Swali Rahisi: Nyerere aliwashughulikiaje Waganda "Illegals" wakati wa "chokochoko" Za Idi Amin?

Swali Rahisi: Nyerere aliwashughulikiaje Waganda "Illegals" wakati wa "chokochoko" Za Idi Amin?

JokaKuu; hawa wakimbizi ambao walipewa uraia na Kikwete kwa wingi hivyo walikuwa wapi katika Tanzania? (hili ni swali la mtego kuweka rekodi sawasawa)
Mzee Mwanakijiji,

..hao wakimbizi nadhani walikuwa Tabora, Rukwa, na Kigoma.

..walikuwepo muda mrefu toka mwaka 1972.

..kuna wengine walizaliwa hapa Tanzania.

..zoezi la namna hii limewahi kufanyika mwaka 2000, 2003, na 2006.

..kuna mpaka kamati za Tanzania na Rwanda kushughulikia tatizo hili la wahamiaji haramu toka Rwanda.

..swali la ziada: is it Rwandas government policy ku-encourage wananchi wake kuwa wahamiaji haramu, particularly to Tanzania??

cc Nguruvi3, Jasusi, Kobello, Ogah, rushasha, adolay, meningitis
 
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[h=2]More returnees received as Tz clamps down on Rwandans[/h]



1376089282front.jpg
A Rwandan family returns from Tanzania yesterday. Many Rwandans crossed the Rusumo border on the final day of the deadline set by the Tanzanian governent. Saturday Times/ Timothy Kisambira.
More than 500 Rwandans who had lived in Tanzania for years yesterday arrived at the Rusomo border post in Rwanda, leaving behind their families and properties in mainly Karagwe region.

Yesterday’s arrivals pushed the number of such returnees to 1,000 after Tanzanian authorities gave those they described as ‘illigal immigrants’ two weeks to leave the country.

The deadline passed yesterday and it remains unclear what the fate of those who were unable to beat it would be.

The evictees told Saturday Times that Tanzanian security personnel, including the army and police, as well as neighbours were combing the communities ordering everyone they perceive to be of Rwandan origin out of the country.

Some of the victims had lived in the east African country for more than 50 years.

Tanzanian authorities claim they are targeting those without ‘valid residential documents’ but some of those affected claim they had all the necessary documents – some alleged security agents had confiscated and destroyed them.

At the Rusomo border post yesterday visibly distressed mothers, children and elderly men arrived with mattresses, clothes and other household belongings.

Most of them said they were not given a chance to sell off their properties, especially land and cattle.

They said they were being targeted as Rwandans though Tanzanian officials at the border said the decision applied to all illegal immigrants in the country.

Some of the returnees had intermarried with Tanzanians but they were not spared either.

“I have left my seven children behind. My parents fled from Rwanda in 1959, I grew up in Tanzania and I got married to a Tanzanian. Yet they have not been considerate, they picked me out in the family and asked me to leave simply because I have Rwandan roots. This is so unfair and inhumane,” a weeping Mukarugwiza Kabudensiya said.

The 60-year old, who was evicted from Karagwe region, said she was too afraid for her children too. She said she cannot bare the pain of being separated from her family in a matter of days.

Kabudensiya knows no relative in Rwanda.

According to the returnees, it was total chaos during the expulsion, with security forces and locals killing their cattle and threatening whoever planned to stand in their way.

It also turned out that some of the victims are actually Tanzanians by birth.

Helping returnees

“My father is a Tanzanian from the Banyambo tribe and my mother is Rwandan. My father died and I have never been to Rwanda before. I don’t know why I am being persecuted by my compatriots,” said a 23-year old man, who only identified himself as Emanuel.

He spoke in Kiswahili and does not understand Kinyarwanda.

At the border, officials from the Ministry for Disaster Management and Refugees Affairs, the Eastern Province and other partners worked the whole day yesterday as more people continued to arrive.

Emanuel Maherane, a senior official at the Tanzanian immigration office at the border, said the eviction targeted all illegal migrants, and not only Rwandans.

“Their residence permits expired and they have no right to remain in Tanzania. We have expelled Burundians, Ugandans, Rwandans, and even whites,” the official claimed.

He said his government started conducting a survey to ascertain all the illegal settlers since 2003 and it was the right time to push them out. “This is internal issue, we don’t need to inform anybody. It’s a Tanzanian affair.”

Maherane added: “Whether you have been around for 70 years, whether you are married or not, our laws are clear, it’s not about how much time you have lived in Tanzania or who you are married to.”

The returnees said they were caught unawares and that their eviction came immediately after Tanzanian President, Jakaya Kikwete visited the region a few days ago.

Emanuel Mpakaniye, a returnee, dismissed the suggestion that only illegal immigrants had been expelled.

“I had a residential permit and all the other necessary documents but I was banished,” he said.

On the Rwandan side of the border, officials and volunteers were putting up tents to help resettle the returnees in Kiyanzi transit centre, in Eastern Province.

“We are providing those who are returning basic needs like water, food and temporary shelter. We are also transporting those who happen to have relatives in different parts of the country,” Jean Claude Rwahama, the director of refugee affairs in the Ministry of Disaster Management and Refugee Affairs, said.

He said government would provide shelter to those without relatives in the country.

It is expected that an estimated 20,000 people, may be on their way to Rwanda.

On Thursday, Foreign affairs minister and Government spokesperson, Louise Mushikiwabo, reassured Tanzanians living in Rwanda to feel at home despite the latest developments.


Contact email: eric.kabera[at]newtimes.co.rw

The result of stupid utterences from a loose mouthed president, Kagame.
We Tanzanians dont talk much but he should be careful next time when he opens his gob.
We have bee harbouring your problems silently for years on end.
 
Waende kwao, hao ni waamiaji haramu. Hizi huruma zenu za kijinga za kuongozwa na hisia, zitatuponza na zimetuponza. Uraia sio kitu cha kutoa kama Ice cream. Kama kuwapa huo uraia mmewapa wengi sana hao sasa inatosha.
TUSIRUDIE KUTOA URAIA KWA WATU HOHEHAHE KAMA HAO, KWANI NI MZIGO KWA TAIFA LETU.
 
Wanatucheka sana na kujisifu mno eti wameendelea kuliko sisi na ubabe juu. Alafu kuna mijitu inajifanya inahuruma ya kugawa uraia. Hao ni watu wa Skeleton Kagame ahangaike nao yeye mwenyewe Au awape wakenya aliowapa dili la kutumia badari yao.
HAKUNA NCHI DUNIANI UNAWEZA KUINGIA BILA KUULIZWA, HUKU UNASWAGA NG'OMBE ISIPOKUWA TANZANIA.
Hakuna nchi katika Africa iliogawa uraia kwa wakimbizi wengi kama TANZANIA.
FAIDA TUNAYO IPATA LEO NI KUTUKANIWA RAIS WETU.
 
Hivi mkuu una uhakika gani sisi watanzania tunaoishi nje wote ni watu safi?[sio majambazi,wauza unga,].ungenipa data za crime huko rwanda labda ningekubali.Pia ujue kuna watanzania wa kuzaliwa ambao wamerudi Rwanda.Na unajua sheria yetu hapa mtu akizaliwa hapa nchini ni raia wa hapa Tanzania,sasa husije ukafikiri idadi ya watanzania waliokuwa huko ni kiasi fulani.Kwa jinsi ninavyokuangalia na kukusoma wewe unaangalia waamiaji kwenye mipaka tu wala ujajua wapo wengine kwenye mikoa yetu yote.Kwani hao wachina ,wairan na wengine wanao fanya biashara Tanzania wote wana vibali vya kufanyia kazi?na wanalipia kila mwezi vibali vyao?.Watanzania sisi mara zote tunafake kuwa sisi ni watu wazuri.naweza kusema ilikuwa zamani.Ujambazi upo na sio rahisi kujua nani ni jambazi kati yetu.Kwa nini hili zoezi la kuwaamisha watu lisifanyike siku za nyuma?naomba unijibu.Na kwa nini amesema taasisi zote za dola zitakwenda huko Bukoba na kusafisha hao waamiaji.Sikusikia kama amesema kuwa hivyo vyombo vya dola vitajipaka nchi nzima kuakikisha waamiaji wanatolewa.Yeye kasema atapeleka hivyo vyombo vya dola huko Kagera.Mimi sijafurahia maneno aliyoyatoa Kagame.Mimi nasikitika mtu aliyekuwa msuluhishi katika maziwa makuu ,sasa ameonekana kumbe sio smart.anakurupuka na alikwenda Bukoba kuongea na wananchi huko.Ningemwona smart kama ningesikia Rais Kikwete na viongozi wengine wamekutana close door sehemu fulani hata kama walichoongea nisingekifahamu ningejua kiongozi wetu ni smart.Kwa kufanya hivyo sio kwamba tunamwogopa Kagame hapana.Ni kwamba sisi hatukurupuki.Hakuna mtu hasiejua kama Tanzania ina uzoefu wa kupigana vita.Ninachosema yule Rwanda ni kama mdogo wetu.Lakini kwa kurushiana maneno bila ya kukutaka kaka na mdogo wake nani ameonekana anachekesha.Ni kaka au mdogo wake?.Watanzania hatutaki vita .tuna vita nyingi ndani ya hii nchi hatujamaliza.[tatizo la madarasa,watoto kutokuwa na madaftari,kilimo,maji safi,afya.]na mengine mengi kama rumbesa hivi hatujamaliza.Tumegundua gesi na madini mengine acha pesa zake zielekezwe kwenye vita muhimu za ndani ya nchi.kule kwa kagame tutakaa mezani tu ,sio issue kubwa kabisaa.MUNGU TUEPUSHE NA VITA NA UTUPE HEKIMA NA BUSARA YA KUAMUA AU KUTATUA MIGOGORO KWENYE MEZA NA SIO KUINGIZA NCHI VITANI.AMEN
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji,

..hao wakimbizi nadhani walikuwa Tabora, Rukwa, na Kigoma.

..walikuwepo muda mrefu toka mwaka 1972.

..kuna wengine walizaliwa hapa Tanzania.

..zoezi la namna hii limewahi kufanyika mwaka 2000, 2003, na 2006.

..kuna mpaka kamati za Tanzania na Rwanda kushughulikia tatizo hili la wahamiaji haramu toka Rwanda.

..swali la ziada: is it Rwandas government policy ku-encourage wananchi wake kuwa wahamiaji haramu, particularly to Tanzania??

cc Nguruvi3, Jasusi, Kobello, Ogah, rushasha, adolay, meningitis

While at it ningependa kuuliza swali jingine: Ni Wanyarwanda wangapi na Warundi waliopewa uraia wakati wa Mwalimu Nyerere? Naona jinsi watu wanavyosifia hapa kutimuliwa kwa Wanyarwanda I am really ashamed to be a Tanzanian.
 
Hivi mkuu una uhakika gani sisi watanzania tunaoishi nje wote ni watu safi?[sio majambazi,wauza unga,].ungenipa data za crime huko rwanda labda ningekubali.Pia ujue kuna watanzania wa kuzaliwa ambao wamerudi Rwanda.Na unajua sheria yetu hapa mtu akizaliwa hapa nchini ni raia wa hapa Tanzania,sasa husije ukafikiri idadi ya watanzania waliokuwa huko ni kiasi fulani.Kwa jinsi ninavyokuangalia na kukusoma wewe unaangalia waamiaji kwenye mipaka tu wala ujajua wapo wengine kwenye mikoa yetu yote.Kwani hao wachina ,wairan na wengine wanao fanya biashara Tanzania wote wana vibali vya kufanyia kazi?na wanalipia kila mwezi vibali vyao?.Watanzania sisi mara zote tunafake kuwa sisi ni watu wazuri.naweza kusema ilikuwa zamani.Ujambazi upo na sio rahisi kujua nani ni jambazi kati yetu.Kwa nini hili zoezi la kuwaamisha watu lisifanyike siku za nyuma?naomba unijibu.Na kwa nini amesema taasisi zote za dola zitakwenda huko Bukoba na kusafisha hao waamiaji.Sikusikia kama amesema kuwa hivyo vyombo vya dola vitajipaka nchi nzima kuakikisha waamiaji wanatolewa.Yeye kasema atapeleka hivyo vyombo vya dola huko Kagera.Mimi sijafurahia maneno aliyoyatoa Kagame.Mimi nasikitika mtu aliyekuwa msuluhishi katika maziwa makuu ,sasa ameonekana kumbe sio smart.anakurupuka na alikwenda Bukoba kuongea na wananchi huko.Ningemwona smart kama ningesikia Rais Kikwete na viongozi wengine wamekutana close door sehemu fulani hata kama walichoongea nisingekifahamu ningejua kiongozi wetu ni smart.Kwa kufanya hivyo sio kwamba tunamwogopa Kagame hapana.Ni kwamba sisi hatukurupuki.Hakuna mtu hasiejua kama Tanzania ina uzoefu wa kupigana vita.Ninachosema yule Rwanda ni kama mdogo wetu.Lakini kwa kurushiana maneno bila ya kukutaka kaka na mdogo wake nani ameonekana anachekesha.Ni kaka au mdogo wake?.Watanzania hatutaki vita .tuna vita nyingi ndani ya hii nchi hatujamaliza.[tatizo la madarasa,watoto kutokuwa na madaftari,kilimo,maji safi,afya.]na mengine mengi kama rumbesa hivi hatujamaliza.Tumegundua gesi na madini mengine acha pesa zake zielekezwe kwenye vita muhimu za ndani ya nchi.kule kwa kagame tutakaa mezani tu ,sio issue kubwa kabisaa.MUNGU TUEPUSHE NA VITA NA UTUPE HEKIMA NA BUSARA YA KUAMUA AU KUTATUA MIGOGORO KWENYE MEZA NA SIO KUINGIZA NCHI VITANI.AMEN

umesema vema mwanamazingira
 
Mkuu asante sana kwenye hiyo quote hapo juu.........unajua watu wanazungumzia unafiki nafikiri hawajui maana ya unafiki......mtu huwezi kujinafiki.......bali unanafikiwa....hawajui unafiki wa baadhi ya majirani zetu (na hasa Rwanda).............all these shenanigans....it was just a matter of time........now time is telling.....watu wanapiga mayowe hapa.......kweli inashangaza sana........

Inashangaza kwa kuwa.......baadhi ya watu hapa wanataka kutuambia........eti kwa kuwa tuna matatizo 1,2,3,4.....then tusithubutu kukabiliana na tatizo 5, 6,and 7........hii akili sijui ni ya wapi.......kwenye muktadha huu sijui wanatumia sayansi gani kwamba usipotatua hili tatizo usitatue lile......otherwise eti ni unafiki!!........wanatumia neno unafiki pasipo.......

Wakuu Kobello , JokaKuu and masopakyindi heko kwa michango murua so far kwenye hii issue......
Mkuu kuna watu akili zimewazidi.
Lakini akili hizo haziwafikishi mwisho wa safari zao.

Hawaelewi kuwa for a long time Kagame had it coming, alijidai kucheza hard ball katika hii interlacustrine region ambayo na sisi Tanzania ni sphere yetu ya influence.
Kwamba Tanzania haija itumia hiyo clout yake sehemu hizo, kuna viongozi wajinga waliichukulia kuwa ni sign of weakness, kiasi cha kudiriki kumtukana kiongozi wetu JK

Mbaya zaidi ni kiongozi huyo ambaye siri zake za mauaji zinafahamika vile vilr kifiriki kusems atsmdhuru kiongozi wetu kimwili.

Naona ni mtu mjinga tu asiyeweza kuona kuwa Kagame alikuea anacheza mchexo unao hitaji majibu anayoweza kuelewa kinagaubaga.
Pamoja na vitisho vya wakimbizi ambao huko DRC wamejigeuza kuwa M23, somo hili nashangaa watu wanapungukiwa na akili ya kulielewa.

Namsapoti Jk 100% kwa kulichukulia tatizo la Kagame bila papara na kwa uvumilivu.
 
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While at it ningependa kuuliza swali jingine: Ni Wanyarwanda wangapi na Warundi waliopewa uraia wakati wa Mwalimu Nyerere? Naona jinsi watu wanavyosifia hapa kutimuliwa kwa Wanyarwanda I am really ashamed to be a Tanzanian.
Mkuu Jasusi kwanza nikuulize, kwani ubaya wa zoezi hili ni upi? Yaani tatizo lake ni nini hadi ujisikie ashamed
 
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Mkuu Jasusi kwanza nikuulize, kwani ubaya wa zoezi hili ni upi? Yaani tatizo lake ni nini hadi ujisikie ashamed
Ndugu yangu, I feel ashamed kuona Waafrika wenzetu, majirani, wakibeba virago vyao kurudi kwao wakati Wasomali, Wahindi, Wapakistani wazungu na Wachina wakila sahani moja na viongozi wa CCM na hawa tunawaona eti ni watu wanaotuletea neema. Nenda Rufiji leo uone ni Wasomali wangapi wamenunua ardhi kule. Mwalimu angekuwa hai hivi leo naye angeona aibu eti tunawatimua Wanyarwanda just because Kikwete ana beef na Kagame. It is a shame. Kweli Tanzania ya Julius Nyerere imefika hapo?
 
Wakimbizi walikuwepo hata kabla ya kupishana kwa kauli za viongozi wetu (suala la kutekwa magari nimelisikia tangu miaka ya 85's nilipokuwa nasafiri kwenda pande za biharamulo) na tuwe wawazi hapa hatetewi mtu na hakuna mtu aliye kamili chini ya jua (labda uwe muumini wa kauli ya kuwa kiongozi hakosei ila anaangushwa na wasaidizi wake), unaweza ukatoa ushauri kwa nia njema lakini ukajikuta umecross the line kwa yule unaye mpa ushauri (kwa mtazamo wake). Jk anahaki ya kuhami mipaka ya taifa letu lakini wakimbizi hawa hawajafika hivihivi tu bila ya msaada wa watendaji walio kwenye serikali anayoiongoza, je amewachukulia hatua gani maana ushahidi uko wazi na si kuonyeshana kuwa nimeshika mpini nawe umeshika makali.
 
Kuwafukuza wageni has never been utamaduni wa Mtanzania, we are too smart to be barbaric. Serikali ijirekebishe.

Kuwafukuza wahamiaji haramu ni historia ya Tz tangia baada ya uhuru. Ukiacha collective nationalization ya Nyerere kwa wanyarwanda wengine wote wamekuwa wakiishi kwa taabu Tz. Kabla ya kuundwa kwa makambi ya Tabora na Katavi, kulikuwa na killings na kurudishwa hata katika nchi za vita na serikali ya Nyerere. Kisha serikali ya Mwinyi imerudisha wote warundi, wanyarwanda na wakongomani toka mikoa hii hii tunayoisema ukiacha Geita ambayo haukuwa mkoa lakini baadhi kutoka maeneo ya Chato waliathirika (Lyatonga ni shahidi hata miaka ya 1987 anajua alipewa nini Bujumbura na akarudi akaswaga hata waha kwa kusema lazima warudi kwao) walipofika mipakani wakakuta wengine si tu waha bali ni wachaga wanaoonekana kama watu fulani wa Burundi na hivyo wakarudi Kgm na kukimbilia Himo kwao. Miaka ya 90 walisindikizwa kwa helkopta kuhakikisha hawaendi sehemu nyingine ila Rwanda (na hawa walikuwa ni sehemu ya hao Kagame anaosema ni Interahamwe waliokuwa wamefika maeneo ya Benako kusalimisha maisha baada ya mauaji ya kimbari (nasita kusema nani alifanya mauaji ya kimbari kwa kuwa historia siku zote inashughulika na mshindi) lakini tunajua historia inashughulika na mshindi na si vinginevyo. Miaka hiyo hiyo ya 90 wakati wa Mkapa wakongomani wa mwambaoni mwa ziwa Tanganyika nao walikumbwa na dhahama hiyo hiyo. Labda suali lisiwe kuwa kuna waliolengwa katika tamko la JK maana alisema wahamiaji haramu wote wala hajasema wanyarwanda, ila walioamua kutekeleza agizo la raisi ni wanyarwanda. Sasa mwisho
 
Mkuu pengine wewe ulikuwa bado kinda mwaka 1972 hadi 1978 ilipoanza vita rasmi na Idi Amin.
Nyerere alifanya kosa la kimsingi kutochukua hatua ya ku- contain the fith column.
Hata hivyo by mwaka 1978/79 somo lilikuwa limeshaeleweka baada ya Amin kuingia Kagera kama nyumbani kwake.
Mwalimu aliwakusanya kina Oyite Ojok na hata kina Museveni, waganda, wakapigane kwa ajili y ao wenyewe na kwa ajili ya Tanzania.

JK kafanya kweli, ni lazima adui ajulikane toka mwanzo kwa vile ameshajitanabahisha toka mapema, pa kupiga paeleweke mapema.
Kama mtu anafikiri kutukanwa na kutishiwa maisha kwa mkuu wa nchi na bado mtu ukachekelea kama huna akili nxuri, basi hata a
yekutukana atajua kuwa wewe ni zuzu.
1959 wakati wimbi la kwanza linaanza kuingia Tanganyika wewe ulikuwaq na umri gani?
 
Tatizo la Mwanakijiji ni kutokuijua Tanzania vizuri.

Yaani macho yake yameishia kuona kwamba wahamiaji haramu ni swala linalohusu chokochoko za kagame. Hujui kabisa kuwa Tanzania kuna sehemu huwezi kusafiri bila escort ya polisi kwa sababu ya wahamiaji haramu.

Hivi hao waganda unaowazungumzia walikuwa wanazuia watanzania kufanya movements zao nchini kwao?

Kumchukia kwako Kikwete kunakufanya kila analosema au kulifanya utafute jinsi ya kulipinga!

By the way, unapomlinganisha Nyerere na Kikwete unataka kujustify nini???

Chuki itakupeleka kubaya Mwanakijiji.
Una maana ujangiri unaotendeka nchini unatendwa na wahamiaji haramu? You could do better.
 
Hivi mnajua kwanini tulipigana?
Je kimyakimya manajua nini kiliendelea au?

Tuwe kweli Nyerer hakuwafukuza kwa kuwa aliwaitaji, By the way IDD Amin sio chizi Historia inapotoshwa akukurupuka tu kuja kuipiga Kagera, Idd amin akuja Ku-BOMB makambi ya waaasi amabyo tulikuwa Tunayafadhili na tulipigana ili kuimarisha HIMa/TUSI Empire Kumuweka Kagame madarakani na Kagame madarakani thats all.

Tusingeweza kuwafukuza kwa kuwa waliitajika kupigana dhidi ya IDD AMIN.
I have read som ---- but yours takes prise.
 
MMM umewahi kutekwa na hao jamaa?je unajua mapori ya biharamulo ngara na karagwe si salama na wahamiaji haramu ndio wamejaa huko?Rais aliwaamuru kutokana na uhalifu wanaofanya na si eti alipize kisasi kwa Kagame!

Sent from my BlackBerry 9220 using JamiiForums

Una ushahidi gani kuwa waliokuteka (kama kweli ulitekwa) walikuwa ni wahamiaji haramu? Ulimboka alitekwa na wahamiaji haramu? Mabasi ya kutoka mikoani hayaruhusiwi kuondoka morogoro kuelekea Dar baada ya saa sita usiku - je nayo yanazuiwa kwa sababu ya majangiri wahamiaji haramu?
 
Ndugu yangu, I feel ashamed kuona Waafrika wenzetu, majirani, wakibeba virago vyao kurudi kwao wakati Wasomali, Wahindi, Wapakistani wazungu na Wachina wakila sahani moja na viongozi wa CCM na hawa tunawaona eti ni watu wanaotuletea neema. Nenda Rufiji leo uone ni Wasomali wangapi wamenunua ardhi kule. Mwalimu angekuwa hai hivi leo naye angeona aibu eti tunawatimua Wanyarwanda just because Kikwete ana beef na Kagame. It is a shame. Kweli Tanzania ya Julius Nyerere imefika hapo?
Jasusi,

..hili zoezi liliwahi kuendeshwa mwaka 2000, 2003, na 2006.

..kuna mpaka research papers zimeandikwa kuhusu tatizo la wahamiaji haramu wa Rwanda nchini kwetu.

..kwanini watu hawa wanaendelea kurudi huku Tanzania? ina maana hawana taarifa kwamba haturuhusu wahamiaji haramu? je, serikali ya Rwanda ina-encourage raia wake wasiheshimu mipaka na sheria za uhamiaji za Tanzania??

cc murutongore, enviromental, Mzee Mwanakijiji, Ogah, adolay,
 
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Mkuu Jasusi kwa muda nafatilia mkasa na sitofahamu inayoendelea kwamba Shekhe ponda kapigwa risasi.

Nitarejea baada ya muda, kwasasa nipo kwenye uzi kumhusu ponda.
 
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