PhP, HTML, Python, etc. Ninaweza kusema ni kuwa zote zina structure moja inayojengwa kutokana na msingi wa Looping, na Branching. Halafu zile zinazosupport Objects zinaongezea msing wa Classes (abstraction). Sioni kama kweli mtu anatakaiwa awe na digrii kujua kuandika program hizi. Nina project ninayofanya outreach kwa middle schools ambako huwa tunafanya projects na watoto ambao wanaandika program nzuri tu katika C/C++.

Yes many programs have the same structure. But sometimes they are created for different purposes or they are created to address problems in particular domains. For example, Java was created to address portability. JavaScript is a language that used within web browsers. Php create dynamic web pages.

The truth is, as tools, programming languages have democratized the art of programming. Anybody who wants to program can learn how to program. Equally important, the programming languages have increased the productivity. Work that used to take years to program, it can be completed in a very short period of time using average programmers.

However, we should note that we don't programming for the sake of programming. We program to solve problems. Therefore, Tanzanians shouldn't neglect Math, Physics, Chemistry, and other subjects that enhance students' skills in solving problems.

 

[Kichuguu]

Yes many programs have the same structure. But sometimes they are created for different purposes or they are created to address problems in particular domains. For example, Java was created to address portability. JavaScript is a language that used within web browsers. Php create dynamic web pages.

The truth is, as tools, programming languages have democratized the art of programming. Anybody who wants to program can learn how to program. Equally important, the programming languages have increased the productivity. Work that used to take years to program, it can be completed in a very short period of time using average programmers.

However, we should note that we don't programming for the sake of programming. We program to solve problems. Therefore, Tanzanians shouldn't neglect Math, Physics, Chemistry, and other subjects that enhance students' skills in solving problems.

I hope you agree with me that being skilled in problem solving methods and being skilled in computer programming languages are two different things. A course in problem solving methods such as algorithm development is not same as a course in computer programming in any language! Differences in application environments do not warrant a full course in a particular programming language; those differences are the ones that a skilled person should be able to independently navigate.

 

[Mzuvendi]

I hope you agree with me that being skilled in problem solving methods and being skilled in computer programming languages are two different things. A course in problem solving methods such as algorithm development is not same as a course in computer programming in any language! Differences in application environments do not warrant a full course in a particular programming language; those differences are the ones that a skilled person should be able to independently navigate.

The skills you have mentioned above (problem solving skill and programming) aren't mutually exclusive. An individual can master both skills without any issues. As a matter of fact, majority of students who have attended good computer science programs or good schools have mastered both. For example, when I was in school, the first two years of studies were dedicated to programming; whereas, the last three years were reserved for solving or research problems using the language of your choice. So to me, problem solving and programming skills are two sides of the same coin. Problem solving skills define a solution of the problem in finite steps; whereas, programing skills translate those steps into machine instructions.

Furthermore, the development of programming languages is primary intended to increase productivity as it allows problem solvers to concentrate on the issue at hand and not on the computer technicality. So as the trend to increase productivity continues, programming will approach the level of full automation. At that level programming will be an easier activity as clicking the button.

 

[Kichuguu]

The skills you have mentioned above (problem solving skill and programming) aren't mutually exclusive. An individual can master both skills without any issues. As a matter of fact, majority of students who have attended good computer science programs or good schools have mastered both. For example, when I was in school, the first two years of studies were dedicated to programming; whereas, the last three years were reserved for solving or research problems using the language of your choice. So to me, problem solving and programming skills are two sides of the same coin. Problem solving skills define a solution of the problem in finite steps; whereas, programing skills translate those steps into machine instructions.

Furthermore, the development of programming languages is primary intended to increase productivity as it allows problem solvers to concentrate on the issue at hand and not on the computer technicality. So as the trend to increase productivity continues, programming will approach the level of full automation. At that level programming will be an easier activity as clicking the button.

My Lordship, computer programming is not applied science, it is a trade. That is why computer programming does not require any mathematical or analytical skills. A computer scientist or a software engineer does not have to be a programmer although some amount programming knowledge is expected. I have high school students who are computer programmers but cannot do anything related to systems analysis and project design, which are among the cores of computer science and software engineering.

 

[Mzuvendi]

My Lordship, computer programming is not a applied science, it is a trade. That is why computer programming does not require any mathematical or analytical skills. A computer scientist of a software engineer does not have to be a programmer although some amount programming knowledge is expected. I have high schools students who are computer programmer but cannot do anything related to systems analysis and project design, which are among the cores of computer science and software engineering.

Where did I say computer programming is applied science?

My Lordship, computer programming is not a applied science, it is a trade. That is why computer programming does not require any mathematical or analytical skills. A computer scientist of a software engineer does not have to be a programmer although some amount programming knowledge is expected. I have high schools students who are computer programmer but cannot do anything related to systems analysis and project design, which are among the cores of computer science and software engineering.

This is just wonderful !!. You say computer programming doesn't require any mathematical or analytical skills. If that's the case, show me an example of a person who have created a meaningful computer program and who doesn't have mathematical or analytical skills? If computer programming is just a trade that doesn't require mathematical or analytical skills, please go to any mediocre high school in Tanzania and bring back a programmer.

Let me ask you a question. How many of your high school students make living or expect to make living as programmers? If they just create toy programs, they are still learning and you can't call them programmers. High school students can do well in mathematics or music, but we don't call them mathematicians or musicians.

The point I want to make is we are just obsessed with soundbites. Just because Tim Cook says that teaching young children coding is a great thing, we want to jump into it right away. However, here's the thing, coding goes hand in hand with other subjects such as math, physics etc. And nations that have invested in education have done much better coding in elementary, secondary or high schools.

 

[Kichuguu]

Where did I say computer programming is applied science?


This is just wonderful !!. You say computer programming doesn't require any mathematical or analytical skills. If that's the case, show me an example of a person who have created a meaningful computer program and who doesn't have mathematical or analytical skills? If computer programming is just a trade that doesn't require mathematical or analytical skills, please go to any mediocre high school in Tanzania and bring back a programmer.

Let me ask you a question. How many of your high school students make living or expect to make living as programmers? If they just create toy programs, they are still learning and you can't call them programmers. High school students can do well in mathematics or music, but we don't call them mathematicians or musicians.

The point I want to make is we are just obsessed with soundbites. Just because Tim Cook says that teaching young children coding is a great thing, we want to jump into it right away. However, here's the thing, coding goes hand in hand with other subjects such as math, physics etc. And nations that have invested in education have done much better coding in elementary, secondary or high schools.

(1) I know so many website programmers who don't use any math. Just a good CSS template and a simple coordinate map of the computer monitor and that is it.
(2) Computer programming is trade, which can be taught or acquired involutarily by the individual. I don't mean to denigrate computer programming, but go back to what the discussion was about. If it is taught, then it has to be taught as a trade, not as part of professional training in Computer Science or Software Engineering, both of which are applied sciences.

 

[Mzuvendi]

(1) I know so many website programmers who don't use any math. Just a good CSS template and a simple coordinate map of the computer monitor and that is it.
(2) Computer programming is trade, which can be taught or acquired involutarily by the individual. I don't mean to denigrate computer programming, but go back to what the discussion was about. If it is taught, then it has to be taught as a trade, not as part of professional training in Computer Science or Software Engineering, both of which are applied sciences.

Thanks for you reply. My involvement here isn't to amplify programming as a special field that requires intensive training. Anybody who put his/her efforts can master programming without going to school. However, when we talk coding in schools, we talk about education policies and the impact those policies will have in our communities. It's true that, computer programming could have a place in every level of our schools. However, if you take a seat and look back the way we dispense education in the country, you find out that we haven't done any serious work and coding won't mask our deficiencies.

Furthermore, once you add coding as part of school curriculum, you will teach students coding materials worth teaching. I am not sure if Tim Cook referred to CSS template when he talked about teaching student coding. If coding in schools is about good CSS template and simple coordinate, you could as well distribute books to students and let them do for themselves.

Tanzania doesn't have any competitive advantage in computer technology or for that matter any technology. So learning trade while others aim for skies wouldn't make us any better. We will only settle for Whatsapp administration.

 

[Kibanga Ampiga Mkoloni]

Actually you are misguided. It seems to me that when you look at Operating Systems such as Windows, Linux, and others you don't regard them as computer programs. It seems to me that when you look at programming languages such as visual basic, fortan you don't see them as a computer programs which require high level of thinking and programming to develop them.

Furthermore if you visit Microsoft, Apples or Google development centers, you will find more than 80% of employees have degrees that are computation in nature or require a very good level of computation. So when you say computer classes are a wastage of time, probably you went to a wrong a school or you don't know what you talk.

Coding isn't the only aspect of creating a working program. And for many highly skilled coder, before you start coding, the first thing you do is to a solution on paper, or to you have a conceptualized solution in your head. In other words, coding the use of tool (program language) to transform you solution into computer instructions.

In addition, people who have degrees in computer science don't work in a vacuum. They work with business analysts such as accountants or domain experts such as medical doctors to elicit system requirements. So they don't need to be experts in other areas to be fabulous coders. Besides, most coders who have attended computer schools are highly intelligent individuals. They can code any problem whose solution requires finite steps.

1. Hapo RED napata tabu sana sijuhi ni kuji vipi? yani unajaribu kuonyesha mimi ni Mjinga kiasi sijuhi tofauti ya Program, System software and Application software.
Labda nikujibu tu ASANTE.

2.Hapo BLUE nadhani tumesahahu mada ilikuw ainahusu nini, labda nikukumbushe tu kasome tena heading na zingatia neno mashuleni na jua ni Tanzania.
Again sina jibu umekomaa kunitukana narudia na hili najibu ASANTE.

3.Hapo Green, niseme tu kwangu unaruka ruka tu kama maharage yanayotaka kuiva, hiki unachokisema hapo ndicho nilichokisema kule na nikamkatalia mwanisha mada kuwa CODING haitutosha tusome na vingine na nikaongezea CODING sio lazima tuijue hii huko tuendako inafanyika na mashine tu (AI) as long as umeandaa vizuri "Solution on paper" or "Conceptualize your solution" hii ni kwa maandishi yako.
na duniani kote tatizo la good programs/softwares lipo hapo kwenye kuandaa solution na hapa ndipo mimi nilishahuri tujikite kwanza kabla ya kukimbilia Coding.

4.Hapo Black, yale yale unaruka ruka tu. Nisha sema atuhitaji kujua Coding ili tupate programs/software zenye uwezo wa kutatua matatizo yetu, ila tunapaswa kujua JINSI YA KUTAFUTA SOLUTIONS, na haya ya coding tuachie wengine.
by the way nani kakuambia Most coders have attended computer school ? mbona mimi nijuavyo wajuvi wengi hawajafika hata huko madarasani ya computer kwa huko kwenye maguru. hivi kwlei unaweza kuwa Guru wa language hata moja kwa kupoteza five/four/Three years studying rubish at computer class ambazo azikusaidii chochote kwenye coding?


Conclusion:
naona mada inapotea na kuzidi kutanuka, au mimi ndiye naipotosha, ila narudia tena nilivyoelewa mimi tunachohitaji ni solution za maisha yeu ya kila siku na hizi solution HATUHITAJI KUW AMAGURU KWENYE CODING KUZIPATA LETS BE GOOD ANALYSTA WA SOLUTIONS NA tuwapelekee coders wafanye, TZ hii hakuna coder anayeweza fanya better than them( watu na mshine zao/AI) tusiongopeane.

By the way home work to you tuambie kati ya Solution Analyst na huyo coder who get good pay ?

 

[Kibanga Ampiga Mkoloni]

Thanks for you reply. My involvement here isn't to amplify programming as a special field that requires intensive training. Anybody who put his/her efforts can master programming without going to school. However, when we talk coding in schools, we talk about education policies and the impact those policies will have in our communities. It's true that, computer programming could have a place in every level of our schools. However, if you take a seat and look back the way we dispense education in the country, you find out that we haven't done any serious work and coding won't mask our deficiencies.

Furthermore, once you add coding as part of school curriculum, you will teach students coding materials worth teaching. I am not sure if Tim Cook referred to CSS template when he talked about teaching student coding. If coding in schools is about good CSS template and simple coordinate, you could as well distribute books to students and let them do for themselves.

Tanzania doesn't have any competitive advantage in computer technology or for that matter any technology. So learning trade while others aim for skies wouldn't make us any better. We will only settle for Whatsapp administration.

Never will we be able to compete in coding , there other things of important to learn in computer which we can make it world wide than coding.

 

[Mzuvendi]

1. Hapo RED napata tabu sana sijuhi ni kuji vipi? yani unajaribu kuonyesha mimi ni Mjinga kiasi sijuhi tofauti ya Program, System software and Application software.
Labda nikujibu tu ASANTE.

2.Hapo BLUE nadhani tumesahahu mada ilikuw ainahusu nini, labda nikukumbushe tu kasome tena heading na zingatia neno mashuleni na jua ni Tanzania.
Again sina jibu umekomaa kunitukana narudia na hili najibu ASANTE.

3.Hapo Green, niseme tu kwangu unaruka ruka tu kama maharage yanayotaka kuiva, hiki unachokisema hapo ndicho nilichokisema kule na nikamkatalia mwanisha mada kuwa CODING haitutosha tusome na vingine na nikaongezea CODING sio lazima tuijue hii huko tuendako inafanyika na mashine tu (AI) as long as umeandaa vizuri "Solution on paper" or "Conceptualize your solution" hii ni kwa maandishi yako.
na duniani kote tatizo la good programs/softwares lipo hapo kwenye kuandaa solution na hapa ndipo mimi nilishahuri tujikite kwanza kabla ya kukimbilia Coding.

4.Hapo Black, yale yale unaruka ruka tu. Nisha sema atuhitaji kujua Coding ili tupate programs/software zenye uwezo wa kutatua matatizo yetu, ila tunapaswa kujua JINSI YA KUTAFUTA SOLUTIONS, na haya ya coding tuachie wengine.
by the way nani kakuambia Most coders have attended computer school ? mbona mimi nijuavyo wajuvi wengi hawajafika hata huko madarasani ya computer kwa huko kwenye maguru. hivi kwlei unaweza kuwa Guru wa language hata moja kwa kupoteza five/four/Three years studying rubish at computer class ambazo azikusaidii chochote kwenye coding?


Conclusion:
naona mada inapotea na kuzidi kutanuka, au mimi ndiye naipotosha, ila narudia tena nilivyoelewa mimi tunachohitaji ni solution za maisha yeu ya kila siku na hizi solution HATUHITAJI KUW AMAGURU KWENYE CODING KUZIPATA LETS BE GOOD ANALYSTA WA SOLUTIONS NA tuwapelekee coders wafanye, TZ hii hakuna coder anayeweza fanya better than them( watu na mshine zao/AI) tusiongopeane.

By the way home work to you tuambie kati ya Solution Analyst na huyo coder who get good pay ?

Ok let's go back to the topic at hand. My stand on this issue is that some people want coding in Tanzanian schools just because Tim Cook said so. To me I think this is a bad idea for one particular reasons: coding flourish in place where other subjects are taught very well. In other words, you can't neglect mathematics, natural language, science and social science subjects and then expect coding to do wonders for you.

As a matter of fact, many coders have taught themselves to code. Their masterly in natural languages has helped them to read coding materials. Their mathematics and science skills have assisted them in defining and refining solution steps. What I want to say is as a coder you flourish in an ecosystem.

Now if you closely examine the way education is dispense in Tanzania, you will find that it isn't a good place to nurture coders or for that matter critical thinkers or people who want to go deeper on their own. I might be wrong, but I believe Tanzanian education system is designed to prepare students to go to the next level by any means necessary. For example, if you in primary school, your goal is to go secondary school. If you are in primary school, your goal is to go to high school. And from high school, your aim is to go to university.

We go to school to gain knowledge. But school isn't the only place where an individual can acquire knowledge. As a matter of fact we gain much of our knowledge or the one we use to solve our daily problems outside classroom. For example, we go to library to read or borrow books. Here in the US, there's a library in every corner and the collections in these library cover wide range of subjects, including coding. Imagine what would have happened if Tanzanians could have access to libraries whenever they need them? Probably, we would have mastered a good number of disciplines. So you don't need to go to computer school to be a coder or for that matter a computer professional.

With respect to your last paragraph, I will say this. When it comes to financial gains, it all comes down to simple but powerful in economics theory: Supply and Demand. You can be a guru in coding, but if there's no demand for your skills, you might not getting paid. You might be a good solution analyst; however, if nobody who wants you solution, then you will not make it.

To me and many other coders, coding is an art form not necessary a trade. You do it because it gives you a very good sense of satisfaction.

 

[Mzuvendi]

Never will we be able to compete in coding , there other things of important to learn in computer which we can make it world wide than coding.

Ethiopians don't make their own brand of airplanes. However, that hasn't deterred them to compete with others. They created a world class airline enterprise using airplanes from various manufacturers.

What makes Ethiopian Airline great is the business model. Similarly, if Tanzanians can create a robust business model in computer industrial, they can compete with the best in the world. It can take time to do that. But it is doable if you apply visions and efforts which are sustainable.

 

[Kibanga Ampiga Mkoloni]

Ethiopians don't make their own brand of airplanes. However, that hasn't deterred them to compete with others. They created a world class airline enterprise using airplanes from various manufacturers.

What makes Ethiopian Airline great is the business model. Similarly, if Tanzanians can create a robust business model in computer industrial, they can compete with the best in the world. It can take time to do that. But it is doable if you apply visions and efforts which are sustainable.

That is reality am talking.
They never bothered to make their own plane, instead they take there time and make them self best in Air transport industries.

 

[Kibanga Ampiga Mkoloni]

Ok let's go back to the topic at hand. My stand on this issue is that some people want coding in Tanzanian schools just because Tim Cook said so. To me I think this is a bad idea for one particular reasons: coding flourish in place where other subjects are taught very well. In other words, you can't neglect mathematics, natural language, science and social science subjects and then expect coding to do wonders for you.

As a matter of fact, many coders have taught themselves to code. Their masterly in natural languages has helped them to read coding materials. Their mathematics and science skills have assisted them in defining and refining solution steps. What I want to say is as a coder you flourish in an ecosystem.

Now if you closely examine the way education is dispense in Tanzania, you will find that it isn't a good place to nurture coders or for that matter critical thinkers or people who want to go deeper on their own. I might be wrong, but I believe Tanzanian education system is designed to prepare students to go to the next level by any means necessary. For example, if you in primary school, your goal is to go secondary school. If you are in primary school, your goal is to go to high school. And from high school, your aim is to go to university.

We go to school to gain knowledge. But school isn't the only place where an individual can acquire knowledge. As a matter of fact we gain much of our knowledge or the one we use to solve our daily problems outside classroom. For example, we go to library to read or borrow books. Here in the US, there's a library in every corner and the collections in these library cover wide range of subjects, including coding. Imagine what would have happened if Tanzanians could have access to libraries whenever they need them? Probably, we would have mastered a good number of disciplines. So you don't need to go to computer school to be a coder or for that matter a computer professional.

With respect to your last paragraph, I will say this. When it comes to financial gains, it all comes down to simple but powerful in economics theory: Supply and Demand. You can be a guru in coding, but if there's no demand for your skills, you might not getting paid. You might be a good solution analyst; however, if nobody who wants you solution, then you will not make it.

To me and many other coders, coding is an art form not necessary a trade. You do it because it gives you a very good sense of satisfaction.

I conquer with you and this is my view and stand.

 

[TUJITEGEMEE]

I like this discussion. Natarajia watu wa wizara ya elimu,sayansi na tekinolojia nchini mwetu, Tanzania, watakuwa wamefutilia na wanaendelea kufuatilia mjadala huu kwa umakini mkubwa.