Uraia Pacha Tanzania: Siasa ya Bernard Membe na hatma yake

[Sideeq]

When it came down to "allegiance", to whom will the person with multiple uraia be pledged? Dual citizenship will confer facilities and privileges without obligations. Apart from marginal economic and social benefits, it can create ambiguous loyalties among people holding it.
What status will you confer to aid donors that give a lot of handouts to our government if you view the magnitude of aid they give?
How could someone be a citizen of two countries at the same time? I bet it could be undermining the notion of nationhood especially to a nascent country like TZ.
Assume the US is engaging into war with your second country(probably your mother country) and you are living in the US, what will you do in this situation or you will make it the Arab style, suicide bomber, which in turn will result to negative repercussions with your community living the US.

Giving reasons of remittances back home as justification to conferring dual citizenship is too vague a definition of granting the status to make any credible conclusion about its establishment.

If allowed, the decision will be based on narrow short term motivations and should be opposed.

Ngoja nitafute Kamusi ya Kiingereza inisaidie kujua tofauti ya Citizenship na Nationality...ntarudi.

 

[Bobuk]

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Thus, in my view, Dual citizenship MUST be enshrined in our new Constitution.
Great Thinkers, hii imekaaje?

Mimi ninaona imetulia na nina support dual citizenship.

More serious Je, umeshatoa haya maoni na mengine kwenye tume ya katiba mpya?

Kama bado tafahadili tembelea www.katiba.go.tz au tuma maoni yako katibu@katiba.go.tz

GTs wote ambao hamjatoa maoni yenu kwa njia ya mikutano au kutuma maoni yenu kuhusu katiba mpya ninaomba mfanye hivyo please. Hakuna mtu atakayetupatia katiba NZURI kama hatutatoe maoni yetu nini tunataka kiwemo au kisiwemo kwenye katiba mpya. This is an opportunity we can't afford to miss. Let's build our country kwa kutoa maoni yetu kwenye tume ya katiba mpya.

 

[cham]

Uraia wa nchi mbili ni hatari kwa nchi yetu. Haufai. Nyerere hakuwa mjinga kuukataa. Sababu zilizofanya kukataliwa bado zipo.

 

[MkamaP]

Hii nilikuwa sijui, kumbe walioa/olewa hadi leo wanaruhusiwa kuwa na Dual, that good stuff.

 

[MkamaP]

When it came down to "allegiance", to whom will the person with multiple uraia be pledged? Dual citizenship will confer facilities and privileges without obligations. Apart from marginal economic and social benefits, it can create ambiguous loyalties among people holding it.
What status will you confer to aid donors that give a lot of handouts to our government if you view the magnitude of aid they give?
How could someone be a citizen of two countries at the same time? I bet it could be undermining the notion of nationhood especially to a nascent country like TZ.
Assume the US is engaging into war with your second country(probably your mother country) and you are living in the US, what will you do in this situation or you will make it the Arab style, suicide bomber, which in turn will result to negative repercussions with your community living the US.

Giving reasons of remittances back home as justification to conferring dual citizenship is too vague a definition of granting the status to make any credible conclusion about its establishment.

If allowed, the decision will be based on narrow short term motivations and should be opposed.

If any, please go to more than 98% countries over the world, and ask them how they made it to happen. I think, sometimes it's cumbersome for getting yourself down and minimized to the lowest order possible.

 

[Gad ONEYA]

If any, please go to more than 98% countries over the world, and ask them how they made it to happen. I think, sometimes it's cumbersome for getting yourself down and minimized to the lowest order possible.

What is the source of your data for this 98%?

 

[MkamaP]

what is source of your data for this 98%?

google.com

 

[Bobuk]

Hii nilikuwa sijui, kumbe walioa/olewa hadi leo wanaruhusiwa kuwa na Dual, that good stuff.

Mzee sio hivyo! Katiba yetu haiko GENDER SENSITIVE. Ni kwamba Wanawake wote waliolewa na wanaume Watanzania wanaruhusiwa kuwa na dual citizenship kama nchi zao za kuzaliwa zinaruhusu dual citizenship. Mfano Mwanamke Mmarekani aliyeolewa na mwanaume Mtanzania anaruhusiwa kuwa na dual citizenship yaani uraia wa Marekani na Uraia wa Tanzania.

Lakini ni Kinyume pale mwanamke mtanzania anapoolewa na mwanaume asiye Mtanzania (Huyu mwanamke anaishi Tanzania na ni Mtazania wa kuzaliwa). Mfano Mwanamke Mtanzania akiolewa na mwanaume Mmarekani, ili mwanaume huyo apate URAIA wa Tanzania inabidi afanye mambo mawili, kwanza aombe uraia wa Tanzania (naturalization), pili kwakuwa Tanzania haturusu dual citizenship huyo mwanaume mmarekani inabidi pia AUKANE URAIA wa Marekani.

You can see why I'm saying our constitution is not GENDER SENSITIVE

 

[MkamaP]

Mzee sio hivyo! Katiba yetu haiko GENDER SENSITIVE. Ni kwamba Wanawake wote waliolewa na wanaume Watanzania wanaruhusiwa kuwa na dual citizenship kama nchi zao za kuzaliwa zinaruhusu dual citizenship. Mfano Mwanamke Mmarekani aliyeolewa na mwanaume Mtanzania anaruhusiwa kuwa na dual citizenship yaani uraia wa Marekani na Uraia wa Tanzania.

Lakini ni Kinyume pale mwanamke mtanzania anapoolewa na mwanaume asiye Mtanzania (Huyu mwanamke anaishi Tanzania na ni Mtazania wa kuzaliwa). Mfano Mwanamke Mtanzania akiolewa na mwanaume Mmarekani, ili mwanaume huyo apate URAIA wa Tanzania inabidi afanye mambo mawili, kwanza aombe uraia wa Tanzania (naturalization), pili kwakuwa Tanzania haturusu dual citizenship huyo mwanaume mmarekani inabidi pia AUKANE URAIA wa Marekani.

You can see why I'm saying our constitution is not GENDER SENSITIVE

Mkuu wangu
Hii katiba mbona inanichanganya sasa, naomba nielewe hapa, kwa hiyo Mtanzania mwanamume aliyeoa haruhusiwi kuwa na Dual ila mkewe ndo anaruhusiwa kuwa na dual? Ama hapo imekaa je?

Kwa mwanmke hapo nimekupata. Kama ni hivyo, katiba hii inapingana na haki za binadamu.

 

[galiya]

GAD ONEYA
The answer is yes

 

[galiya]

TUKUTUKU
Una ushahidi gani kua sheikh ponda ni raia wa Afghanistan???

 

[galiya]

CHAM
Tiririka nyerere alitumia sababu gani kukataa dual citizenship?

 

[galiya]

BOBUK
We umeishatoa maoni yako kwenye tume ya katiba?

 

[galiya]

MKAMAP

Kati ya wote waliotoa maoni, hoja zako zimenipa food for thought..kwamba iwapo mtu ni Raia wa US ma pia Raia wa TZ je US na TZ zikiwa vitani mtu utakua upande gani iwapo una dual nationality? Hii kali

 

[Bobuk]

Mkuu wangu
Hii katiba mbona inanichanganya sasa, naomba nielewe hapa, kwa hiyo Mtanzania mwanamume aliyeoa haruhusiwi kuwa na Dual ila mkewe ndo anaruhusiwa kuwa na dual? Ama hapo imekaa je?
Kwa mwanmke hapo nimekupata. Kama ni hivyo, katiba hii inapingana na haki za binadamu.

Mtanzania Mwanaume mwenye Uraia wa Tanzania aliyeoa mwanamke foreigner haruhusiwi kuwa na dual citizenship kwasababu Tanzania hairuhusu dual citizenship, EXCEPT kwa makundi haya mawili. Kwanza watanzania ambao hawajafikisha umri wa miaka 18 na Pili kwa WANAWAKE foreigners ambao wameolewa na raia wa Tanzania.

Hii ndiyo katiba yetu haiko gender sensitive

 

[Bobuk]

BOBUK
We umeishatoa maoni yako kwenye tume ya katiba?

Ndiyo mzee nimeshatoa kwa maandishi, bado nasubiri tume ifike Wilayani kwangu, nikatoa pia mbele ya tume. Kama wewe bado anza kwa kutuma maoni yako kwenda

Website www.katiba.go.tz barua pepe katibu@katiba.go.tz

 

[Gad ONEYA]

What is source of your data for this 98%?

Out of 190 or so UN members, only about 40 allow dual citizenship. -(The Economics Times)

 

[Gad ONEYA]

The poor mind sets, always ready to embrace the negatives...

Reasonable people can disagree and one of the reasons we want to have a discussion is to get issues out of this matter in the open so people can talk about them. Otherwise I can argue that people with dual citizenship, their loyalties are always misdirected!

 

[maskin]

mi nahisi mkama p yupo sawa kabisa ilivyoandikwa kubadili uraia kwa sababu ya kuoa haita adhiri uraia wako ,

na hii sio KATIBA ni sheria ya uraia Tanzania Citizenship Act 1995 nahisi mtaalamu galiya ka edit kipengele cha ,sheria kipo hivi kama kilivyo kutoka kwa sheria



(4) A citizen of the United Republic shall cease to be a citizen it(a) having attained the age of eighteen years, he acquired the citizenship
of some country other than the United Republic by a voluntary

act other than marriage;

SIO S. 7(4) provides"Any Citizen of Tanzania shall cease to be a citizen if having attained the age of 18 years, he acquires the citizenship of some country other than Tanzania by a voluntary act other than marriage".

na ukiangalia kwa kiingereza cha nkawaida hii section imelenga zaidi wanaume,ndo maana wametumia zaidi HE akina mama wamepewa section 5 ambayo inawakandamiza kiaina

Ila ukienda kwa watendaji wizarani wanajifanya hawajui kiingereza watakuambia tu kuwa "dual citizeship haikubaliki tanzania" kuhusu akina mama na section 5 Wamesema kabisa woman


(5) Notwithstanding any other provisions of this Act, a person whoattains the age of eighteen years, or who, being a woman, is or has been
married shall not, if that person is a citizen of some country other than
the United Republic, be entitled to be naturalised as a citizen of the
United Republic unless he renounces the citizenship of that other country,
takes the oath of allegiance and makes and registers a declaration
prescribed by Parliament regarding his intention as to residence.

Sa sa utaona akina mama wanaonewa na sheria wao wanatakiwa declaration bila hivyo sio raia wa tanzania

Hayo ni mawazo yangu tu kama kuna mwingine anaweza kuchangia hilo

 

[Ubumuntu]

The Tanzania citizenship is governed by the Citizenship Act, 1995. This Act proscribes the right to dual citizenship. S. 7(4) provides"Any Citizen of Tanzania shall cease to be a citizen if having attained the age of 18 years, he acquires the citizenshp of some country other than Tanzania by a voluntary act other than marriage".

Good. And it should remain like that. Your citizenship ceases when you opt for another nation's citizenship.

The Tanzanian Constitution, 1977 unlike Constitutions of other countries eg Kenya and Uganda, is silent on the right to dual citizenship. Generally, citizenship in our Constitution is merely mentioned en passant.

Is it necessary for our constitution to have similar agendas like Kenya's and Uganda's constitutions?!
It is not necessary.

A significant number of Tanzanians are now living abroad and are scattered all over the world. They are now commonly known as THE DIASPORA COMMUNITY. Mean estimate is putting the number of Tanzanians in Diaspora at 2Million. This group, thus, account for 5% of our total population. This is an important constituency which has to be represented in the new constitution, in my humble view.

Who came up with such a number? Reference please!!
They might be doctored statistics to suit the 'diaspora's quest and interest'

In addition, I see no humbleness with the title of this thread!!

There are many factors obtaining in Tanzania which have contributed to the exodus of skilled talent. They include poor conditions of service, potential human rights abuses, nepotism and favoratism, disregard for local talent, scarcirty of jobs, poor salaries, limited access to education, the 2001 Zanzibar chaos etc.

Good. But do these factors compel you into throwing your citizenship into a trash-bin? How about using such factors as driving forces for you to acquire extra skills abroad, and then come back to join hands in removing those pushy factors?

At the beginning, the issue of citizenship was resented but now it was beginning to be understood.

Who said so? What makes you see that the issue is now being understood? I still resent the issue; I see no valid arguments for its acceptance in TZ.

Tanzania has been benefitting from people living abroad through remittances. Apart from that Tanzanians living abroad have different professions and are experienced in several sectors of the economy, hence they would make immense contribution if they came back to work here. Some of them command respect the world over hence if properly utilized they could greatly contribute to their mother country development.

Provision of remittances does not necessarily require someone to have dual citizenship. I have been getting remittances from relatives and friends who are still Tanzanians!!

The role of the Tanzanian Diaspora community has been, inter aia, to provide socio-economic support for some Tanzanians back home. Due to the extended family system, most of Tanzanians living abroad find themselves being regarded as crucial breadwinners of not only their immediate families but also their close family relatives. They normally pay for most of the financial needs of their dependants back at home such as medical and education fees, accommodations rentals and social events such as religious gatherings, funerals, birthday and wedding parties.

Good. These can still be done without the need for a dual citizenship!!

in 2006, the Law Reform Commission of TZ under the Chairmanship of Judge A. Bahati recommended introduction of Dual Citizenship. The Commission stated that the issue deserved " a possitive and foward- looking consideration and that it was high time Tanzania adopted dual citizenship because in a globalized world, the country could not develop without interraction with other nations".

Really? Could you provide examples of countries that have developed right after dual citizenship was adopted?
Could you also share with me the commission's report?

More importantly, many developing nations such as Ghana have made significant economic strides after allowing dual citizenship a few years ago.

Oh! I see. Reference please!

Furthermore, Hon. B. Membe, for Foreign Affairs, a distingushed Diplomat stated the following in the National Assembly when responding to a question from one Vicky Kamata (CCM)
"African countries have been benefitting from people living abroad through remittances. For the past year, a total of USD 40 Billion entered Africa through remittances out of which Tanzania received USD 250M.
We are creating a good environment that will enable Tanzanians living abroad work in the country. We recognise them and respect their contribution to the country economic development. In the newly launched 5 year development plan (2011-2015) the issue of Diaspora has been highlighted and given priority. This dual citizenship issue will also be included in the Constitutional debate..."

An answer from Membe?? I see vested interests!! He always gets bougie when he talks about dual citizenship.

"Tanzania received USD 250 million". Really??
Damn! That is a loot of grain.

He should have explained further on how the money has trickled down and boosted the economy.

"The issue will be included in a constitutional debate".
Really? Can people in Ubaruku suggest for a dual citizenship? Will it help to alleviate their poverty?
No it won't.

But it will help the few elites to serve their interests.

Thus, in my view, Dual citizenship MUST be enshrined in our new Constitution.

Great Thinkers, hii imekaaje?

You are entitled to air your views. However, you are not entitled to come with such an authoritative conclusion.

Haijakaa vizuri aisee.