Abdulhalim
Platinum Member
- Jul 20, 2007
- 17,215
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Bua ha ha ha..
Jibberish ndo gani? Kiingilishi au kikabila chako? This is a TZ forum, Swahili is our proud national language. If you can't handle the heat get the SHYT out our kitchen.
Ujenzi wa Makao makuu ya EAC kuanza Arusha
Ujenzi wa Makao makuu ya EAC kuanza Arusha
- Thread starter Ngongo
- Start date
Bua ha ha ha..
Jibberish ndo gani? Kiingilishi au kikabila chako? This is a TZ forum, Swahili is our proud national language. If you can't handle the heat get the SHYT out our kitchen.
Ngongo
Platinum Member
- Sep 20, 2008
- 20,654
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- Thread starter
- #42
Kenya na Rwanda wana mahitaji na maslahi yanayoshabihiana sana hakuna ubishi wanacholilia sana ni ardhi ya Tanzania.Uganda na Burundi nazo pia zinahitaji ardhi lakini si kwa kiasi kikubwa kama ilivyo Kenya na Rwanda.Rwanda walijaribu kutafuta ardhi uko DRC walimsaidia L Kabila kumtoa madarakani Mabotu Seseko kwa ahadi Kivu iwe sehemu ya Rwanda.Kabila alikuja kuwakatalia kumega sehemu ya ardhi ya Zaire zamani sasa Congo ili kuweza kuwahifadhi mamilioni ya watusi wasiokuwa na ardhi.Kenya kwa upande wake sehemu kubwa ya ardhi yake imeshikiliwa na watu wachache uku sehemu kubwa ya raia wake wakibaki bila ardhi.Tusisahau kwamba sehemu kubwa ya kaskazini mwa Kenya ardhi yake ni jangwa haifai kwa matumizi ya kilimo wala ufugaji.
{1} Kenya ina population ya watu 39 milioni na ina eneo la 582,646 sq km.
{2} Uganda ina population ya watu 32 milioni na ina eneo la 241,038 sq km.
{3} Rwanda ina population ya watu 10 milioni na ina eneo la 26,338 sq km.
{4} Burundi ina population ya watu 9.5 milioni na ina eneo la 27,816 sq km.
{5}Tanzania ina population ya watu 41 milioni na eneo la 945,087 sq km.
Nchi zote nne kwa pamoja yaani Kenya,Uganda,Rwanda na Burundi zina eneo la 877,838 sq km na population ya watu 90 milioni.Eneo la nchi zote nne kwa pamoja bado hazijafikia ukubwa wa eneo la Tanzania.
Soko la pamoja ni zuri sana kwa maendeleo na ustawi wa wananchi wa EAC,kipengele cha ardhi si cha lazima katika uanzishwaji wa soko la pamoja na kama ni lazima kipengele kinaweza kuwa kutumika katika nchi wanachama zilizo tayari kufanya hivyo.
Kenya,Uganda,Rwanda na Burundi hawana ardhi ya kuwapa wananchi wa Tanzania na hii ni sababu tosha kubaini ni kwa nini wanalilia kipengele cha ardhi kiwepo.
{1} Kenya ina population ya watu 39 milioni na ina eneo la 582,646 sq km.
{2} Uganda ina population ya watu 32 milioni na ina eneo la 241,038 sq km.
{3} Rwanda ina population ya watu 10 milioni na ina eneo la 26,338 sq km.
{4} Burundi ina population ya watu 9.5 milioni na ina eneo la 27,816 sq km.
{5}Tanzania ina population ya watu 41 milioni na eneo la 945,087 sq km.
Nchi zote nne kwa pamoja yaani Kenya,Uganda,Rwanda na Burundi zina eneo la 877,838 sq km na population ya watu 90 milioni.Eneo la nchi zote nne kwa pamoja bado hazijafikia ukubwa wa eneo la Tanzania.
Soko la pamoja ni zuri sana kwa maendeleo na ustawi wa wananchi wa EAC,kipengele cha ardhi si cha lazima katika uanzishwaji wa soko la pamoja na kama ni lazima kipengele kinaweza kuwa kutumika katika nchi wanachama zilizo tayari kufanya hivyo.
Kenya,Uganda,Rwanda na Burundi hawana ardhi ya kuwapa wananchi wa Tanzania na hii ni sababu tosha kubaini ni kwa nini wanalilia kipengele cha ardhi kiwepo.
Ngongo
Platinum Member
- Sep 20, 2008
- 20,654
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- Thread starter
- #43
EAC integration: Tanzania set to counter latest jibe from Kenya
TANZANIA appears set to respond solidly to a proposal by a Kenyan government minister that the EAC secretariat headquarters be relocated elsewhere from Arusha - with reports suggesting the preferred new destination as being Nairobi.
''The views of one person can't be used to measure the views of all parties involved. That's all I can say for now,'' the Minister for East African Cooperation, Dr Diodorus Kamala, told THISDAY yesterday.
He said he would be in a position to clarify matters further at a news conference planned for this morning in Dar es Salaam.
However, going by reports emanating from the latest EAC Council of Ministers meeting in Arusha late last week, Kamala was most likely referring to comments attributed to his Kenyan counterpart minister, Jeffah Kingi, who reportedly called for the planned construction of the new EAC headquarters complex in Arusha to be indefinitely suspended.
According to the reports, the Kenyan minister's proposal was based on the fact that Kenya continues to be unhappy with the pace of negotiations on the EAC Common Market protocol, and blames Tanzania for delaying the process.
The reports said Kingi wanted the plans to build the EAC headquarters in Arusha ''shelved until Tanzania is seen to be fully committed to regional integration matters,'' and also suggested in the meeting that failure to demonstrate such commitment ''would make Tanzania unfit to host the EAC headquarters.''
Members of the Tanzanian delegation, it was reported, appeared to be taken by surprise by the minister's remarks, but counter-argued that the headquarters construction project cannot be suspended as the EAC Treaty clearly stipulates Arusha as being the seat of the EAC secretariat.
The matter is said to have dominated the meeting with Rwanda reportedly supporting Kenya's position, and Uganda and Burundi seeming to adopt neutral stands.
Other reports had it that prior to the start of the meeting, members of the Kenyan and Rwandan delegations were seen holding a tete-a-tete conversation where Rwanda officials pledged to support a proposal for Kenya to take over the hosting of the EAC secretariat.
Kenya has long been in the forefront of accusing Tanzania of dragging its feet on negotiations for the EAC Common Market Protocol.
The EAC headquarters complex project has been estimated to cost about 14 million euros (approx. 24bn/-), to be provided by the German government, and is scheduled to commence in September this year.
The regional organization currently has its headquarters at the Arusha International Conference Centre, which also served as headquarters of the former EAC which collapsed in 1977.
Regarding the proposed EAC Common Market protocol, Tanzania - the largest EAC member country in size and population - has steadfastly opposed clauses dwelling on the movement of people and labour services across common borders; the right of residency; and access of land ownership by non-citizens.
Tanzania, which has been particularly uncomfortable with the land issue, has repeatedly said it is still studying the situation.
Under the current EAC Treaty, no major decision on regional integration issues can be made without the consent of all the member states. Tanzania, Uganda, Kenya remain the EAC founder states, while Rwanda and Burundi joined a couple of years ago.
It is understood, however, that Kenya in particular ? with support from Rwanda - have been pressing for a change in the Treaty so that key decisions can be adopted if supported by the majority of member countries.
Kenya's EAC minister Kingi is already well-known as one of the most vocal of those saying Tanzania is dragging its feet in the integration process, and is also known to be spearheading a campaign to have major decisions made without the consent of the current host country.
Tanzania, on the other hand, has always insisted that the country will not be rushed into any major decisions that could impact negatively on its own people.
Kamala said he would also use today's news conference to clarify on other issues arising from the Arusha meeting
Source:THISDAY
TANZANIA appears set to respond solidly to a proposal by a Kenyan government minister that the EAC secretariat headquarters be relocated elsewhere from Arusha - with reports suggesting the preferred new destination as being Nairobi.
''The views of one person can't be used to measure the views of all parties involved. That's all I can say for now,'' the Minister for East African Cooperation, Dr Diodorus Kamala, told THISDAY yesterday.
He said he would be in a position to clarify matters further at a news conference planned for this morning in Dar es Salaam.
However, going by reports emanating from the latest EAC Council of Ministers meeting in Arusha late last week, Kamala was most likely referring to comments attributed to his Kenyan counterpart minister, Jeffah Kingi, who reportedly called for the planned construction of the new EAC headquarters complex in Arusha to be indefinitely suspended.
According to the reports, the Kenyan minister's proposal was based on the fact that Kenya continues to be unhappy with the pace of negotiations on the EAC Common Market protocol, and blames Tanzania for delaying the process.
The reports said Kingi wanted the plans to build the EAC headquarters in Arusha ''shelved until Tanzania is seen to be fully committed to regional integration matters,'' and also suggested in the meeting that failure to demonstrate such commitment ''would make Tanzania unfit to host the EAC headquarters.''
Members of the Tanzanian delegation, it was reported, appeared to be taken by surprise by the minister's remarks, but counter-argued that the headquarters construction project cannot be suspended as the EAC Treaty clearly stipulates Arusha as being the seat of the EAC secretariat.
The matter is said to have dominated the meeting with Rwanda reportedly supporting Kenya's position, and Uganda and Burundi seeming to adopt neutral stands.
Other reports had it that prior to the start of the meeting, members of the Kenyan and Rwandan delegations were seen holding a tete-a-tete conversation where Rwanda officials pledged to support a proposal for Kenya to take over the hosting of the EAC secretariat.
Kenya has long been in the forefront of accusing Tanzania of dragging its feet on negotiations for the EAC Common Market Protocol.
The EAC headquarters complex project has been estimated to cost about 14 million euros (approx. 24bn/-), to be provided by the German government, and is scheduled to commence in September this year.
The regional organization currently has its headquarters at the Arusha International Conference Centre, which also served as headquarters of the former EAC which collapsed in 1977.
Regarding the proposed EAC Common Market protocol, Tanzania - the largest EAC member country in size and population - has steadfastly opposed clauses dwelling on the movement of people and labour services across common borders; the right of residency; and access of land ownership by non-citizens.
Tanzania, which has been particularly uncomfortable with the land issue, has repeatedly said it is still studying the situation.
Under the current EAC Treaty, no major decision on regional integration issues can be made without the consent of all the member states. Tanzania, Uganda, Kenya remain the EAC founder states, while Rwanda and Burundi joined a couple of years ago.
It is understood, however, that Kenya in particular ? with support from Rwanda - have been pressing for a change in the Treaty so that key decisions can be adopted if supported by the majority of member countries.
Kenya's EAC minister Kingi is already well-known as one of the most vocal of those saying Tanzania is dragging its feet in the integration process, and is also known to be spearheading a campaign to have major decisions made without the consent of the current host country.
Tanzania, on the other hand, has always insisted that the country will not be rushed into any major decisions that could impact negatively on its own people.
Kamala said he would also use today's news conference to clarify on other issues arising from the Arusha meeting
Source:THISDAY
Mwana wa Mungu
JF-Expert Member
- Aug 14, 2008
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the simple answer is that, Kenya should not drag us to do what they want. we are Tanzanians, for Tanzanians and by Tanzanians. the EAC countries are not the only countries on earth to cooperate with. if we anticipate risks, we may choose to cooperate others like the SADC countries, ambazo kwa sasa wanaangalia kuwa na single currency. Tanzania ni moja wa ma founder wa sadc. You kenyans, ukitaka muwaone watz wakoje, nyie endeleeni tu na muungano au federation yenu, hapo ndipo mtakapoona kumbe tz wana nchi zingine za kushirikiana nazo. ukweli ni kwamba, watz hawawezi kutengeneza bomu ndani ya nchi yao. watz ni wataifa sana, wana umoja na wanajali mtz kwanza. hicho ndo tunajivunia. hatutaki siku moja yaje yatokee kama yale ya S.Africa kuwaua wageni. ni dhahiri kwamba, kama kenya na nchi zingine zitakuja kumiliki ardhi ambayo watz tumeitunza kwa muda mrefu, ni rahisi watz kuungana na kuanza kuwachapa wageni kama ilivyotokea south africa. ndio maana sisi watz tumeli anticipate hilo na hatutaki litokee. nchi yetu ni ya amani siku zote. na hakuna mtz hata mmoja anayekubali kumpa mkenya au mgeni ardhi.
msizulazimishe tafadhali. kama hamtaki basi, why insisting so much? kuna nini mnatutakia sisi. nendeni zetu.
And you Tanzanian leaders, msikubali ardhi iwe mali ya EAC, mtakuja mvune mavuno kama yale yaliyotokea south africa siku moja. msitengeneza bomb kwenye nchi yetu. waacheni wakenya waungane na sisi isipokuwa ardhi, kama wanalazimisha waache walale mbele.
msizulazimishe tafadhali. kama hamtaki basi, why insisting so much? kuna nini mnatutakia sisi. nendeni zetu.
And you Tanzanian leaders, msikubali ardhi iwe mali ya EAC, mtakuja mvune mavuno kama yale yaliyotokea south africa siku moja. msitengeneza bomb kwenye nchi yetu. waacheni wakenya waungane na sisi isipokuwa ardhi, kama wanalazimisha waache walale mbele.
Caroline Danzi
JF-Expert Member
- Dec 19, 2008
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Hatuna matatizo watanzania, kama umeshasoma huwa hatuna muda wa kusumbua vichwa vyetu, kila kitu kwetu ni simple. Watanzania mpaka lini tutaacha uvivu na ufinyu wa fikra?
Inauma sana kuwa na viongozi wenye uzoefu mdogo kwenye taaluma zao. Ikitokea akaletwa mtu afanya kazi kwa niamba tutalalamika eti tunatawaliwa.
Inauma sana kuwa na viongozi wenye uzoefu mdogo kwenye taaluma zao. Ikitokea akaletwa mtu afanya kazi kwa niamba tutalalamika eti tunatawaliwa.
Viongozi wa Kenya wana uzoefu wa kuandaa magenge ya kua raia.Unakumbuka uchaguzi wenu ulivyojaa vurugu za kikabila au unataka Tanzania iwena ujuzi na uzoefu wa aina gani.
kenya najua mnapiga vita Arusha isiwe makao makuu lakini mji wa Arusha unajiandaa kwaajili tena kupokea waalifu wa mauji ya kimbari kutoka Kenya.Hili nalo mtalipinga !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.
Mimi Nadhani sisi waafrika ni kati ya watu ambao hatupo makini sana katika mambo mengi tunayofanya. EAC ilisha vunjika mwaka 1977, tulifunza nini tokana na hilo?. moja ya sababu ni kuharakisha mambo bila kufanya maandalizi ya kutosha. Suala la Kenya kupendekeza EAC kuhamia Kenya nilisha sikia siku nyingi sana. mpango huu mimi niliusikia miaka ya 2006, wakati nikihudhulia mikutano ya EAC. Kwa wale wanaohudhuria vikao vya EAC mara nyingi nadhani itakuwa sio mara yao ya kwanza. Nashukuru viongozi wa Tanzania wamekuwa na msimamo wa kulinda maslahi ya watanzani, na hivyo kuanza kuondoa ndoto za wakenya kwamba Tanzania ni mahari pa kuchuma tu. Nilisha msikia mkenya mmoja akisema kwamba 'if I was a Tanzanian I would become rich in one year', wakimaanisha kwamba hapa ndio mahali pa kutajirika kirahisi kwa sababu watu wamelala sana. EAC inajitahidi kuiga muundo wa Jumuia ya ulaya EU. Lakini tukumbuke pale ambapo EU imefika, kwa maana ya common market na common currency ambayo nchi zingine za ulaya hazijaridhia imewachukua miaka zaidi 50. kuna mambo mengi hayajafanyika ili tufike huko. Mimi ni mtafiti, Desembar mwaka 2007 tulizunguka Tanzania nzima kukusanya maoni ya watanzania kuhusu kuanziswa kwa soko la pamoja (EAC common market), watanzania wengi wanakubali wazo hilo ila wanaona bado ni mapema mno kufika huko. Suala la ardhi na ulinzi, ni kati ya mambo ambayo watanzania wanawasisi nayo mpa sasa.Utafitihuu tuliufanya kabla ya uchaguzi wa 2008, amabo ulizua mtafaluku mkubwa na mauaji ya kutisha, tungewauliza leo watanzania sijui wangesemaje!!. Nashangazwa na wazo hilo la wazili wa kenya, kwani hata ukimwuliza Mkenya aliye mkweli na makini atakubali kwamba bado Kenya haijawa na amani ya kutosha(not stable) kwa makao makuu kuwa huko. Hawa jamaa ni wabinafsi sana mimi sishangai hilo na bado mtasikia mambo mengi sana siku zijazo. Mimi ninacho jua katika mambo ya ushirikiano kama nchi moja haipo tayari kwa jambo furahi basi nchi zinazoridhia huendelea. Nchi kuridhia inatakiwa iangalia maslahi ya wananchi wake kama hawatafaidika au hawajajiandaa basi husubiri wakati muafaka. mafano ni Nchi ya UK haikuridhia kuingia katika salafu moja (common currency ya Euro) na nchi zingine zimejiunga na zinaendelea. Pia EU common market, nchi zingine bado hazijaridhia, lakini nchi zingine zinaendelea. Nawaomba hao wanaoiona Tanzania msaliti kwa kutoridhia kila kitu waende wakasome somo la Regional integration, watajua mambo yanakwendaje Duniani?. Mwezi wa 9 mwaka jana nilipata bahati ya kutembelea makao makuu ya jumuia ya ulaya na kuzungumza na nchi kadhaa kama wajerumani, wengi bado wanalalamika kuhusu hiyo common market tunayo taka kuikimbilia bila maandalizi.muda hautoshi ningeandika mengi niliyo jifunza huko. Ukweli ni kwamba nafurahi jinsi waziri wetu wa jumuia ya afrika mashariki alivyo na msimamo imara katika hilo, nasi tuendelee kumwunga mkono. Jumuia ni ndoa ambayo hutakiwi kulazimishwa na mtu yeyote. kama wanadhani nchi zingine zimejiandaa waendelee, sisi tutajiunga baadae tukijiandaa.
Ben Saanane
JF-Expert Member
- Jan 18, 2007
- 14,580
- 18,193
Hizi ni dalili mbaya alizoonyesha huyo waziri wa Kenya.Ina maana tukiingia huko,kutakua na kuburuzana.
Kuhusu suala la Ardhi,serikali yetu isilete mchezo.Wakikubali kusaini hicho kipengele basi watanzania tutasimamia ardhi yetu.Niko tayari kuingia msituni kuipigania Tanzania yangu.Huu ni urithi wetu,mtu asilete masikhara kwa hili.Mbona watu wasiegemee huko Somalia au Ethiopia? kwanza Kenya wanasema wao ni matajiri,si watumie teknolojia ya kugeuza sehemu yao ambayo ni desert kuwa sehemu nzuri?
Tanzania haiwezi kuhongwa na makao makuu ya EAC. Wasilete mchezo hapa,wametoa ardhi kwa akina John Michuki,Kibaki,Kenyata ana akina Njenga Karume halafu sasa hivi wanalialia na Tanzania? To,hell with them.Tutapigania utaifa wetu mpaka tone la mwisho.Damn!
Kuhusu suala la Ardhi,serikali yetu isilete mchezo.Wakikubali kusaini hicho kipengele basi watanzania tutasimamia ardhi yetu.Niko tayari kuingia msituni kuipigania Tanzania yangu.Huu ni urithi wetu,mtu asilete masikhara kwa hili.Mbona watu wasiegemee huko Somalia au Ethiopia? kwanza Kenya wanasema wao ni matajiri,si watumie teknolojia ya kugeuza sehemu yao ambayo ni desert kuwa sehemu nzuri?
Tanzania haiwezi kuhongwa na makao makuu ya EAC. Wasilete mchezo hapa,wametoa ardhi kwa akina John Michuki,Kibaki,Kenyata ana akina Njenga Karume halafu sasa hivi wanalialia na Tanzania? To,hell with them.Tutapigania utaifa wetu mpaka tone la mwisho.Damn!
Augustine Moshi
JF-Expert Member
- Apr 22, 2006
- 2,556
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Kwenda taratibu ni uamuzi ambao Tanzania ilishaufikia rasmi, na kuutangaza. Hapo hakuna tatizo. Tatizo liko hivi: ujenzi wa makao makuu nao uende taratibu au sivyo?
Jengo la makao makuu, na makao makuu, ni vitu viwili tofauti. Tayari Arusha ni makao makuu ya EAC. Ujenzi wa jengo la makao makuu ni mojawapo ya miradi ya EAC.
Maoni kwamba makao makuu yahamishwe ni mabadiliko makubwa ambayo hata Baraza la Mawaziri la Kenya linasemekana bado kujadili. Kama Kenya inataka kweli makao makuu yahamishwe, basi hilo litaweza kuiondoa Tanzania EAC.
Haiwezekani Tanzania ikakubali makao makuu ya EAC yahamishiwe Nairobi. Ucheleweshaji wa ujenzi wa jengo la makao makuu unakubalika, kama kuna ulazima wa kufanya hivyo. Lakini ulazima hauko. Fedha keshatoa Mjerumani.
Naamini Kenya haitapenda kuharibu uhusiano mzuri na Tanzania. Sisi ni soko kuu la bidhaa za Kenya. Zaidi ya hapo, biashara kati ya Kenya na nchi za kusini mwa Afrika inapitia sana Tanzania.
Naamini Waziri Kingi alitaka tu kuweka presha, na hana nia kweli ya kuhamisha makao makuu ya EAC toka Arusha hadi Nairobi. Anajua hilo litaleta uhusiano mbaya kati ya Kenya na Tanzania. Kenya haipendi hivyo.
Jengo la makao makuu, na makao makuu, ni vitu viwili tofauti. Tayari Arusha ni makao makuu ya EAC. Ujenzi wa jengo la makao makuu ni mojawapo ya miradi ya EAC.
Maoni kwamba makao makuu yahamishwe ni mabadiliko makubwa ambayo hata Baraza la Mawaziri la Kenya linasemekana bado kujadili. Kama Kenya inataka kweli makao makuu yahamishwe, basi hilo litaweza kuiondoa Tanzania EAC.
Haiwezekani Tanzania ikakubali makao makuu ya EAC yahamishiwe Nairobi. Ucheleweshaji wa ujenzi wa jengo la makao makuu unakubalika, kama kuna ulazima wa kufanya hivyo. Lakini ulazima hauko. Fedha keshatoa Mjerumani.
Naamini Kenya haitapenda kuharibu uhusiano mzuri na Tanzania. Sisi ni soko kuu la bidhaa za Kenya. Zaidi ya hapo, biashara kati ya Kenya na nchi za kusini mwa Afrika inapitia sana Tanzania.
Naamini Waziri Kingi alitaka tu kuweka presha, na hana nia kweli ya kuhamisha makao makuu ya EAC toka Arusha hadi Nairobi. Anajua hilo litaleta uhusiano mbaya kati ya Kenya na Tanzania. Kenya haipendi hivyo.
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Abdulhalim
Platinum Member
- Jul 20, 2007
- 17,215
- 3,076
Ukweli kuwa hakuna jema litakalopatikana ikiwa kutakuwa na muungano wa aina yeyote, ikiwa hakuna kuheshimiana na kuchukuliana. Wakenya kwa muda sasa, wameshaonesha wao ni watu wa aina gani. Mi nadhani, serikali yetu iangalie mahali pengine kwenye alternatives makini zaidi, ili kuweza kuimarisha uchumi wetu na kuacha kupoteza muda na hii jumuiya ambayo tayari watu wameshaanza kuonesha makucha yao, kabla hata haijaanza.
Augustine Moshi
JF-Expert Member
- Apr 22, 2006
- 2,556
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Faida za kuungana zipo, lakini haziko bayana sana kama hasara zitakazoweza kupatikana. Faida iliyo bayana kabisa ni hiyo ya Arusha kuwa makao makuu. Kama ikiondolewa, basi itakuwa shida kuungana.
Mwalimu alikuwa radhi kuchelewesha UHURU wa Tanganyika ili Kenya, Uganda na Tanganyika zipate uhuru wakati mmoja, kama nchi moja. Mwalimu hakuelezea sana ni kwa nini muungano ulikuwa muhimu hivyo.
Be that as it may, lakini tunajua wazi kwamba umoja ni nguvu na utengano ni udhaifu. Kama tutaweza kuheshimiana, basi ushirikiano utawezekana. Tukidharauliana hatutafika popote.
Mwalimu alikuwa radhi kuchelewesha UHURU wa Tanganyika ili Kenya, Uganda na Tanganyika zipate uhuru wakati mmoja, kama nchi moja. Mwalimu hakuelezea sana ni kwa nini muungano ulikuwa muhimu hivyo.
Be that as it may, lakini tunajua wazi kwamba umoja ni nguvu na utengano ni udhaifu. Kama tutaweza kuheshimiana, basi ushirikiano utawezekana. Tukidharauliana hatutafika popote.
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Masanja
JF-Expert Member
- Aug 1, 2007
- 5,319
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Mimi nimekuwa Pro. EAC sana, lakini juzi maneno ya waziri wa Kenya Mh. Kingi yaminichefua sana, na kwa kweli na-loose interests na the whole thing!
I love Kenyans, I have some friends there, lakini kitendo cha Kingi kutotaka kuwasikiliza wenzake kimeniuzi mno. Its like the other guy.."you are either with us or against us!" Who say so? Thats wrong diplomatic approach! Its such atitudes which make Tanzanians feel like..Kenyans have sinister motives with this shirikisho (rightly or wrongly). What Tanzanians want is: We want the voices of the downtrodden to be heard. Nothing more.
Huu mvutano wa EAC unaoonyesha ni jinsi gani viongozi wetu walivyo wanafiki na wabinafsi. They want to score their political cards against the will of the people.
1. Muungano ni kitu kizuri, lakini I am afraid ndugu zetu wakenya hawako open on what they want from this unity. It seems watu wana interests zao mbele hawafikirii collective benefits za member states wote. Its such atitudes which is making TANZANIANS feel like the whole EAC Project is a waste of resources and time. There is huge wall of mistrust.
2. Kila nchi ina haki ya kuamua ni jinsi gani iingie kwenye ushirikiano. Mfano Uingereza ni member wa EU (and very prominent one) lakini hawako kwenye ushirikiano wa sarafu. Britain mpaka leo wamekataa kutumia EURO. Does that make them ant- EU? Britain mpaka leo they are not part of Schengen Visa..unaweza tembea nchi nyinginezo za EU kwa visa moja, lakini kwenda UK unahitaji visa yao, does that make them ant EU? Leo raia wa Poland kuingia Germany anaingia lakini siyo kutafuta kazi! Does that make Germany less or ant EU? hell no!
3. Juzi juzi Ireland ilipiga kura kuikataa katiba ya EU and as we talk now..hiyo katiba iko kwenye kabati, wanafikiria ni namna gani wanaweza ku-negotiate katiba nyingine. Its only Ireland ambao wameikataa kwa referendum out of 27 countries. Mbona akina Germany na France (the biggest paymasters) hawakusema kwamba waendelee kivyao waiache Ireland? Precisely because they know what it takes to unite! And they listen to their people. Thats what democracy is. Sio hizi diplomatic charades za kufoka foka tuu za akina Kingi et al...Eti TZ is dragging the EAC? my foot!
4. What Kenyans and others are doing is just a display of selfshness tactics. No where a sovereign country can drag another on relinquishing part of its sovereignity. What TANZANIA did was to ask its people! And people have said..well, lets unite but free movement, land acquistion and labour exchange should be on hold. Kipi kibaya hapo? Kwa nini Kenya na wenzake wasiendelee na Tanzania iwe mshirika (kama Britain) katika yale mambo mengine inayaona yako legit kwa interests zake? Perhaps tukishaona jumuia ina thrive..basi we can come in. Simple! Kitu gani hapa hakieleweki? After all, Britain wanaangalia uwezekano wa kuingia EURO..precisely kwa sababu inafit interests zao.
5. Huu muungano ingebidi kila nchi iweke referendum wananchi waamue..viongozi waliogopa..maana wananchi wangekataa. NA hii inatuonyesha ni jinsi gani viongozi wetu wa kiafrika walivyo wabinafsi..maana they dont consider mawazo ya wananchi wao kabisa. na hii EAC inaonyesha hilo. Days are gone for Kibaki`s Kikwete`s or Kingi`s of this world to sit in their comfort zones and determine the fate of millions. No and we say NO. Lazima TUSHIRIKISHWE. Simple!
6. Kenya wanasahu kwamba Tanzania we have this experience we have Zanzibar as a sovereign nation which is part of our country. we have had ups and downs. Ndo maana leo tuko very careful sana when it comes to this so called unity. Kenya mpaka leo wananchi hawaelewani ndani ya nchi..lakini wanaona kwamba wakiungana na nchi nyingine haya matatizo yatakwisha. Wrong! You have Somalia, Uganda, Rwanda..kote kuna matatizo ya US vs THEM..people pretend to be blind kwamba they see economic benefits only, but TZ thinks beyond that..tunaangalia..mbali..we have always strived to build a nation not a country!
7. My suggestion. This EAC should be brick by brick. Twende taratibu. No need to expedite anything. EU ilianza mwaka 1953. LAKINI MPAKA LEO KUNA NCHI AMBAZO ZIKO SCEPTIC (KAMA NORWAY NA BRITAIN). IWE EAC YA MIAKA LESS THAN TEN? Tuna ASEAN shirikisho la huko Asia..leo miaka zaidi ya mingapi..bado wanasuasua..precisely because kila nchi inaangalia maslahi yake..harafu leo Kenya bila aibu ana wanaccuse wenzake eti wana-drag EAC? Mh. Kingi get serious brother.
8. Kenya, Rwanda, Uganda et al..will have made a fatal mistake of using this EAC headquarter as their CARD to force TANZANIA to give in their demands. They can as well take the EAC somehwere else. But I can assure you, knowing my compatriots, This will be the end of this short lived dream of EAC (as far as TANZANIA is concerned). MAKE NO MISTAKE. WE ALL NEED EACH OTHER. Tanzania can survive on its own, so is Kenya or Uganda. And by the way in international relations its all about interests no personalities..so even Malawi, ZAMBIA CONGO ETC..all can do!
9. Let people decide. The Kingi`s of this world cant make decisions on our behalf without our conset. Ir I may suggest: A good EAC will come after a long and very careful negotiated treaty between these sister countries. We know Kenyans and Ugandans very well. And I guess they also know us. The more they continue harrassing and using these sinister tricks the less we became interested.
10. We need to take it slowly. Perhaps my advise to TANZANIA, make your stand very clear and if our friends want to go on..let them go! We have enough problems. But I can assure you TANZANIA has ALL the qualities to be the best in what we do. We have people, land and name it. So is Kenya and the rest. If EAC fail..we can be good neighbours still and be in the same African Union as African countries. Where we co-exist. After all....we all African countries.
"Haraka haraka haina baraka" so the old adage goes.
MASANJA,
I love Kenyans, I have some friends there, lakini kitendo cha Kingi kutotaka kuwasikiliza wenzake kimeniuzi mno. Its like the other guy.."you are either with us or against us!" Who say so? Thats wrong diplomatic approach! Its such atitudes which make Tanzanians feel like..Kenyans have sinister motives with this shirikisho (rightly or wrongly). What Tanzanians want is: We want the voices of the downtrodden to be heard. Nothing more.
Huu mvutano wa EAC unaoonyesha ni jinsi gani viongozi wetu walivyo wanafiki na wabinafsi. They want to score their political cards against the will of the people.
1. Muungano ni kitu kizuri, lakini I am afraid ndugu zetu wakenya hawako open on what they want from this unity. It seems watu wana interests zao mbele hawafikirii collective benefits za member states wote. Its such atitudes which is making TANZANIANS feel like the whole EAC Project is a waste of resources and time. There is huge wall of mistrust.
2. Kila nchi ina haki ya kuamua ni jinsi gani iingie kwenye ushirikiano. Mfano Uingereza ni member wa EU (and very prominent one) lakini hawako kwenye ushirikiano wa sarafu. Britain mpaka leo wamekataa kutumia EURO. Does that make them ant- EU? Britain mpaka leo they are not part of Schengen Visa..unaweza tembea nchi nyinginezo za EU kwa visa moja, lakini kwenda UK unahitaji visa yao, does that make them ant EU? Leo raia wa Poland kuingia Germany anaingia lakini siyo kutafuta kazi! Does that make Germany less or ant EU? hell no!
3. Juzi juzi Ireland ilipiga kura kuikataa katiba ya EU and as we talk now..hiyo katiba iko kwenye kabati, wanafikiria ni namna gani wanaweza ku-negotiate katiba nyingine. Its only Ireland ambao wameikataa kwa referendum out of 27 countries. Mbona akina Germany na France (the biggest paymasters) hawakusema kwamba waendelee kivyao waiache Ireland? Precisely because they know what it takes to unite! And they listen to their people. Thats what democracy is. Sio hizi diplomatic charades za kufoka foka tuu za akina Kingi et al...Eti TZ is dragging the EAC? my foot!
4. What Kenyans and others are doing is just a display of selfshness tactics. No where a sovereign country can drag another on relinquishing part of its sovereignity. What TANZANIA did was to ask its people! And people have said..well, lets unite but free movement, land acquistion and labour exchange should be on hold. Kipi kibaya hapo? Kwa nini Kenya na wenzake wasiendelee na Tanzania iwe mshirika (kama Britain) katika yale mambo mengine inayaona yako legit kwa interests zake? Perhaps tukishaona jumuia ina thrive..basi we can come in. Simple! Kitu gani hapa hakieleweki? After all, Britain wanaangalia uwezekano wa kuingia EURO..precisely kwa sababu inafit interests zao.
5. Huu muungano ingebidi kila nchi iweke referendum wananchi waamue..viongozi waliogopa..maana wananchi wangekataa. NA hii inatuonyesha ni jinsi gani viongozi wetu wa kiafrika walivyo wabinafsi..maana they dont consider mawazo ya wananchi wao kabisa. na hii EAC inaonyesha hilo. Days are gone for Kibaki`s Kikwete`s or Kingi`s of this world to sit in their comfort zones and determine the fate of millions. No and we say NO. Lazima TUSHIRIKISHWE. Simple!
6. Kenya wanasahu kwamba Tanzania we have this experience we have Zanzibar as a sovereign nation which is part of our country. we have had ups and downs. Ndo maana leo tuko very careful sana when it comes to this so called unity. Kenya mpaka leo wananchi hawaelewani ndani ya nchi..lakini wanaona kwamba wakiungana na nchi nyingine haya matatizo yatakwisha. Wrong! You have Somalia, Uganda, Rwanda..kote kuna matatizo ya US vs THEM..people pretend to be blind kwamba they see economic benefits only, but TZ thinks beyond that..tunaangalia..mbali..we have always strived to build a nation not a country!
7. My suggestion. This EAC should be brick by brick. Twende taratibu. No need to expedite anything. EU ilianza mwaka 1953. LAKINI MPAKA LEO KUNA NCHI AMBAZO ZIKO SCEPTIC (KAMA NORWAY NA BRITAIN). IWE EAC YA MIAKA LESS THAN TEN? Tuna ASEAN shirikisho la huko Asia..leo miaka zaidi ya mingapi..bado wanasuasua..precisely because kila nchi inaangalia maslahi yake..harafu leo Kenya bila aibu ana wanaccuse wenzake eti wana-drag EAC? Mh. Kingi get serious brother.
8. Kenya, Rwanda, Uganda et al..will have made a fatal mistake of using this EAC headquarter as their CARD to force TANZANIA to give in their demands. They can as well take the EAC somehwere else. But I can assure you, knowing my compatriots, This will be the end of this short lived dream of EAC (as far as TANZANIA is concerned). MAKE NO MISTAKE. WE ALL NEED EACH OTHER. Tanzania can survive on its own, so is Kenya or Uganda. And by the way in international relations its all about interests no personalities..so even Malawi, ZAMBIA CONGO ETC..all can do!
9. Let people decide. The Kingi`s of this world cant make decisions on our behalf without our conset. Ir I may suggest: A good EAC will come after a long and very careful negotiated treaty between these sister countries. We know Kenyans and Ugandans very well. And I guess they also know us. The more they continue harrassing and using these sinister tricks the less we became interested.
10. We need to take it slowly. Perhaps my advise to TANZANIA, make your stand very clear and if our friends want to go on..let them go! We have enough problems. But I can assure you TANZANIA has ALL the qualities to be the best in what we do. We have people, land and name it. So is Kenya and the rest. If EAC fail..we can be good neighbours still and be in the same African Union as African countries. Where we co-exist. After all....we all African countries.
"Haraka haraka haina baraka" so the old adage goes.
MASANJA,
Ngongo
Platinum Member
- Sep 20, 2008
- 20,654
- 35,887
- Thread starter
- #54
Taarifa ya habari ya ITV leo asubuhi afisa wa EAC amesema fedha zote kwaajili ya ujenzi wa makao makuu ya EAC zimeshatolewa na serekali ya ujerumani.Hatua inayofuata sasa ni kutangaza tenda ya ujenzi.Inavyoelekea hata makao makuu ya EAC yamempuuza waziri mzushi wa Kenya anayehusika na masuala ya EAC.
MzalendoHalisi
JF-Expert Member
- Jun 24, 2007
- 4,679
- 1,612
Huyu waziri je anawakilisha maoni yake au ya Wakenya wote?
Ina maana ni msimamo wa Kibaki na serikali yake EAC ihamishwe toka Arusha? Ili kuishinikiza Tz tukubali chap chap ktk biashara na free movement of People?
Sioni kikubwa Watz watabenefit toka Kenya..Wakenya watapata masoko na Ardhi Tz!
Tuende tu pole pole!
Ina maana ni msimamo wa Kibaki na serikali yake EAC ihamishwe toka Arusha? Ili kuishinikiza Tz tukubali chap chap ktk biashara na free movement of People?
Sioni kikubwa Watz watabenefit toka Kenya..Wakenya watapata masoko na Ardhi Tz!
Tuende tu pole pole!
Unajua kuna wakati mtu anaweza kuzungumza hayo kwa kupima joto. Kwanini Serikali ya Kenya kama hawakubaliani naye huyo Waziri wasikanushe, wanataka kutumia shinikizo ya huo Ujenzi ili tuwakubalie mambo yao. Sasa hivi hawawajui waTZ sio wale wa ule muungano uliopita. Sasa tunaongea kwa vitendo.
EAC complex construction still on course
SUKHDEV CHHATBAR in ARUSHA, 3rd March 2009 @ 11:04
Construction of the ultra-modern East African Community (EAC) headquarters in Arusha begins next September and is irreversible, says project manager Mr Phil Klerruu. His statement comes just days after reports that Kenya has objected to the scheduled construction on grounds that Tanzania has yet to fully demonstrate its commitment to the EAC integration. He added that tenders for construction of the EAC Complex, including sub-contract works, would be finalized starting next week.
Construction will take off as planned, he told the 'Daily News' yesterday. The argument was raised at last weeks EAC Council of Ministers meeting here by Kenyas Minister for EAC, Mr Jeffah Kingi. Apparently, Mr Kingis reaction was based on Tanzanias position over land issues in the ongoing Common Market draft proposals, in which he accuses Tanzania of foot-dragging -- and hence delaying conclusion of the negotiations. The Chief Executive Officer (CEO) of the East African Law Society (EALS), Don Deya, told the 'Daily News' yesterday that it was an overreaction (by Mr Kingi).
He said that negotiations on a Common Market have never been an easy thing anywhere (in the world). There are always ups and downs over such contentious issues it takes time to come to conclusions, Mr Deya said, when asked to comment over the Kenyan suggestion. Mr Alute Mugway, former Secretary General of EALS, said that EAC Treaty clearly stipulated that the headquarters shall be in Arusha in accordance with Article 136(1).
People in leadership positions should never give reckless statements which can endanger the integration efforts, he cautioned. Mr Simon Mapolu, an independent consultant, said: No minister can just go to a meeting and decide to stall any project already endorsed by the EAC Summit and the East African Legislative Assembly. Such irresponsible statements can wreak the Community, he warned, adding that such provocative proposition -- unfortunately comes from a senior Kenyan government minister -- could harm the Community, which was still overcoming the wounds of the 1977 break-up.
The former EAC collapsed 32 years mainly because of divergent political and economic perceptions of the founding partner statesKenya, Uganda and Tanzania. Tanzanias Minister for EAC, Dr Kamala, was recently quoted as saying that Tanzania would not be rushed into the Common Market negotiations which he said could impact negatively on its people, but that the country was still committed to firm talks. The multi-purpose headquarters is expected to be ready the latest by September 2011.
The 30.2billion/- (Euros 14 million) complex, which will be built adjacent to the Arusha International Conference Centre (AICC), is financed by the German government. In 2005, the Tanzania government donated the 10 acres of land on which the EAC Complex will sit. The planning and design stage of the project is 100 per cent complete, said Kleruu, who is also EAC Senior Estates Management Officer.
Germany, which had committed itself initially with Euros eight million, has topped up the construction costs with another Euros six million following revised costs following the entry of two new EAC members -- Rwanda and Burundi -- into the regional bloc some two years ago. Originally, the construction was expected to start in 2007. Currently, EAC is housed at the Arusha International Conference Centre (AICC) and pays an estimated $450,000 annual rental fees. The regional bloc has also outsourced some offices for the East African Legislative Assembly and the East African Court of Justice because of the growing size of regional organization.
When completed, the EAC Headquarters will house the three organs of the CommunitySecretariat, EALA and East African Court of Justice. It will also have offices for all members of the parliament, the secretariat staff; a multi-purpose spacious plenary hall, restaurant, court rooms, EA parliament, about 400-car parking facility and a public and press gallery, among others.
SUKHDEV CHHATBAR in ARUSHA, 3rd March 2009 @ 11:04
Construction of the ultra-modern East African Community (EAC) headquarters in Arusha begins next September and is irreversible, says project manager Mr Phil Klerruu. His statement comes just days after reports that Kenya has objected to the scheduled construction on grounds that Tanzania has yet to fully demonstrate its commitment to the EAC integration. He added that tenders for construction of the EAC Complex, including sub-contract works, would be finalized starting next week.
Construction will take off as planned, he told the 'Daily News' yesterday. The argument was raised at last weeks EAC Council of Ministers meeting here by Kenyas Minister for EAC, Mr Jeffah Kingi. Apparently, Mr Kingis reaction was based on Tanzanias position over land issues in the ongoing Common Market draft proposals, in which he accuses Tanzania of foot-dragging -- and hence delaying conclusion of the negotiations. The Chief Executive Officer (CEO) of the East African Law Society (EALS), Don Deya, told the 'Daily News' yesterday that it was an overreaction (by Mr Kingi).
He said that negotiations on a Common Market have never been an easy thing anywhere (in the world). There are always ups and downs over such contentious issues it takes time to come to conclusions, Mr Deya said, when asked to comment over the Kenyan suggestion. Mr Alute Mugway, former Secretary General of EALS, said that EAC Treaty clearly stipulated that the headquarters shall be in Arusha in accordance with Article 136(1).
People in leadership positions should never give reckless statements which can endanger the integration efforts, he cautioned. Mr Simon Mapolu, an independent consultant, said: No minister can just go to a meeting and decide to stall any project already endorsed by the EAC Summit and the East African Legislative Assembly. Such irresponsible statements can wreak the Community, he warned, adding that such provocative proposition -- unfortunately comes from a senior Kenyan government minister -- could harm the Community, which was still overcoming the wounds of the 1977 break-up.
The former EAC collapsed 32 years mainly because of divergent political and economic perceptions of the founding partner statesKenya, Uganda and Tanzania. Tanzanias Minister for EAC, Dr Kamala, was recently quoted as saying that Tanzania would not be rushed into the Common Market negotiations which he said could impact negatively on its people, but that the country was still committed to firm talks. The multi-purpose headquarters is expected to be ready the latest by September 2011.
The 30.2billion/- (Euros 14 million) complex, which will be built adjacent to the Arusha International Conference Centre (AICC), is financed by the German government. In 2005, the Tanzania government donated the 10 acres of land on which the EAC Complex will sit. The planning and design stage of the project is 100 per cent complete, said Kleruu, who is also EAC Senior Estates Management Officer.
Germany, which had committed itself initially with Euros eight million, has topped up the construction costs with another Euros six million following revised costs following the entry of two new EAC members -- Rwanda and Burundi -- into the regional bloc some two years ago. Originally, the construction was expected to start in 2007. Currently, EAC is housed at the Arusha International Conference Centre (AICC) and pays an estimated $450,000 annual rental fees. The regional bloc has also outsourced some offices for the East African Legislative Assembly and the East African Court of Justice because of the growing size of regional organization.
When completed, the EAC Headquarters will house the three organs of the CommunitySecretariat, EALA and East African Court of Justice. It will also have offices for all members of the parliament, the secretariat staff; a multi-purpose spacious plenary hall, restaurant, court rooms, EA parliament, about 400-car parking facility and a public and press gallery, among others.
MzalendoHalisi
JF-Expert Member
- Jun 24, 2007
- 4,679
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Ingefaa kama ni maoni tu ya Waziri na sii msimamo wa serikali basi ajiuzulu!
Mwana wa Mungu
JF-Expert Member
- Aug 14, 2008
- 1,003
- 85
wanatuhonga arusha kama makao makuu? hahaha, hawajui kuwa hiyo arusha ni geneva ya afrika toka muda mrefu? pia ni hague ya afrika itakayo wahusudu kina raila na kibaki pia. hatuwezi kuburuzwa. alafu, hivi mbona tuna rafiki wengine kusini huku kama malawi, mozambique,zambia na DRC? kwanini hawa kenya wasiende tu kwa rafiki zao kaskazini kina sudan,somalia na chad etc. kwasababu huku kusini kwao tumegoma, walale mbele na kaskazini. uganda hana sauti. yeye ni colony la Kenya. bila kenya hajapitisha vitu toka bahari ya hindi. so is Rwanda. kuna siku mkichokozana mkahamia tz nako tutafunga afu mle majani. bora we Burundi ujisimamie kimya kama rafiki wa tz. Mungu ibariki Tanzania.
Augustine Moshi
JF-Expert Member
- Apr 22, 2006
- 2,556
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Usiilaumu Uganda. Iko makini. Ingependa kutumia Mombasa na Dar kwa usawa, lakini bandari ya Dar inawashinda hata Watanzania. Tunajua siku hizi mkazi wa Dar akitaka kontena lije haraka ataliagiza lipitie Mombasa.
Kenya wametingisha kiberiti. Nadhan kimejaa.
Kama kweli Mkutano wa Wakuu wa Nchi za EAC utaletewa, toka Kenya, pendekezo kwamba makao makuu yahamie Nairobi, basi tutachukua hatua thabiti wakati huo. Kwa sasa tutulie tu. Mipango ya ujenzi wa makao makuu inaendelea. (By the way, mbona ujenzi wa twin towers uligharimu zaidi ya mara 10 ya huu wa makao makuu ya EAC?)
Kenya wametingisha kiberiti. Nadhan kimejaa.
Kama kweli Mkutano wa Wakuu wa Nchi za EAC utaletewa, toka Kenya, pendekezo kwamba makao makuu yahamie Nairobi, basi tutachukua hatua thabiti wakati huo. Kwa sasa tutulie tu. Mipango ya ujenzi wa makao makuu inaendelea. (By the way, mbona ujenzi wa twin towers uligharimu zaidi ya mara 10 ya huu wa makao makuu ya EAC?)