Tanzania SGR Bridges vs Kenyan

Kafrican said:

Hata sisi mbali na bujeti tunapanga kuongeza hadi 3000MW by 2020....

Alafu hapo Tanzania SGR ya tz kutoka dar hadi mwanza ni at least $7B ...

SGR ya kenya itakua na urefu wa hadi 1,109 km, ya Tanzania ni about 1,224km hadi mwanza.

Mbali na umeme unafaa uangalie mambo mengine ya technical details ndo itajua tofauti inatokana wapi...
Kwa mfano reli ya Tz inajengwa ikitarajiwa kusafirisha kati ya 17-20 tonnes pa wakati ya kenya inatarajiwa kusafitisha 22million-35 million tonnes pa.

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Mbona hujibu swali?, pia uwe na update information, mwanzoni ilikua gharama ni $7.6B ambazo zingetolewa toka china, lakini Magufuli aliona ni ghali akakataa mkopo, sasa hivi makadirio ni $6.3B hadi Mwaza, sasa hivi kwa 541Km ambayo ni nusu ya urefu wote imegharimu $3.1B, kwa hiyo futa hiyo $7B, ni hesabu za kizamani sana

Kumbuka hii ni Elecrical, high speed, high capacity(10,000 tonnes per trip), ile ya Kenya ni 4,000 tonnes per trip, full automatic(Controller aliyepo control room at Dar, anaweza kupunguza mwendo, kuisimamisha, au kuiondoa train kadri anavyoona inafaa kama dereva hafuati sheria), reli yake ni continuos haina joints, hivyo kuwa na smooth movement bila kelele za mataruma ya reli na train, kwa kifupi ni very superior ukilinganisha na Kenya.

Lakini point yangu muhimu ni utofauti mkubwa wa gharama uliopo kati ya Kenya na Tanzania, almost double the price, is it ok for you?, hamuoni hizo pesa zingeokolewa kufanya mambo mengine, kwa sababu kwa mwendo huu wa kutodhibiti kukopa na zaidi ya 50% ya bajeti kulipa mishahara, 19% ya bajeti, kulipia madeni ambayo yanazidi kuongezeka, only 27% ndiyo bajeti ya maendeleo, kama mtaendelea kukopa inakadiriwa by 2018/2019 deni litafikia 60% Kutoka la hivi sasa 56%, ambapo 25% itatumika kulipa madeni na 24% tu itabaki kuwa bajeti ya maendeleo, nchi itaanza kushindwa kutoa huduma za msingi, au itazuiliwa kukopa

REDEEMER. said:

Nikupe tu taarifa saivi construction ipo in action bandari ya Dar expansion two times, Mtwara rebuild and expansion right now, Tanga rebuild and expansion right now for Uganda pipeline, Nyasa two bigger vessels already in operation for logistics, one for passengers in building right now, lake Tanganyika Kigoma port extension and EPZ building in building right now, Mwanza biggest ship for passengers and logistics to be built next year

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Mombasa port imefanywa expansion ya $1.2B! Hivi tuongeavyo kuna kandarasi mpya ya $350m kuongeza berth number 23 , Lamu nayo ndo hio ina inuka, Kule lake victoria mtatujua sisi ni nani, bandari la kisumu likikamilika, he!

For East African railway aspiration:

Top ten fastest trains in the world
Europeans and Asians currently operate the fastest high speed trains in the world, regularly commuting on trains such as the Shanghai Maglev and Harmony CRH 380A. While these two currently hold all the records, other fast trains, such as the HEMU-400X, Zefiro 380 and Talgo Avril, are close contenders for the crown of world's fastest trains. Railway-technology.com lists the top ten fastest trains currently in service.

Shanghai Maglev

Shanghai Maglev tops the list with its maximum operational speed of 430km/h and average speed of 251kmph. The Maglev started commercial operations in April 2004.

It runs on the 30.5km Shanghai Maglev Line, which is the first commercially operated high-speed magnetic levitation line, extending from Longyang Road Station of Metro Line 2 and ending at Shanghai Pudong International Airport.

Shanghai Maglev is owned and operated by Shanghai Maglev Transportation Development Co. (SMTDC). The train was constructed by a joint venture of Siemens and ThyssenKrupp.




Harmony CRH 380A

Harmony CRH 380A, with maximum operational speed of 380kmph, is currently the second fastest operating train in the world. The electric multiple unit (EMU) set a record by speeding at 486.1kmph during its trial operation on the Shanghai-Hangzhou intercity high-speed railway in December 2010.

The CRH 380A was put into operation in October 2010. It operates from Beijing to Shanghai and provides daily service along Wuhan to Guangzhou route. The vibration free train was constructed by CSR Qingdao Sifang Locomotive & Rolling Stock. Its high design speed is a result of research carried out at various Chinese universities.




AGV Italo

AGV Italo is the first train in the AGV Series which entered into service in April 2012. It has a maximum operational speed of 360kmph. The train is fitted with traction system that broke a record speed of 574.8kmph in April 2007.

Considered to be the most modern train in Europe, AGV Italo was built by Alstom. The train currently runs on the Napoli - Roma - Firenze - Bologna - Milano corridor. The train complies with the European TSI interoperability standard, which includes safety, reliability and availability, health, environmental protection and technical compatibility.




Siemens Velaro E / AVS 103

Velaro E, designated as AVE S 103 in Spain, is the fastest series-production high-speed train in the world. It achieved a whopping speed of about 400kmph during its test trips in Spain. The train possesses an operational speed of 350kmph.

The train was ordered by Spanish National Railways Renfe, and operates on the Barcelona-Madrid line. It was delivered in July 2005 and began operations in June 2007. The design of the multiple-unit train was founded on the latest developments of the successful ICE 3 trainset designed for Deutsche Bahn.




Talgo 350 (T350)

Talgo 350, which initially entered service with the name RENFE AVE Class 10, achieved a maximum speed of 365kmph during its trial run. The train has a maximum operational speed of 350kmph. T350 was developed by Patentes Talgo (Tren Articulado Ligero Goicoechea Oriol) and manufactured by Patentes Talgo in collaboration with Bombardier Transportation.

Commonly known as El Pato (meaning The Duck in Spanish), the train has been operating on the Madrid-Zaragoza-Lleida section of the Madrid-Barcelona line in Spain since 2005. There are currently more than 46 operating trains of the series in the country.




E5 Series Shinkansen Hayabusa

E5 Series Shinkansen Hayabusa trains, which entered service in March 2011, with an initial maximum speed of 300km now run on the Tohoku Shinkansen Line with a maximum operating speed of 320kmph.

Currently the fastest in Japan, the train achieved a speed of about 400kmph during trials. The train was manufactured by Kawasaki Heavy Industry (KHI) and Hitachi, while East Japan Railway Company (JR East) is the operator.

The train features full active suspension (FSA) system, which reduces the vibration of the moving bogies, and a 15m long nose which reduces the sound blast in tunnels.




Alstom Euroduplex

Alstom-built Euroduplex is the third generation of TGV Duplex, which entered service in December 2011. The trains in the series are touted to be the only double-decker, interoperable high-speed trains capable of running on European networks at 320kmph.

The Euroduplex was initially introduced on the Rhine-Rhone LGV high-speed rail line. The train is capable of transporting 1,020 passengers (multiple units), compared to TGV Duplex which transports about 512 passengers.

Euroduplex trains are designed to operate on French, German, Swiss and Luxembourgish rail networks. They are equipped with traction systems adapted to different electric currents used across Europe. Some of the trains in the series will also be capable of operating in Spain.




TGV Duplex

TGV Duplex was manufactured from 1996-2004. They are operated by SNCF and were manufactured by Alstom and Bombardier. The trains can reach maximum speeds of 300kmph to 320kmph.

TGV Duplex is Alstom's first third-generation double-decker/duplex train. It provides a seating space for 512 passengers in its upper and lower decks. The train is constructed of aluminium to reduce weight.

The trains in the TGV Duplex series mainly run on the TGV Méditerranée line between Paris and Marseille. More than 450 TGV series trains are currently serving 230 destinations.




ETR 500 Frecciarossa Trains

Elettro Treno Rapido 500 (ETR 500) Frecciarossa trains entered into service in 2008. The trains are designed for a maximum speed of 360kmph and currently run at 300kmph on high speed lines.

The Frecciarossa (Red Arrow) is a renovated version of the ETR 500. The renovated trains operate between Rome and Milan. The cars are equipped with climate control and sound insulation, and feature ergonomic seats to provide maximum comfort.

The trains in the fleet are operated by Trenitalia and manufactured by TREno Veloce Italiano (TREVI), a consortium of Alstom, Bombardier and AnsaldoBreda.




THSR 700T

The THSR 700T operates on the high-speed line between Taipei and Kaohsiung in Taiwan. The train entered into service with Taiwan High Speed Rail in January 2007.

It operates at a speed of 300kmph reducing the journey time between the two cities from four hours to just 90 minutes.

It was constructed by Kawasaki, Hitachi and Nippon Sharyo. Based on Kawasaki's 700 series Shinkansen trains, the 700T was the first Taiwanese rolling stock to import Japanese high speed rail technology.

The total investment for manufacturing the initial 30 trains in the series reached about NT$100bn ($3.4bn).

joto la jiwe said:

Mbona hujibu swali?, pia uwe na update information, mwanzoni ilikua gharama ni $7.6B ambazo zingetolewa toka china, lakini Magufuli aliona ni ghali akakataa mkopo, sasa hivi makadirio ni $6.3B hadi Mwaza, sasa hivi kwa 541Km ambayo ni nusu ya urefu wote imegharimu $3.1B, kwa hiyo futa hiyo $7B, ni hesabu za kizamani sana

Kumbuka hii ni Elecrical, high speed, high capacity(10,000 tonnes per trip), ile ya Kenya ni 4,000 tonnes per trip, full automatic(Controller aliyepo control room at Dar, anaweza kupunguza mwendo, kuisimamisha, au kuiondoa train kadri anavyoona inafaa kama dereva hafuati sheria), reli yake ni continuos haina joints, hivyo kuwa na smooth movement bila kelele za mataruma ya reli na train, kwa kifupi ni very superior ukilinganisha na Kenya.

Lakini point yangu muhimu ni utofauti mkubwa wa gharama uliopo kati ya Kenya na Tanzania, almost double the price, is it ok for you?, hamuoni hizo pesa zingeokolewa kufanya mambo mengine, kwa sababu kwa mwendo huu wa kutodhibiti kukopa na zaidi ya 50% ya bajeti kulipa mishahara, 19% ya bajeti, kulipia madeni ambayo yanazidi kuongezeka, only 27% ndiyo bajeti ya maendeleo, kama mtaendelea kukopa inakadiriwa by 2018/2019 deni litafikia 60% Kutoka la hivi sasa 56%, ambapo 25% itatumika kulipa madeni na 24% tu itabaki kuwa bajeti ya maendeleo, nchi itaanza kushindwa kutoa huduma za msingi, au itazuiliwa kukopa

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Treni kubeba tani nyingi kwa mpigo inalingana na uwezo wa Terni na wala si uwezo wa reli.... Yani mambo kama horse power, torque ,rpm...etc unaweza hata kubeba tani 1million kwa mpigo mmoja... Kwahivyo hapo ni tofauti ya nguvu ya diesel vs electric train na wala si tofauti ya rail design capacity.
Hio ya automatic traction hata sisi tunayo, kutoka Msa hadi nai kuna fibre optic imechimbiwa hapo kando ya reli..

Kuhusu gharama piga hesabu tu kidoo...
Dar-Moro 205km cost $1.215B . Moro-makutopora 336km cost $1.9B

That's average cost of $5.76m/km ....... Total lenth hadi mwanza ni 1,224km hio inakuja $7B

Kafrican said:

Treni kubeba tani nyingi kwa mpigo inalingana na uwezo wa Terni na wala si uwezo wa reli.... Yani mambo kama horse power, torque ,rpm...etc unaweza hata kubeba tani 1million kwa mpigo mmoja... Kwahivyo hapo ni tofauti ya nguvu ya diesel vs electric train na wala si tofauti ya rail design capacity.
Hio ya automatic traction hata sisi tunayo, kutoka Msa hadi nai kuna fibre optic imechimbiwa hapo kando ya reli..

Kuhusu gharama piga hesabu tu kidoo...
Dar-Moro 205km cost $1.215B . Moro-makutopora 336km cost $1.9B

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Rail line length: Dar-Moro 205km+95km=300km, Moro-Makutupora 336km+86km=422km.

Kafrican said:

Treni kubeba tani nyingi kwa mpigo inalingana na uwezo wa Terni na wala si uwezo wa reli.... Yani mambo kama horse power, torque ,rpm...etc unaweza hata kubeba tani 1million kwa mpigo mmoja... Kwahivyo hapo ni tofauti ya nguvu ya diesel vs electric train na wala si tofauti ya rail design capacity.
Hio ya automatic traction hata sisi tunayo, kutoka Msa hadi nai kuna fibre optic imechimbiwa hapo kando ya reli..

Kuhusu gharama piga hesabu tu kidoo...
Dar-Moro 205km cost $1.215B . Moro-makutopora 336km cost $1.9B

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Mimi ninasisitiza mazungumzo yetu yajikite sana katika tofauti ya bei zaidi kuliko hata hizo technical details, kitu kimoja ujue kwamba nchi zetu hizi bado ni masikini sana, hakuna sababu ya kukimbilia vitu ghali bila sababu, kama kuna uwezekano wa kupunguza gharama, hiyo lazima iwe kipaumbele cha kwanza.

Kuhusu uwezo wa reli, ile ya Tanzania capacity yake ni 35 tonnes exel wakati ya Kenya ni 25 exel, kwa kifupi ukiondoa vituo ambavyo sidhani kama Tanzania itajenga vya kifahari kama Kenya, parameta zingine zote zinaifanya ile ya Tanzania kuwa far superior kuliko ya Kenya, kosa la Kenya ni kutojenga electrical from the start, ni kama gari inayotumia automatic na manual drive, always automatic is more recent technology na very automated ukilinganisha na manual gearbox.

Unajua faida ya kuwa na full automatic control railway system?, ni kwamba kama train zinatoka opposite direction, na kwa sababu reli zetu hizi zote ni njia moja, uwezekano wa kugongana ni mkubwa sana, sasa kwa sababu control room watakua wanazifuatilia kwa karibu, wakiona zinakaribiana, wanazisimamisha zote mbili. Sasa kipi ni muhimu, kuwa na safety system hii, au kuwa na stage za kifahari vijijini?, kupanga ni kuchagua.

Kafrican said:

Treni kubeba tani nyingi kwa mpigo inalingana na uwezo wa Terni na wala si uwezo wa reli.... Yani mambo kama horse power, torque ,rpm...etc unaweza hata kubeba tani 1million kwa mpigo mmoja... Kwahivyo hapo ni tofauti ya nguvu ya diesel vs electric train na wala si tofauti ya rail design capacity.
Hio ya automatic traction hata sisi tunayo, kutoka Msa hadi nai kuna fibre optic imechimbiwa hapo kando ya reli..

Kuhusu gharama piga hesabu tu kidoo...
Dar-Moro 205km cost $1.215B . Moro-makutopora 336km cost $1.9B

That's average cost of $5.76m/km ....... Total lenth hadi mwanza ni 1,224km hio inakuja $7B

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Sijui wakati mwengine unakua unawaza nini, Dar -Moro =205 $1.2B
Moro -Makutopora =336 $1.9B 205+336 =541Km
$1.2+$1.9=$3.1B

Huyo ndiye Magufuli, usichanganyikiwe

kilam said:

Rail line length: Dar-Moro 205km+95km=300km, Moro-Makutupora 336km+86km=422km.

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You don't include loop length when calculation cost, just the length of the main line

Kafrican said:

You don't include loop length when calculation cost, just the length of the main line

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Sio kweli, cost/km ni kwa rail line yote.

joto la jiwe said:

Sijui wakati mwengine unakua unawaza nini, Dar -Moro =205 $1.2B
Moro -Makutopora =336 $1.9B 205+336 =541Km
$1.2+$1.9=$3.1B

Huyo ndiye Magufuli, usichanganyikiwe

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Sass fanya hio $3.1B/541km up are average cost per km alafu utafute projected cost ya length yote kutoka Dar hadi Mwanza uniambie kama haifiii hio $7B

Kafrican said:

Sass fanya hio $3.1B/541km up are average cost per km alafu utafute projected cost ya length yote kutoka Dar hadi Mwanza uniambie kama haifiii hio $7B

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Kwanini usifanye wewe unataka nikufanyie mimi, ninachojua ni kwamba wastani wa nusu ya reli imegharimu $3.1B, kwa hesabu za haraka nusu iliyobaki itatumia kiasi hicho hicho, kumbuka Dar, reli itapita juu ili ipishane na watu na Magari zaidi ya urefu wa Kilometa moja na nusu, hivyo kipande cha Dar hadi Dodoma kuwa ghali zaidi kuliko Dodoma Mwanza

joto la jiwe said:

Mimi ninasisitiza mazungumzo yetu yajikite sana katika tofauti ya bei zaidi kuliko hata hizo technical details, kitu kimoja ujue kwamba nchi zetu hizi bado ni masikini sana, hakuna sababu ya kukimbilia vitu ghali bila sababu, kama kuna uwezekano wa kupunguza gharama, hiyo lazima iwe kipaumbele cha kwanza.

Kuhusu uwezo wa reli, ile ya Tanzania capacity yake ni 35 tonnes exel wakati ya Kenya ni 25 exel, kwa kifupi ukiondoa vituo ambavyo sidhani kama Tanzania itajenga vya kifahari kama Kenya, parameta zingine zote zinaifanya ile ya Tanzania kuwa far superior kuliko ya Kenya, kosa la Kenya ni kutojenga electrical from the start, ni kama gari inayotumia automatic na manual drive, always automatic is more recent technology na very automated ukilinganisha na manual gearbox.

Unajua faida ya kuwa na full automatic control railway system?, ni kwamba kama train zinatoka opposite direction, na kwa sababu reli zetu hizi zote ni njia moja, uwezekano wa kugongana ni mkubwa sana, sasa kwa sababu control room watakua wanazifuatilia kwa karibu, wakiona zinakaribiana, wanazisimamisha zote mbili. Sasa kipi ni muhimu, kuwa na safety system hii, au kuwa na stage za kifahari vijijini?, kupanga ni kuchagua.

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Ili kujua pesa zimeenda wapi ni lazima ufanye breakdown ya technical detail... Kama unataka kutofat

joto la jiwe said:

Kwanini usifanye wewe unataka nikufanyie mimi, ninachojua ni kwamba wastani wa nusu ya reli imegharimu $3.1B, kwa hesabu za haraka nusu iliyobaki itatumia kiasi hicho hicho, kumbuka Dar, reli itapita juu ili ipishane na watu na Magari zaidi ya urefu wa Kilometa moja na nusu, hivyo kipande cha Dar hadi Dodoma kuwa ghali zaidi kuliko Dodoma Mwanza

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Mkuu Mbarawa alisema Kipande cha Dom hadi Mza kitakua very cheap sababu eneo ni flat na train haitakua na speed ya 180/hr tena bali 200/hr

REDEEMER. said:

Mkuu Mbarawa alisema Kipande cha Dom hadi Mza kitakua very cheap sababu eneo ni flat na train haitakua na speed ya 180/hr tena bali 200/hr

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sipati picha reli ikianza kunyanyulia apa Dar,nadhani itakuwa raha sana,ila mkuu project ya Dar-Moro ilikamilika watu wa mabasi si watafilizika

RUKUKU BOY said:

sipati picha reli ikianza kunyanyulia apa Dar,nadhani itakuwa raha sana,ila mkuu project ya Dar-Moro ilikamilika watu wa mabasi si watafilizika

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Ni kweli lakini kwa speed hii ya Magufuli kujenga lami mikoani na wilayani pia inasaidia kubuni ruti mpya ukumbuke ruti ya awali kabisa ilikua ni Dar - Tanga Kilimanjaro - Arusha lakini kadri barabara zilipozidi kuboreshwa mikoani ruti zilizidi kuongezeka.

pia kutakuwa na tunnel morogoro ambayo nayo imeongeza gharama

REDEEMER. said:

Mkuu Mbarawa alisema Kipande cha Dom hadi Mza kitakua very cheap sababu eneo ni flat na train haitakua na speed ya 180/hr tena bali 200/hr

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Wakenya lazima wakubali kuiga mambo mazuri kwa jirani na wapunguze majigambo yasiyo na msingi, ukiondoa "Laziness" ambayo kwa kweli hatuwezi kuikwepa ukilinganisha na wakenya, mambo karibu yote yaliyobaki Kenya inapaswa kujifunza toka Tanzania, hasa katika utawala huu wa Magufuli(Mapungufu ya Magufuli ni kubana uhuru wa kufanya siasa na uhuru wa habari), lakini katika mambo ya maendeleo, uchumi ikiwemo huduma za jamii, matumizi bora na ukusanyaji wa mapato na matumizi ya mapato, Tanzania ipo mbali sana, sio mbele ya Kenya tu, lakini ninahisi kama sio namba mbili basi ni namba tatu, nyuma ya Mauritius, Sychelles, na Botswana

Kafrican said:

Hata sisi mbali na bujeti tunapanga kuongeza hadi 3000MW by 2020....

Alafu hapo Tanzania SGR ya tz kutoka dar hadi mwanza ni at least $7B ...

SGR ya kenya itakua na urefu wa hadi 1,109 km, ya Tanzania ni about 1,224km hadi mwanza.

Mbali na umeme unafaa uangalie mambo mengine ya technical details ndo itajua tofauti inatokana wapi...
Kwa mfano reli ya Tz inajengwa ikitarajiwa kusafirisha kati ya 17-20 tonnes pa wakati ya kenya inatarajiwa kusafitisha 22million-35 million tonnes pa.

Reli yetu inajengwa Juujuu ya ardhi urefu wa 6.6meters above ground , hii inatumua pesa nyingi zaidi lakini haitawahi kupatwa na shida kama mafuriko... Reli ya Tz inajengwa 0.6meters abobe ground kama ile reli ya mkoloni..

Pesa hizo hizo tulizotumia kujenga SGR ndo zimetumika kujenga ICD ya Nairobi na pia ya Naivasha na ya Kisumu... ICD ya Nairobi ina uwezo wa kuchukua Contena 480,000! kila mwaka! Hio icd pekee iligharimu mihela, just for comparison bandari la dar lina uwezo wa 1 million TEU s containers kumaanisha hiyo icd ya Nairobi ni pekee ni nusu ya bandari lenu kuu la Dar..just imajin! Najua hata nyinyi mtajenga icd lakini katakua kadogo compaited icd za kenya...
Alafu bado hata hatujaona stesheni zenu zinakaa vipi manake ukangalia zile atesheni za kenya msa-Nai utaona zigharamu between $250m upto $350 of the cost

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Wacha uongo umeona tuta linalojengwa sasa? Ati 0.6 m wewe ni mjinga kweli!

Geza Ulole said:

Wacha uongo umeona tuta linalojengwa sasa? Ati 0.6 m wewe ni mjinga kweli!

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Ninafahamu taarifa zake nyingi huwa anazitoa sources za Kenya ambazo sio neutral, kwa mfano hiyo hapo ameitoa kwa jamaa fulani mkenya alitoa chati akalinganisha reli za Kenya, Tanzania na ethiopia, ukisoma utacheka hadi ukae chini, ila wakenya ndiyo wanapenda kusifiwa hata kama ni uongo ulio wazi wao wala hawajali,

joto la jiwe said:

Ninafahamu taarifa zake nyingi huwa anazitoa sources za Kenya ambazo sio neutral, kwa mfano hiyo hapo ameitoa kwa jamaa fulani mkenya alitoa chati akalinganisha reli za Kenya, Tanzania na ethiopia, ukisoma utacheka hadi ukae chini, ila wakenya ndiyo wanapenda kusifiwa hata kama ni uongo ulio wazi wao wala hawajali,

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Wanajitekenya na kujichekesha! Picha zimewekwa humu lakini mpumbavu anathubutu kuropoka uongo.