Hivi ni kweli kabla ya hii mipaka ya kisiasa, Moshi ilikuwa Kenya na Mombasa ilikuwa Tanzania?

Hivi ni kweli kabla ya hii mipaka ya kisiasa, Moshi ilikuwa Kenya na Mombasa ilikuwa Tanzania?

Johnny Sack said:
Kabla ya ukoloni nchi iliyokuwepo ni Zanzibar pekee, na Mombasa ilikuwa sehemu ya Zanzibar, so ni kweli Mombasa ilikuwa sehemu ya Tanzania kwa sababu Zanzibar ni Tanzania kwa sasa
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Ukiwauliza kabla ya waarabu kuja zanzibar
Hapi kulikuwa na watu gani?hawana majibu

Historia inauotakiwa kufundishwa ni ile kabla ya ukoloni/biashara ya utumwa

Ova
 
Stuxnet said:
Twende sawa hapa japo ipo kwa lugha iliyokuja kwa meli.
.
There is something odd about the map of Kenya. From Lake Victoria to the Coast, the borderline moves in a straight line that is only broken by a small kink. That unassuming curve would not be significant if it did not conveniently place Mount Kilimanjaro, Africa’s highest peak, on Tanzanian soil.

The most popular myth about how the all-important curve came into being is that Queen Victoria bequeathed Mount Kilimanjaro to her nephew, the future Kaiser Wilhelm II of Prussia, as a birthday gift. While the story is romantic to a point, and easy to use as proof of the insolent attitude of the European powers in their demarcation of Africa, it is untrue.

The borderline between Tanzania and Kenya tells the story of the arbitrary nature of the demarcation process that was later legitimised by an official mapping conducted in the early 1900s. While the Berlin Conference was indeed a party where different powers shared Africa like a giant pie, the notion that the Queen gave away an entire snow-capped peak on a whim is unsubstantiated.

There seems to have been an agreement between Germany and Britain as to the location of Mount Kilimanjaro, with the only point of contention being where the demarcation line from the mountain to Lake Victoria ended. The British proposed a line from Kilimanjaro to Speke Gulf while the Germans proposed a line from Kilimanjaro to North of Musoma. Another map from the German side shows a straight demarcation line from the North Eastern corner of Lake Victoria to Mombasa. In both maps, Kilimanjaro is part of what is today mainland Tanzania.

Schneppen Heinz’s Why Kilimanjaro is in Tanzania (1996) offers a more plausible reason for the anomaly. “Put more simply, the Germans had gained Kilimanjaro but not Mombasa, the British Mombasa but not Kilimanjaro. Now it becomes evident why Kilimanjaro is in Tanzania: because Mombasa is in Kenya.”

Schneppen’s assertion is based primarily on the terms of the Heligoland-Zanzibar Treaty of 1 July 1890. In the Treaty, Germany and Great Britain agreed on several territorial interests. Germany gave up its claim of Zanzibar Sultanate-which then stretched to what is today the Kenyan coast-in exchange for Heligoland and the coast of Dar es Salaam.

Heligoland is a strategic island that covers the approaches of Germany North Sea naval bases. Wilhelm viewed Heligoland as a primary strategic addition to his plan to outdo the British in naval power.

The young prince supposedly complained to his grandmother that she had two mountains while he had none. The matriarch, aptly referred to as the “grandmother of Europe”, then ordered her subjects to grant the future Kaiser one high snow-capped mountain in East Africa.

This sentimental “lavish royal gift” story was most likely the product of a Victorian satirist. It then flourished as a marketing gimmick fanned by tour operators and other tourism stakeholders.

In the years between the early 1880s and Germany’s defeat in World War I, its East African territory included what are now Burundi, Rwanda, and mainland Tanzania, then known as Tanganyika. The Zanzibar Sultanate was Britain’s proxy.

While the Heligoland treaty does not include any mention of a mountain, the demarcation lines do not seem to have changed around that part of the borderline. It seems more plausible that in giving away its claim on Zanzibar and its entire Sultanate, which then included what is now the Kenyan Coast, the Germans acquired Kilimanjaro.

Germany would not have been very concerned about giving up the Sultanate’s coastline because the deal left them with the Dar es Salaam coast.

The story of the Queen who gave away a mountain to her grandson has withstood the test of time, but it is a fabrication. While it does typify the excesses and arbitrary partitioning with which the boundaries of modern-day East Africa were determined, there is no single shred of evidence to support it. There is a Guinness World Record somewhere in the true story. Six years after the Heligoland Treaty, the pro-British Sultan Hamad died and was succeeded by Sultan Khalid. The British preferred Hamud, another pro-British, and used a clause in the 1886 treaty between Zanzibar and Britain to declare an ultimatum for Khalid to resign.

The battle to oust him begun at 9am on 27 August and ended at or before 9.40am, a mere 40 minutes later, booking its place as the shortest war in history.

The Heligoland-Zanzibar Treaty ended Germany’s interests in the Zanzibar Sultanate, hence Schneppen’s assertion that Mount Kilimanjaro was part of the deal, albeit unrecorded in the terms of the treaty.

Queen Victoria might have had her moments of whims, but Mount Kilimanjaro was definitely not one of them. From a very East African perspective, it was either Mombasa or Mount Kilimanjaro. A coastline for a mountain sounds like a fair deal.
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Huu ndo uungwana. Mwandishi. Tuliosoma hiki kitu chuoni,tunakuelewa
 
Mrangi,
Unauliza huku shingo umetoa.kuwa kabla ya Waarabu kuja Zanzibar na hapa nadhani unawakusudia Waomani Zanzibar ilikuwa inakaliwa na watu gani?

Hili si swali la kumshinda mtu yeyote kulijibu.

Visiwa hivi vya Zanzibar na Pemba wakiishi watu weusi.

Kuna kitabu, ''Omani Sultans in Zanzibar,'' (1988) kimeandikwa na Ahmed Hamoud Al-Maamiry.

Katika kitabu hiki anaeleza kuwa Waarabu walifika Pwani ya Afrika Mashariki miaka mingi sana kabla ya Wazungu na Wareno walipowasili 1498 waliwakuta Waarabu ni wenyeji sehemu hizo pamoja na hii Zanzibar.

Wareno waliikalia Oman kutokea India mwaka wa 1508 na mwaka wa 1650 Waomani walifanikiwa kuwatoa nchini kwao.

Wazanzibari wakaomba msaada Oman iwasaidie kuwaondoa Wareno nchini kwao na hili lilifanyika bila ya masharti yoyote.

Waomani waliizingira ngome ya Wareno Fort Jesus kwa siku 33 na mwisho Wareno walisalimu amri na kuondoka Pwani ya Afrika ya Mashariki 1698.

Hivi ndivyo walivyopatikana masultani 12 waliotawala Zanzibar.

Lakini muhimu ni lazima utambue kuwa kufikia hapo Waarabu na Waafrika walishachanganya damu na hivi leo ndiyo unawaona Wazanzibari hawa ambao watu kutoka Tanganyika wanapenda kuwaona kuwa ni wageni Waarabu.

Kwa bahati mbaya wapo wasiopenda udugu huu na hili na wanatamani sana kizazi hiki kinachokwenda nyuma karne na karne kionekane kuwa Zanzibar si kwao, visiwa hivi vya hawa Waafrika tena wametokea Tanganyika haizidi hata miaka 100 kiasi ukimuuliza wapi kaburi la babu yake hana pa kuonyesha.

Ndiyo hawa leo wanauliza hapa kabla ya kuja Waarabu Zanzibar walikuwa wanaishi watu gani?

Jibu nimelitoa kuwa katika visiwa hivi wakiishi watu weusi.

Hawa watu weusi wakachanganya damu na Waarabu na ndiyo hawa Wazanzibari waliopo Zanzibar hivi sasa karibia karne saba.

Ukweli huu hawautaki.

Wanajifanya hawajui kuwa kuna Mzanzibari Riyami ana damu ya Kimanyema.

Mzanzibari Barwani ana damu ya Kimakonde.

Baadhi ya hawa mimi ni ndugu zangu na mimi sina chembe ya damu ya Kiarabu.

Wapo wasiopenda Zanzibar hii na ipo sababu lakini hawana ujasiri wa kusema.

20220301_220242.jpg
 
Mohamed Said said:
Mrangi,
Kabla ya Waarabu kuja Zanzibar na hapa nadhani unawakusudia Waomani Zanzibar iliuwa inakaliwa na watu gani.

Hili si swali la kumshinda mtu yeyote kulijibu.
Visiwa hivi vya Zanzibar na Pemba wakiishi watu weusi.

Kuna kitabu, ''Omani Sultans in Zanzibar,'' (1988) kimeandikwa na Ahmed Hamoud Al-Maamiry.

Katika kitabu hiki anaeleza kuwa Waarabu walifika Pwani ya Afrika Mashariki miaka mingi sana kabla ya Wazungu na Wareno walipowasili 1498 waliwakuta Waarabu ni wenyeji sehemu hizo pamoja na hii Zanzibar.

Wareno waliikalia Oman kutokea India mwaka wa 1508 na mwaka wa 1650 Waomani walifanikiwa kuwatoa nchini kwao.

Wazanzibari wakaomba msaada Oman iwasaidie kuwaondoa Wareno nchini kwao na hili lilifanyika bila ya sharti yoyote.

Waomani waliizingira ngome ya Wareno Fort Jesus kwa siku 33 na mwisho Wareno walisalimu amri na kuondoka Pwani ya Afrika ya Mashariki 1698.

Hivi ndivyo walivyopatikana masultani 12 waliotawala Zanzibar.

Lakini muhimu ni lazima utambue kuwa kufikia hapo Waarabu na Waafrika walioana na hivi leo ndiyo unawaona Wazanzibari hawa waliochanganya damu.

Kwa bahati mbaya wapo wasiopenda hili na kulifumbia macho wakitaka kizazi hiki kinachokwenda nyuma karne na karne kionekane kuwa Zanzibar si kwao kwao ni hawa Waafrika tena wametokea Tanganyika haizidi hata miaka 100 kiasi ukimuuliza wapi kaburi la babu yake hana pa kuonyesha.

Ndiyo hawa leo wanauliza kabla ya kuja Waarabu Zanzibar walikuwa wanaishi watu gani?

Jibu nimelitoa kuwa katika visiwa hivi wakiishi watu weusi na hawa watu weusi wakachanganya damu na Waarabu na ndiyo hawa Wazanzibari waliopo Zanzibar hivi sasa karibia karne saba.

Mzanzibari Riyami ana damu ya Kimanyema.
Mzanzibari Barwani ana damu ya Kimakonde.

Baadhi ya hawa mimi ni ndugu zangu na mimi sina chembe ya damu ya Kiarabu.

Wapo wasiopenda hili na ipo sababu lakini hawana ujasiri wa kusema.
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Nyoosha vizuri hapa. Waarabu wa Oman walifikia Pemba miaka hiyo uliyoitaja na kule Unguja kulikuwa na wenyeji ambao ni Waafrika chini ya Sultani wao Mwinyimkuu. Then Wareno walitishia kutaka kuikalia Unguja ndipo Sultani Mwinyimkuu akaomba msaada kwa Sultan wa Waoman waliopo Pemba. Sultan wa Oman kweli akaweza kutetea kisiwa cha Unguja kisikaliwe na Wareno.

Baada ya ushindi Sultan wa Pemba akamuuliza Sultan Mwinyimkuu wa Unguja kuwa atamlipa nini baada ya yeye kuwapiga Wareno? Mwinyimkuu akamuambia nitakupa watu wangu wakulimie bure. Sultan wa Pemba hakufurahishwa na jibu hilo ndipo akamuua Mwinyimkuu kwa gobole.

Kama nimekosea naomba radhi maana nilisikia tu hiyo sehemu kutoka kwa wana Historia wakongwe
 
Stuxnet said:
Nyoosha vizuri hapa. Waarabu wa Oman walifikia Pemba miaka hiyo uliyoitaja na kule Unguja kulikuwa na wenyeji ambao ni Waafrika chini ya Sultani wao Mwinyimkuu. Then Wareno walitishia kutaka kuikalia Unguja ndipo Sultani Mwinyimkuu akaomba msaada kwa Sultan wa Waoman waliopo Pemba. Sultan wa Oman kweli akaweza kutetea kisiwa cha Unguja kisikaliwe na Wareno.

Baada ya ushindi Sultan wa Pemba akamuuliza Sultan Mwinyimkuu wa Unguja kuwa atamlipa nini baada ya yeye kuwapiga Wareno? Mwinyimkuu akamuambia nitakupa watu wangu wakulimie bure. Sultan wa Pemba hakufurahishwa na jibu hilo ndipo akamuua Mwinyimkuu kwa gobole.

Kama nimekosea naomba radhi maana nilisikia tu hiyo sehemu kutoka kwa wana Historia wakongwe
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Stux...
Nifahamishe ninyooshe nini kabla sijajibu hayo mengine.
 
Imekuwepo migration ya watu pale kwa muda mrefu. Julius Nyerere,kwa mfano,babu yake( grandfather) ni mjaluo.
Mama Maria Nyerere,kwa mfano,babu yake ni mjaluo.
Lakini Watanzania tukiitaka Mombasa,labda Wakenya watakuwa very happy kutupatia. Jomo Kenyatta alikuwa ana complain sana kuhusu Mombasa.
 
Johnny Sack said:
Kabla ya ukoloni nchi iliyokuwepo ni Zanzibar pekee, na Mombasa ilikuwa sehemu ya Zanzibar, so ni kweli Mombasa ilikuwa sehemu ya Tanzania kwa sababu Zanzibar ni Tanzania kwa sasa
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Hata kilomita kumi za ukanda mzima wa pwani ya Tanganyika ni mali ya Zanzibar, arafu Zanzibar sio Tanzania, ila Tanzania ni Zanzibar na Tanganyika,mnawapotosha wajukuu.
 
Poppy Hatonn said:
Imekuwepo migration ya watu pale kwa muda mrefu. Julius Nyerere,kwa mfano,babu yake( grandfather) ni mjaluo.
Mama Maria Nyerere,kwa mfano,babu yake ni mjaluo.
Lakini Watanzania tukiitaka Mombasa,labda Wakenya watakuwa very happy kutupatia. Jomo Kenyatta alikuwa ana complain sana kuhusu Mombasa.
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Aisee🤣🤣🤣
Babu yake Nyerere ni Mjaluo?

Mama Maria Nyerere Babu yake Jaluo.

Uzanaki na Ujaluo wali na wali?
 
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