Poverty Elimination in Tanzania is a 'Result Oriented Business'



Mtazamaji,

Asante kwa hii kumbukumbu. Ninaipitia.
 

Eric:

Nashukuru kwa hii posti. Nitapitia zaidi wikiendi maana mambo mazito.
 
Hivi mkuu ulinisoma nyuma maana niliiweka hii vision ya IMF na sio Mkapa nikasema tumefungiwa kanyanga kiasi kwamba sisi tunafanya biashara ya Machinga. Vision hii haiwezi kuwa dawa ikiwa inatulazimisha sisi kufanya wayatakayo wawekezaji wa nje. It's exactly sawa na Mmachinga anavyofikiria kupitia kwa tajiri yake, machinga unayemwona barabani akiuza mali za wahindi na kila siku kwend akatika maduka yao kuwaambia walete nini kinatoka sana na kwa bei gani wao ndio waagize wakitazama faida yao kwanza. Je, ikifika 2025 tutakuwa na vision nyingine tena?

Nitarudia kusema hatuna vision isipokuwa iliyotokana na kufikiri kuna baadhi ya asilimia 33 ya Watanzania ndio maskini. Hapa tayari umeisha litenga Taifa kuwa sii vision ya Kitaifa bali tunajikita nguvu kubwa ktk MATATIZO yaliyopo it's more of a Mission to accomplish something. Vision 2025 isn't the foundation of our nation or basis of political philosophies, ila ni strategies za kichumi ku- tackle our problems not defending our freedom, who we are and wonna be. Tofauti na Dira, kama ukisoma Declaration of Independence ambayo inalitazama Taifa zima na watu wake na kusema sisi ni nani, haki zetu, Utaifa wetu, na tunaunda serikali kulinda vitu gani regardless of their view and vision. Kifupi hatuna Principles, ethics na moral standards to which the URT should strive..

Na ndio maana viongozi hawana uchungu kwa sababu hawajui haramu, fikra za kwamba tulikufa njaa kwa sababu nguruwe aliharamishwa sasa tunahalalisha. Hii imeturudisha kutawaliwa kiuchumi na wakoloni wale wale tuliowafukuza mwaka 1961 kwa sababu zile zile maana sitaki kuamini Uhuru wetu ulitokana na kubadilisha rangi za watawala toka wazungu kuwa watu weusi bali UCHUMI wetu kutawaliwa na wageni. Leo mkuu wangu tunatumia siasa kuhalalisha uwekezaji unaotawala uchumi wetu kama tulivyokuwa chini ya mkoloni kwa sababu tumendoa haramu.. Binafsi yangu naweza sema tena ingewezekana bora hata mkoloni angerudi na kututawala labda tungekuwa mbali sana. Haya ni mawazo ya mtu alopoteza dira na najijua vizuri kwamba sijui tunapokwenda ila tunapelekeshwa tu na hizi vision 2025.
 


Mkandara,

Nimekusikia unayosema. Lakini nina wasiwasi kuwa hukuchukua nafasi kuisoma VISION 2025. It's a very good document to read, and in fact supports your argument: The country has lost its direction (DIRA).

Let me quote one paragraph from the document:

"2.2.4 Ineffective Implementation Syndrome

Tanzanians have developed a propensity to prepare and pronounce plans and programmes, and ambitions which are not accompanied by
effective implementation, monitoring, and evaluation mechanisms. As a result, implementation has been weak. This situation has given
rise to the erosion of trust and confidence among the people on their leaders. It is evident that the people are now less enthusiatic about
participating in national endeavours. Apathy has set in." [Vision 2025]

Mkandara, nia yangu katika thread hii ilikuwa ni kuchangia mawazo ya kuonyesha kuwa tuna matatizo katika ngazi zote za utekelezaji. Tuna matatizo katika preparation, mpaka kwenye implementation.

Tukirudi kwenye hoja yako ya msingi kuhusiana declaration of independence, waMarekani walifanya kazi nzuri. Na nitaanzisha thread nyingine kuhusiana na hili jambo.

Kuhusiana na masuala mengine ya uchumi uliyozungumza, watanzania ndio wenye kuijua nchi yao na sio wataalamu wa World Bank or IMF. Lakini tukumbuke kuwa wanasiasa wote, hata Nyerere, siku zote wanatafuta njia nyepesi ya kuridhisha wapiga kura. Njia ya kwenda WB, IMF na kwa wahisani ni rahisi sana kuliko kuwaambia wananchi walipe kodi. Hivyo tusiwalaumu sana watu wa mataifa mengine na vyombo vya fedha vya kidunia wakati hatutaki kuchukua majukumu yetu.
 
Ninaamini kabisa kuwa the bottom line ya mjadala huu, ni kwamba hatukutakiwa kuwakimbiza wakoloni mapema.
 



Mtazamaji,
I have read the document. To tell you the truth, it’s a good work to read. However, I believe that after finishing their assignment, the authors have done exactly what ordinary Tanzanians expected them to do, doing nothing. Take for example this section in the document:

"2.2.4 Ineffective Implementation Syndrome

Tanzanians have developed a propensity to prepare and pronounce plans and programs, and ambitions which are not accompanied by effective implementation, monitoring, and evaluation mechanisms. As a result, implementation has been weak. This situation has given rise to the erosion of trust and confidence among the people on their leaders. It is evident that the people are now less enthusiastic about participating in national endeavors. Apathy has set in." [Vision 2025]

This document isn’t good one and we shouldn’t have expected it to be perfect when it was released. However, it would have served the country well if the authors had practiced what they preached.

Now regarding the targets of Vision 2025 which includes high Quality livelihood, good Governance and rule of law, and strong and competitive economy, I believe they should have done a better job than this because long term visions are costly and don’t work.

I think they should have prioritized national agenda, and apply short term policies to get measurable results, and leave the rest to the next generation of leaders and citizens.
 
jmushi1 said:
Ninaamini kabisa kuwa the bottom line ya mjadala huu, ni kwamba hatukutakiwa kuwakimbiza wakoloni mapema.
Click to expand...

That's not the problem. The problem is we try to re-invent the wheel. The colonial administrative structure wasn't perfect, but it worked very well and efficiently. We abolished it and we brought something new. Now I don’t know how many regions are in Tanzania.

The post-independence constitution wasn’t a perfect document, but it works somewhere else such as in India, and I don’t why African countries didn’t give the Westminster parliament system to a chance flourish.
 
watu wanarudi kujadili yaliyowekwa kwenye maandishi badala ya kutafuta njia practical za kukabiliana na matatizo yaliyopo
 
Raia Fulani said:
watu wanarudi kujadili yaliyowekwa kwenye maandishi badala ya kutafuta njia practical za kukabiliana na matatizo yaliyopo
Click to expand...

Nimuhimu kujadili yaliyokwenyemaadishila sivyo unaweza kwenda kama kipofu.nainawezekana tunawenda kama kipofu sababu Inawezekana JK naye ana VISION yake

Unless una assume yaliyo kwenye maandishi hayana tatizo. Lakini kabla ya kutafuta practical solution lazima kuwe na Plan. Ni ndani ya theory kama plan au DIRA au Budget ndio unatoewa muongozo ziwekwe hizo practical zitafanyikaje na zita pimwaje na wajibu wa kila mdau ( Mwamcnhi, serikali,viongozi, mabenki, etc ) .Na kutumia theroy na madishindio tunaweza kujipima kama tumefikia malengo au la na wapi tulikwama na nini kilikwamisha

Kuna msemo unasema Failure to plan ni plan to failure. Ukweli CCM ni tatizo lakini hata Vyama kama CDM cuf NCCR haviwezi kuleta maajabu sababu havina basic plan kama hizi dira. Wamejikita zaidi katika siasa

Vilevile
Inawezekana sisi hapa tunajadili Vision 2025 lakini Sio hata Waziri wa fedha PM au ma RC na na ma DC ofisini mwao wanazo hizi doc kuona maaumuzi wanayofanya yanendana au yantakeeza vipi DIRA hii


Zakumi na mimi nimesioma kweli Hii doc imesimama. Lakini wasiwasi wangu
  • Inatumika zaidi kuombea misaaada nje. Kwanini nasema hivyo? Sio wananchi wengi wako infomed. Kuna tofauti gani mama muuza vitumbua wa mwaka 1980 akitaka kuanzisha ka-kiwanda kadogoa kuoka mikate mitaani kwake. Je kuna sera inayoshinikiza Benki japo zitoe mikopo kwa Business starters.je kuna tasisi binafsi au za serikali kutoa ushauri kuhusu uwekezaji ina ushauri kwa wafanyabaabishara/wakulima wadogona wa kati????? How can we expect watu wato kwenye mawazo ya ujamaa?

Nimeona Document sehemu inaogelaa kuamsha na kuhamashisha ari ya watanzania. Lakini hakuna mazingiraya kuwezesha hilo.Kuna TIC.Hii ni taasisi imejikita zaidi kushughulikia wawekezaji wa nje .Basi kungekuwepo na RIC (Regional Investment center ) specific kwa ajili ya wazalendo wa nyumbani wenye mitaji midogo lakini Ideas fulani.

Ni rahisi zaidi kwa Richmond kupata mkopo benki ya CRDB kwa gurantee ya Serikali ya tanznia lakinini ngumu sana kwa mama ntilie apate mkopo au muongozo wa namna ya kuanzisha hoteli.

Kila mwaka kupitia serikaii za mkoa Seriali Ingechagua japo wajasirimali mali hata 10 wakuwa gurantee japo mikopo nafuu ya Milioni 10.

kuna watu watasema watanzania hatukopesheki lakini si kweli .wale wanaokpesheka nawenye uhitai wa kweli hawajafikiwa au kufikiriwa namna ya kuwezeshwa
 
jmushi1 said:
Ninaamini kabisa kuwa the bottom line ya mjadala huu, ni kwamba hatukutakiwa kuwakimbiza wakoloni mapema.
Click to expand...

Hivi ukweli ni kwamba tuliwfukuza wakoloni auwaimua KUndoka.Mi nadhani nchi amabazo ziikuwa strategic kwao na walitaka kubaki wabaki kama zimbwabwe

Lakini swali lingine ukisema mapema una maana gani? Walitakiwa waondoke 1980 kama zimbabwe? Mimi sidhani kama tatizo ni muda wa kuondoka . Kama ni tatziolabda ni siasa tulizofuata. Lakinivievile kama Ujama ndio tatizo then tunarudi kwenye mifano ya zimbwabwe na southafrica.
 
Mkuu Mtazamaji ,hatukuwa na wataalam wa kutosha kwenye almost kila kitengo muhimu kwa maendeleo yetu.Na kiukweli, Afrika peke yake ndipo wakoloni walijenga mahususi kwa kuwasaidia kuondoa malighafi na si kujenga na kuendeleza jamii.

Sehemu nyingine hizo alizozitaja Zakumi, hawakufanya hivyo, its just a matter of doing some research.Ukweli tulionewa on every aspect, sijui ni through kuchukiwa zaidi na "bwana mkubwa" ama nini.

Kitu kikubwa walichokuwa wakipiga kelele, hata kabla ya mwalimu kuanza, wapigania uhuru wengine, mfano kina Tom Mboya, miaka ya 195's alipohutubia kwenye mkuatano mmoja na Martin Luther King, alisema tatizo kubwa lililopo Afrika, hususan eastern part, ni ujinga, maradhi na umasikini.Nyakati hizo hata "uhuru" wenyewe si Kenya wala siye tuliokuwa nao.

Hilo ndo tatizo kubwa amongst others, waliyoyarithisha kwa watawala wetu hao wakoloni.

Kama elimu na huduma nyingine vilitolewa kwa upendeleo nk, then utaona ninaaminsha nini, kwasababu hata wengi kati ya waliopewa elimu, walikuwa ni mahsusi kuwasaidia wakoloni kutawala vyema zaidi, na wengi wao ndo waliowaachia madaraka baada ya kuondoka, elimu haikuwa pana sana kiasi cha kuwa na wananchi wengi ama Taifa lenye wananchi wengi waelewa.
 
jmushi1 said:
Mkuu Mtazamaji ,hatukuwa na wataalam wa kutosha kwenye almost kila kitengo muhimu kwa maendeleo yetu.Na kiukweli, Afrika peke yake ndipo wakoloni walijenga mahususi kwa kuwasaidia kuondoa malighafi na si kujenga na kuendeleza jamii.
Click to expand...

Hii sio sababu ya msingi. Resources can never be enough iwe NOrway iwe Chad. Tofauti ni PRIORITISATION ,Planning na puting plan into action . Ndio maana Kuna maneno kama bajeti,vipaumbele.

Hata UK kuna kipindi walikuwa wana upungufu hata wa watalam mbalimbali . Hata mataifa kama USA ya "upungufu" wa watalamu hadi Leo. Few months back nimesoma makala moja ikileza CIA ilivyo na uhaba wa wataaam wa kukabiiana na mambo ya Cyber crime na computer hacking . Wataalamu walikuwepo na wapo tatizo kinachotatizaau kilichotatiza ni
  • Chama kushika hatamu.Siasa kuchanganywa na utendaji. Wanachotakiwa wanasiasa sasa hivi ni wao kupendekeza sera tu then wawasikilze wataalum zile sera zaozitafanikishwa vipi au wapokee ushauri.

Hata baada ya mageuzi bado halii hii ipo sasa ukichangaaya na kiu ya Ubepari iliyopandikizwa ghafla na kwa haraka tena mbaya imepandikwizwa kwa wanasiasa zaidi na si wanachi

Sehemu nyingine hizo alizozitaja Zakumi, hawakufanya hivyo, its just a matter of doing some research.Ukweli tulionewa on every aspect, sijui ni through kuchukiwa zaidi na "bwana mkubwa" ama nini.
Click to expand...

Hahahah Mushi Hivi ina maana kule India au Pakistan waingereza walifanya nini cha zaidi kuliko walichofanya Tanzania au kenya na Uganda. Mambo ya "bwana Mkubwa" kama nimekupa ta teh teh inawezekana lakini nadhani kama anachukia kweli basi angewachukia wanaoruhusu ushoga na sisi akatuhurumia lol

Kitu kikubwa walichokuwa wakipiga kelele, hata kabla ya mwalimu kuanza, mfano kina Tom Mboya, hata alipohutubia na Martin Luther King, alisema tatizo kubwa lililopo ni ujinga, maradhi na umasikini
Click to expand...

Mwalimu angeweza kuiacha Tanzania better of kwa baadhi wa wachambuzi wa EUROCENTIC kama angeamua kuendelza mfumo uleule aliokuta. Yes tungekua tuna hata Flyover mbili tatu kama japo kama za cape town Lakini vievile tungekuwa na Slums kama zilizopo Guguethu cape town Slums hizo kabla hazijaboreshwa ukizoona huwezi kujua kama cape towon inayosifwa DUnia nzima kama jiji bora la africa ndio ile.So ukweli hata wangeendelea kubaki Tungekuwa na masaki residential area labda 10 lakini vile vile tungekuwa na slums za kumwaga. SO mi sikubaliani kuwa waliwai kuondoka


Sasa Jmushi kwa wao wakoloni kuchelwa kuondoka hili tatizo linge pungua au tungelichelewesha tu. ? Kwa kweli Tatizo au maskini wetu kwanza inatakiwa tujitambue
  • WHO are we?
  • What is our Country's strength, Wekness, Opportunity an Threat.
  • Priority yetu ni nini ? Mfano Kufufua ATCL vs Kufufua TRL au Kati ya Kuuza ATCL na kuuza TRL kipi kiuzwe kipi serikali iwe stakeholder mkuu.
  • Ni sahihi serikali kukaa pembeni katika uzalishaji?.Mbona BAE (Single big expoter wa UK) ni ya jeshi la UK sasa kwa nini sera ya kilimo kwanza JKT/JWTZ/ Magerezaa yasiwe na mashamba ya mifano mikoani na wilayani . Wanaotakiwa kuonyesha mfano wa uzalishaji wameishia kuuza tu triller Kitu ambacho hata masawe angeweza fanya

Week end njema ngoja nikapate serengeti uswazi
 
Mkuu, weekend njema pia, pata serengeti moja for me too mkuu.

Back to the topic, nakushauri ufanye a bit of research on this issue ili tuweze kuwa somewhat on a same page.

Hapa sijui hata nikujibu vipi, kwasababu tuko kwenye "different paradigms", so unaweza kuona how difficult it is.

If you wanna be able to look beyond, then you need to do some research on it, utakuta hata kuna weupe walioweka siri wazi kabisa kuhusiana na namna ambayo makoloni yalikuwa treated differently, tafuta info mkuu.Information is part of not only knowledge, but also freedom.

Kwenye kuchelewa kuondoka, tungewalazimisha walete maendeleo kutokana na looting waliyoifanya, tungetaka kuona kuwa si kwa Malkia tu ndiko kunakopata neema, tungetaka kuona wanaboresha mambo yote hayo ya kijamii ie roads bila kujali kama inapitisha raw materials etc, hospitals bila kujali kama maeneo hayo kuna wazungu, elimu bila kujali kwamba kama wananchi wakielimika, basi serikali ya kikoloni itakuwa matatani, pia kutokana na ukweli kwamba walivyochota havilingani na walivyovifanya huko walipovichota!

Weekend njema.
 

Jmushi,
Just because they left us with nothing, it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t learn and perfect our ways of doing businesses. Take for example China. They were colonized brutally by western nations. They had civil wars for many years until 1948. However, they rose to the occasion and took their chance. Tanzanians should do the same.

For many years, the list of names of individuals who take cabinet posts in Tanzania is very impressive. However, their ethics and performance is so bad as if the country is being run by uneducated fools. When will this stop?
 
Zakumi analysis yangu hiyo, haiakisi ama kureflect msimamo wangu, please understand the difference.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
jmushi1 said:
Zakumi analysis yangu hiyo, haiakisi ama kureflect msimamo wangu, please understand the difference.
Click to expand...

Jmushi1,

Thanks for clearing that up. I thought you are still dwelling on colonial issues, and use them as an execuse.
 
Kaka nimeisoma vizuri sana lakini unachoshindwa kukiona ni kwamba hii ni sawa na mission, ni ujenzi wa policies yaani zimetokana na makosa ya policies, uongozi na kadhalika hivyo hi ni tungo ya kitabu kama imeandikwa na mchumi lakini sii Mtanzania anyezungumzia Utaifa wa Watanzania.

Unajua nitarudia kusema kwamba adui mkubwa wa Umaskini wetu ni Umaskini wenyewe. Sawa na mtu alozaliwa uswazi na akafikiria njia pekee ya kuondokana na adha za Uswazi ni kuhama Uswazi ama kuibadilisha Uswazi iwe kama Masaki bila kujua kwamba unapoibalisha Uswazi kuwa Masaki wakazi wake hawataweza kuyamudu maisha ya Masaki. Huwezi fikiria long term strategy kwa mazingira wakati wananchi wako wanafikiria short term ili wa survive mlo wa siku hadi siku. Kinachotakiwa kubadilishwa ni WATU wenyewe kwanza ili wao ndio wawe chachu ya mabadiliko ya uswazi. Na ndio maana watu wengi waliikubali ile ya maisha bora kwa kila Mtanzania lakini hapakuwepo ukweli tulicholewa picha ukutani..

Vision 2025 ni vision ya kubalidisha mazingira sio watu wakati ni watu wanapokuwa civilized wanakuwa wabunifu wa huyabadilisha mazingira. Ukisoma kwa makini declaration of Independence inahusu WATU, Utaifa wao, uhuru wao, haki zao na huwezi kuuza Liberty ya Mmarekani kwa fedha ama jambo lolote. Kipande ulichokiweka hakizungumzii WATU, Uhuru wao na mfumo mzima utalinda vitu gani isipokuwa kuibadilisha Tanzania iwe kama nchi zilizoendelea ikiwaacha wananchi wenyewe nyuma wa catch up na mabadiliko hayo.
 

Mtazamaji,
When you posted the document I didn’t want to read it. But when I took some time to go through it, I realized that they know the challenges that face the country, and also they understand that there’s a stiff competition from regional and global competitors. They conclude that, therefore, Tanzania and its people can’t prosper socially and economically in isolation. This is indeed a valid point.

However, they fall very short in addressing what should be done. They approach the problem with the same old mentality used during the single party system, which expected people in authority to give orders and visions, and the rest of us to obey them. This is an outdated model, and it doesn’t surprise me why current government officials, opposition leaders, and civic leaders have forgotten about the document and its mission. A vision of the country, as Honorable Mkandara points out, should be a living document which enables people in different generations to interpret the vision according to their understanding.

Political, social and economic dynamics we face today are fluid and almost chaotic. So instead of giving their vision about the world which they aren’t going to live, the government should have instituted political reforms which would have put the destiny of the nation in the hands of its people. For example, the government should have initiated constitutional changes that allow private candidates to run for the office long time ago.

Now concerning investments, that wasn’t our original idea. It started when the World Bank and IMF pushed poor countries, Tanzania included, to open doors to foreign investors as a way to stimulate economic growth. With that in mind, rather than opening investment centers to assist indigenous population in their locales, it was easy for the government to launch TIC primary to wow foreigner investors who are shrewder in business and finance than Tanzanians. But again, it’s our mistakes. Since independence, nobody thought that indigenous could be prolific investors in their own backyards.

If the central government or the local ones want to promote their own people, there are million ways of doing that. But first they should have a clear plan which will induce economic growth, and foster sustainability. You can’t just throw money to people who want to drive Vx or live beyond their means.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Menu
Log in
Register
Cookies are required to use this site. You must accept them to continue using the site. Learn more…