Nimehamua kuifanyia research paper issue ya kuwa Iddi Amin alituzidi ubora wa zana za kivita. Mpaka sasa sources zangu zinaonyesha kuwa vita vya 1972, Tanzania ilifanya uvamizi Uganda kwa lengo la kumrudisha Obote. Lakini kutokana na tactical errors tulirudisha majeshi nyuma.
Katika vita vya 1978, tactically Tanzania was superior. Kuhusu zana Idd Amin hakuwa na advantage yoyote. Bado utafiti wa data na namba unakuja.
Uganda imekaa kikabila sana, kuna kanda watampenda na kuna kanda watamchukia!! Lakini issue ya kuwa alikuwa dictator ilikuwa published sana na waingereza. Nenda kwao kaskazini mashariki sema hayo uliyosema utashangaa utakavyotukanwa mkuu!!
Idd Amin hakuwapenda na hakuwa tayari kuwafuata wazungu na ndio siri ya kuitwa hivyo, alichofanya idd amin ni sawa kabisa na viongozi wengine wengi wa kipindi kile..miaka ya 60,70
It will interest you even Nyerere some publications called him dictator!!
Nyerre had a deep passion for change and hatred toward imperialism. He helped to lead his country to independence in the late 1950's, early 1960's, laying a foundation for his country even before he became official president and dictator. Julius Nyerere- Tanzania
The death of Julius Nyerere, African independence leader and longtime dictator of Tanzania, evoked a flood of encomiums worldwide. The praise is misplaced. Nyerere's approach devastated much of postcolonial Africa (Forbes, 1999).
http://archive.lib.msu.edu/DMC/African Journals/pdfs/political science/volume8n1/ajps008001004.pdf
Nimekupa mifano tu mkuu, nimekaa uganda na ninaweza kukueleza mengi ya huko, Stop calling Amin a dictator, just because you studied that in history does mean so!! just because western propaganda it does mean so!! waingereza ndio walimuita sana Amin baada ya kuwafanyia yale mambo!!! USA at that very time mnamwita amin dicator bado walikuwa na mahusiano mazuri sana ya kibiashara, please find in literature!!
Usisahau na zana alizoletewa na Libya. Sisi kilichotusaidia ni mizinga ya Katyusha tuliyoazimwa na Angola. Amin alikuwa hajawahi kuisikia mizinga hiyo.
Wewe kichwa kweli kweli. Natamani ungekuwa Mwalimu wa Le Mutuz.Ndio tulikuwa na Katyusha (saba-saba). Nita-compile.
Zakumi, ile mizinga walokuwa wakiita sabasaba inasemekana tuliiteka kwa askari wa Ghadaff na kuitumia dhidi ya majeshi ya Uganda. Hii mizinga inakaa juu ya gari ikiwa na mitutu kama nane hivi, sijui kama umeiona ktk vita ya Iraq na Libya na hupiga kwa kupishana nukta chache sana..Siku hizi imekuwa maarufu sana ktk vita badala la mizinga mikubwa ambayo inakuwa stationed chini.Ndio tulikuwa na Katyusha (saba-saba). Nita-compile.
W. J. Malecela,
Nadhani ulikuwa kijana Mzima Mwenye akili timamu wakati wa Matatizo kati ya Tanzania na Uganda, kama unakumbuka wakati huo East African Community ilikuwa hai, lakini Idd Amini bado alikuwa anafanya Mashambulizi ya hapa na pale Maeneo ya Mutukula, Maeneo hayo Wananchi ni Wakulima na pia ni Wafugaji, walijuwa wanashambuliwa na kuchukuliwa Mifugo yao au Mashamba yao kutibuliwa na Vifaru au saa nyingine wanajeshi wanavuka Mpaka wanafanya vitisho na kuondoka.
Na unakumbuka Nyerere alikuwa hafanyi chochote, Idd Amin alikuwa anamwita Nyerere Mwanamke wake, na Unakumbuka wakati mmoja alikuwa kwenye Ulingo wa boxing akasema atafungwa Mkongo wake wa kulia na Macho atatumia Mkono wa kulia kupambana na Nyerere ulingoni na bado atampiga mpaka atamuua.
Alikuwa na Kejeli nyingi, Sasa Idd Amin hakuwa mtu mzuri kwa Wananchi wake aliua karibia watu 400,000 nchini kwake tu, baadhi ya miili ya watu wake aliila.
Sasa Makamu wake wa Urais aliyeitwa General Mustafa Idrisa, alipata ajali ya Gari ya kiajabu ajabu na Unajua Idd Amin alikuwa na kawaida ya kuuwa wapinzani wake kwa kawaida za ajali ya Magari, General Idrisa alikuwa anaongoza Elite Battalion iliyokuwa inaitwa Simba Battalion, Simba Battalion commando wakakimbia wakavuka Mpaka wa Uganda wakaingia Tanzania.
Idd Amin aliposikia hayo hakufurahishwa na alisha kuwa anaivamia Maeneo ya mara kwa mara kwahiyo akaenda akaivamia tema Mutukula na kuichukua na kuweka Bendera ya Uganda na kutangaza kuwa hiyo Sehemu ni Mali ya Uganda akaitembelea aliporudi Kampala akatangaza Vita dhidi ya Tanzania.
Tanzania ikaenda OAU, wakagoma kuongelea hiyo issue na pia kugoma kumuambia Idd Amin arudishe ardhi ya Tanzania, akapeleka UN na unakumbuka wakati huo Rais alikuwa Jimmy Carter alisha wekea Uganda visingiti vya kiuchumi, UN hawakuongelea ombi la Tanzania; OAU sababu haikuongelea ombi la Tanzania ni kwa Sababu Nyerere aliunga Mkono Mapinduzi ya Sychelles iliyomweka Madarakani Albert Rene.
Kwahiyo, Ilibidi ipigane imuondoe Nduli Idd Amin kutoka Mutukula na pia Uganda sababu hakuna Msaada toka mataifa yoyote, ndio bila vita uchumi wetu ungekuwa bora zaidi ya nchi yoyote Africa, ndio tulinunua silaha kwa bei za rushwa yaani Mara mbili ya bei ya kawaida na ndio iliyotutupa kwenye Umasikini na kumfanya Nyerere kujiuzulu kuliko kupokea machungu ya IMF na World Bank; Yeah Uganda ilitulipa kidogo kidogo walimaliza deni 2007.
Kuhusu Obote, Nyerere hakuikomboa Uganda Sababu ya Obote, Nyerere alimpenda sana Yusuf Lule awe Rais wa Uganda, lakini wakati ule wananchi wa Uganda bado walikuwa na kumbukumbu na Obote alivyokuwa kiongozi bora, hawakujua baada ya miaka mingi uraiani amejenga maadui wengi mmoja wao ni Yoweri Museveni walikuwa wanaongea Mjini Moshi lakini Obote alikuwa na chuki ndani kwa ndani.
kama ilikuwa ni kwa manufaa ya Tanzania ni kwanini Uganda wanatulipa?!Kwahiyo Nyerere hakuikomboa Uganda kwa sababu ya Obote; ni kwa Manufaa ya Watanzania; Wananchi wa Uganda ndio waliomchagua Obote.
Tatizo la Idd Amin lilikuwa ELIMU tu basi, kila kitu alikitazama kwa kutumia Logic na alipingana hata na wasomi inapofikia kitu hakikufanikiwa. Yeye alikuwa mbele ya elimu yenyewe maana hakuelewa hata kusikia ati nchi inafilisika wakati wewe msomi na rasimili zote zipo, haiwezekani tatizo ni wewe. Na kilichomponza Idd Amin kama nilivyosema ni ile tamaa yake ya kuwa Mungu mtu. Alitaka sana yeye awe rais wa jumuiya ya EA na Nyerere ndiye kikwazo tu, hivyo akaanza kumchokoinoa kwanza yeye akimwita mzuri sana angekuwa mwanamke angemuoa. Na hata ktk mikutano yeye alikuwa hampi nafasi Nyerere hudakia katikati kuonyesha he is the man.
ahahaha! hahaha! ushoga ungekuwa halali kikatiba..Duh!! Sa' kama Nyerere tu alikuwa mlimbwende machoni mwa Amin, ingekuwa ndo Baba Riz1 ingekuwaje...!!!
Mkandara Says: "Nimekupa mifano tu mkuu, nimekaa uganda na ninaweza kukueleza mengi ya huko, Stop calling Amin a dictator, just because you studied that in history does mean so!! just because western propaganda it does mean so!! waingereza ndio walimuita sana Amin baada ya kuwafanyia yale mambo!!! USA at that very time mnamwita amin dicator bado walikuwa na mahusiano mazuri sana ya kibiashara, please find in literature!!"
While Chama Says: We have right to differ on this argument. Did you read the link you posted? I did agree with the paper in the sense that I had most of the information; So what I know is not about Western propaganda; how do you describe a person who ordered his troop to commit mass killings? You mentioned about US business relationship with Amin; President Carter sanctioned Amin, let me remind you US will do business with any country as long as their interest is served. Calling Nyerere dictator? just give me one example of atrocity committed by Mwl. Nyerere (R.I.P); by the way I have been to Uganda several times never heard anybody mentioned good thing about Amin, may be we need to make a trip together. Most Ugandans remember him for the pain suffered.
Chama
Gongo la Mboto DSM
What? did I!!!! nashangaa hapo juu pekundu... ebu rudi nyuma mkuu wangu utazame kama kweli ni mimi niloandika..And what i see here is like Two Ugandans who made several trips to Tanzania! Mmoja walikuwa anafikia Kilimanjaro hususani Moshi na mwingine alikua anafikia place like Dodoma! The time when these two Ugandans fellows were back home, mmoja alikuwa anasisitiza kwa nguvu zote ni jinsi gani CHADEMA na Slaa wao walivyo very powerful all over Tanzania. Mwingine, anakataa katakata na kusisitiza HOW CCM na JK wao walivyo very powerful all over Tanzania!! I guess, it's researchable topic otherwise, una-apply msemo wa Baba Riz, Akili za Mbayu mbayu, changanya na.......!!!
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Mkuu wangu nngu007,
Sawa na wenzako wote, nawe umerukia kwenye hatua ya Amin kufanya mashambulizi kuelekea ama ndani ya ardhi ya TZ. Sitaki kuamini kwamba hufahamu ama u miongoni mwa wale wanao-refer ukweli kutokana na propaganda za Tanzania peke yake pasipo na kuangaliaupande wa pili. Kwa makusudi, unayaacha matukio yaliokuwa yanafanwa na Obote na wafuasi wake kwa msaada wa Nyerere mara baada ya Obote kupinduliwa kutoka madarakani. Yaani kwa makusudi unaacha angalau kitendo kilichokuwa kimefanywa na wafuasi wa Obote kuvuka mpaka kutoka Tanzania na kuingia Uganda na kufanya jaribio la mapinduzi ambalo lilishindwa. Na baada a kushindwa huko, wakarudi tena Tanzania na kujpanga upya ambapo kambi yao ya mafunzo ilikuwa Handeni. Nyerere aliifadhili kambi hiyo kwa uwazi hadi pale uliposainiwa mkataba wa amani unaofahamika kama Mogadishu Accord ambapo moja ya matakwa ya mkataba huo ilikuwa kwa nchi hizo kutoruhusu ardhi zao kwa ajili ya vikundi vya upinzani vya nchi nyingine. Kimsingi, takwa hilo liliilenga zaidi Tanzania kwavile ndiyo ambayo ilikuwa ni kambi ya wapinzani wa Amin. Lakini pamoja na hayo, bado Nyerere aliendelea kufadhili lakini hivi sasa kwa uficho. Kwahiyo, unayoyasema wewe yalifuatia baada ya Nyerere akiwa tayari ameshaanza kufadhili harakati za kijeshi za Obote. Miongoni mwa hizo ni shambulizi ambalo lilipangwa kufanyika February 1972 lakini likasitishwa baada ya PM wa Uchina kutia ngumu na kile kilisomekana baada ya hofu ya Nyerere kwamba huenda Britain na Israel wangeingia kum-support Amin.
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Kumbukumbu zinaonesha kwamba ni baada ya Amin kuwa tayari ameshaelemewa na vita ndipo akaitisha Press Conference na kusema kwamba badala ya kusababisha madhara kwa watu wasio na hatia na wanajeshi, basi ni bora wapande ulingoni yeye (Amin) na Nyerere. Mengine kuhusu namna gani wapigane upo sawa. Hivyo basi, kwa kuangalia nukuu hiyo bado inaonesha unachoongelea wewe ni matokeo tu na root yake bado hujaiongelea.
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Ni bahati mbaya sana kwa hapa nasimamia ukweli bila kujali ukweli huo unamuathiri nani. Kwa mtu asiyetaka kusimamia ukweli ataona namtetea Amin au kama ambavyo wenye upungufu wa kutisha wa hoja wanavyotuita kwamba eti tuna chuki na Nyerere!! Kwavile nasimamia ukweli, basi sina budi kutamka wazi kwamba SI KWELI KWAMBA AMIN ALIKUWA ANAKULA NYAMA ZA WATU. Hizo ni propaganda zilizokuwa zinapikwa huku Tanzania ili kuonesha ni jinsi gani Amin asivyofaa kwa Alif wala Be!! Miongoni mwa propganda hizo ni pamoja na kwamba Amin anakula nyama ya watu, Amin alikuwa anawabeba viwete kwenye tipper na kwenda kuwamwaga Mto Kagera! Huo wote ni uongo ambao ulilenga kumwonesha ni jinsi gani Amin alivyo mnyama kuliko wanyama wenyewe. Propaganda zingine ilikuwa ni kumtwisha majina ambayo yalisanifiwa/kuasisiwa na kutumika dhidi ya Amin tu na hadi sasa hapajatokea mwanadamu ambae alikuja tena kuitwa majina ambayo aliitwa Amin. Majina hayo ni Pamoja na NDULI, FASHISTI pamoja na JOKA! Hebu nisaidie mkuu wangu....leo hii ukiambiwa utaje madikteta unaweza kuwataja hata mia....kuna Dikteta Saadam Hussein, Dikteta Ghadaf, Dikteta Pinnochet, Dikteta Mabutu and many many more! Haya wewe, nitajie baada ya NDULI IDDI AMIN DADA, mwingine ni nani anayetambulika au amepata kutambulika kwa jina hilo?! Baada ya FASHIST IDD AMIN DADA, kuna fashist gani ,mwingie duniani ambae amepata kutambulika kwa jina hilo?! Baada ya JOKA IDDI AMIN DADA, ni nani mwingineambae amepatwa kuwa refered kwa hilo jina?! Kama utataka kusimamia ukweli basi hautachelewa kubaini kwamba hapakuwepo mwingie kabla yake na wala hajatokea mwingine baada yake aliyepata kuwa labled hayo majina! Hivyo, majina hayo yalikuwa ni ya kipropaganda zaidi kama ilivyokuwa kwa madai ya kula nyama!
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Kwa mara nyingine umeuchukua ukweli, ukaufinyangafinga mithili ya udongo wa mfinyanzi kisha ukautupia kwenye uvungu wa kitanda kilichopo ndani ya chumba chembamba kisicho na japo ya chembe ya angalau tundu la sindano! Wanajeshi wa Simba Battalion hawakukimbilia Tanzania baada ya ajali tata ya Mustafa Idris (shemeji na VP wa Amin ) bali walikimbia baada ya kufanya jaribio la mapinduzi ambalo sawa na mengine nalo lilishindwa. Katika jaribio hilo, Amin alivamiwa kwenye chumba cha Hotel Jijini Kampala lakini alifanikiwa kutoroka kwa kutumia helikopta!! Jaribio hilo lilizimwa na baadhi ya wanajeshi watiifu wa Amin. Baada ya kushindwa kwa jaribio hilo, majeshi ya Amin yakaanza kuwasaka "waasi" na kuwaua ndipo baadhi yao walipoamua kukimbia na kuvuka mpaka hadi Tanzania ambako walikuja kuungana na wafuasi wa Obote. Katika jaribio hili, Amin akamtuhumu Nyerere kwamba alihusika. Na chuki dhid yao ikaongezeka maradufu!
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Angalau hapo umejitahidi kujikita kwenye ukweli bila shaka kwavile ni ukweli ule tu ambao wewe unaupenda...wa mabaya ya Amin.
[/SIZE][/FONT]Hapa napo umejitahidi kueleza ukweli. Hata hivyo, sababu kubwa ambayo iliwafanya OAU kutom-support Nyerere ni kwamba, enzi hizo; suala la mapinduzi ya kijeshi barani Afrika lilikuwa ni jambo la kawaida. Hivyo, msimamo wa Nyerere wa kutomtambua Amin kwavile tu amempindua Obote ulikuwa ni msimamo usio na mashiko kwa OAU hasa ukizingatia kwamba OAU yenyewe ilikuwa na viongozi kadhaa ambao nao waliingia madarakani kwa njia ya mapinduzi hivyo ingekuwa ni kichekesho kwa watu walioingia madarakani kwa njia ya mapinduzi wasimtambue mwenzao mwingie aliyeingia madarakani sawa na wao. In thoz old age, OAU was almost like Dictators' Club including Nyerere mwenyewe ingawaje degree of dictatorship ili-vary from one dictator to another!
Suala la Uganda kulipa Tanzania linaleta shaka ya dhamira ya Tanzania katika vita hiyo. Ikiwa kweli Nyerere alipigana vita ile kwa ajili ya maslahi ya Tanzania basi hapakuwa na sababu ya sisi kulipwa!! Kulipwa huku kunadhihirisha kwamba JWTZ ilikuwa ni kama kikosi cha mamluki kilichotolewa kwenda kuikomboa Uganda!
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Kutokana na hapo kwenye RED, ni sawa na kusema Nyerere alipigana vita ili amweke Lule madarakani. Comment yangu ya kwanza, naomba niegemee kwenye hayo madai yako....haikuwa sahihi hata kidogo kwa jambo hilo kwa yeye kuingia vitani kwavile alipenda Lule awe rais Uganda. Cooment yangu ya pili acha ni-base kwenye ukweli wenyewe...hapa ningependa niseme wazi kwamba SI KWELI HATA KIDOGO KWAMBA NYERERE ALIPENDA LULE AWE RAIS UGANDA. Suala la Nyerere kuridhia Lule awe ndie rais si kwavile alimpenda bali ni kwavile there was no way kwamba Obote angekuwa rais...the reason behind ni kwamba Obote alikuwa hapendwi hivyo ilikuwa ni lazima apatikane mbadala wake! Na labda niongeze kitu kidogo. Kama ni kupenda, basi nazani Nyerere alimpenda zaidi Museven awe mbadala wa Obote kuliko Lule. Lakini inavyoelekea ni kwamba Nyerere alifahamu kwamba Museven alikuwa ni very powerful than Lule hivyo kumweka madarakani baada ya kupinduliwa kwa Amin pangehitajika kazi ya ziada kumtoa tena hapo baadae. Na hili, linaonekana kwa sasa! Naamini Nyerere alikuwa na matumaini kwamba Obote angerudi tu kwa sanduku la kura (na kweli alirudi) kwahiyo busara ilikuwa ni kumweka mtu ambae ni weak. Don' play with mwalimu wewe, yule mtu alikuwa very clever na smart....!!
kama ilikuwa ni kwa manufaa ya Tanzania ni kwanini Uganda wanatulipa?![/FONT][/SIZE]
Haya Nipe Uthibitisho kuwa Tanzania na Majeshi ya Obote ndio yaliyoanza Uchokozi kwanza na Sio Uganda. Mimi nitakuhakikishia toka kwa Habari toka USA na UK na nchi zote zilikuwa hazimpendi Nyerere kwanza...
Tragically, Amin would not have lasted as long as he did if Africa had had the courage to isolate him, and if the East and West had cared less about their own interests and more about Uganda's. But Libya helped train Amin's army and sent military advisers and civilian technicians. Saudi Arabia promised Amin $2 million in the dying days of his regime in the name of Islamic brotherhood. The Palestine Liberation Organization provided personal bodyguards as a reward for Amin's anti-Israeli ravings. Egypt, Pakistan and Bangladesh sent university professors for Makerere, doctors for Mulago, engineers and other professionals. The Soviet Union gave sophisticated weapons, East Germany trained the secret police.
The West's interests were economic. The United States - which to its credit did institute a trade embargo shortly before Amin was toppled - was for years the biggest purchaser of Uganda coffee. Western companies supplied the country with petroleum. Britain, Uganda's largest trading partner, sold Amin everything from radio technology to drugs to military uniforms. It was not until Amin ordered the murder of Uganda's Anglican archbishop and two senior cabinet ministers in 1977 - Amin said they died in a car accident - that world opinion turned solidly against the man who had once seemed such a good-natured oaf.
Amin was facing pressures at home, too, at the time he killed the archbishop. His army was restless, and tribal fighting broke out in the barracks. Amin needed to put his soldiers to work. The solution he came up with was to start a war. On October 30, 1978, the Ugandan army invaded northwest Tanzania, annexing 710 square miles without opposition. The occupation, Amin announced, was ‘a record in world history,' completed in the ‘supersonic speed of twenty-five minutes.' Julius Nyerere responded that Amin was a ‘snake' mentally damaged by syphilis. He summoned his generals and ordered a counterattack. The initial results were a case study in how not to wage war.
The first day the Tanzanians mistakenly shot down three of their own planes. A week later the counteroffensive had to be halted entirely because no one was sure where the ammunition stockpiles were. One Tanzanian battalion never got the word of the delay and headed off for Rwanda, planning to veer north into Uganda. But the unit got lost in the Rwandan forests and wandered for days, unable to find its way either into Uganda or back to Tanzania. Most of the Tanzanian military vehicles broke down, so the generals had to commandeer buses, Land-Rovers and cars in Dar es Salaam, 850 miles from the front. The convoy finally got rolling. Many of the vehicles ran out of gas en route. The soldiers abandoned them and finished the journey on foot.
When the two armies at last caught up with each other a few weeks later, there was little enthusiasm for any fighting. Soldiers just set up camp on either side of the Kagera River. Nyerere, though, was determined to complete the job, and in the spring of 1979 he brought the twenty-eight Ugandan exile and liberation groups to a conference in Moshi, Tanzania. They included Marxists and monarchists, socialists and capitalists, tribalists and nationalists, men who were united only in their resolve to rid Uganda of Amin. Nyerere scraped together a 50,000-man people's militia, composed largely of illiterate youths pulled off the streets and out of the bush. It was more a mob than an army, for its members had no rank and little training, but together with a handful of Uganda rebels they pushed north, crossed the Kagera River and moved into Uganda. Amin's soldiers - supposedly the best armed and trained in East Africa - threw down their weapons at the first sound of gunfire and fled. Several hundred Libyan soldiers, dispatched to Uganda by Colonel Muammar Qaddafy in an eleventh-hour attempt to save Amin, took up the front-line positions around Kampala. They broke and ran too, and the capital fell without a battle. Amin escaped on a military flight to Tripoli, and Yusufu L. Lule stepped out of the shadows of parliament to speak about the new beginning that was never to be.
Mwambie huyu mheshimiwa au ndugu asome hii hapa pia.
Hii imetoka kitabu hiki: David Lamb, The Africans (Methuen, London: 1985) pp.77-92.
Kuna analytical articles zinazoongelea vita ile bila upendeleo. Inaonyesha wapi majeshi ya Tanzania yalipokosea huko Uganda na ni kwa nini yalikosea; lakini hakuna analysis yoyote inayoonyesha kuwa Vita ilifanyika ili Obote arudishwe madarakani; hiyo ilikuwa ni matokeo ya vita tu. Mojawapo ya article hizo ni hii hapa:The Tanzanian Invasion of Uganda: A Just War?
Chazo cha thread hii kinaweza kuwa kimechochewa na ukweli kuwa mzee Malecela aliyekuwa waziri wa mambo ye nje wa Tanzania kati ya mwaka 1972 hadi mwaka 1973 alisaini ule mkataba wa "Mogadishu Accord" kwa niaba ya Tanzania ili kuondoa uhasam baina ya Tanzania na Uganda. Alisaini mktaba ule kama waziri wa mambo ya nje wa Tanzania pamoja na Wanume Kibedi kama Waziri wa mambo ya nje wa Uganda, na kuthibitishwa na Omar Arteh Ghaleb aliyekuwa waziri anayehusika na mambo ya nje ya Somalia. Kwa bahati mbaya, watu wa mzee Malecela hudai kuwa alimua kusaini mkataba huo yeye mwenyewe bila kumshirikisha Nyerere, na huenda ndiyo chanzo cha thread hii. Kuna sababu za kutosha kuwa Malecela asingefanya hivyo kwa vile angekuwa amejimaliza kisiasa kabisa kwa kuwa iwapo Nyerere angesema amewasaliti wa Watanzania wakati huo wa chama kimoja na kutokana na ukweli kuwa kuwa kuna sehemu za Mwanza na Kagera zilizokuwa zimeshpigwa mabomu na Amini.
Hizi propaganda dhidi ya Nyerere ni mambo ya kupita tu kwani historia ni msema kweli siku zote; unaweza kuipindisha lakini itajionyoosha yenyewe.
And what i see here is like Two Ugandans who made several trips to Tanzania! Mmoja walikuwa anafikia Kilimanjaro hususani Moshi na mwingine alikua anafikia place like Dodoma! The time when these two Ugandans fellows were back home, mmoja alikuwa anasisitiza kwa nguvu zote ni jinsi gani CHADEMA na Slaa wao walivyo very powerful all over Tanzania. Mwingine, anakataa katakata na kusisitiza HOW CCM na JK wao walivyo very powerful all over Tanzania!! I guess, it's researchable topic otherwise, una-apply msemo wa Baba Riz, Akili za Mbayu mbayu, changanya na.......!!!
Watu wote wasio na hoja ukimbilia kwenye hoja mbovu kama hizo za udini....!!! Huo ndo upofu wa watu wasio na hoja za msingi na badala yake kukimbilia kujificha kwenye hoja zinazochefua kama hizo za udini. Unavyosema "baadhi yenu" ina maana nami ni mmoja wao...hebu onesha angalau mstari wangu mmoja achilia mbali post mzima ambayo nimehusisha suala la udini kama msukumo wa Nyerere. Ni aibu, narudia ni aibu...kukosa hoja halafu kukimbilia kwamba huo ni udini, chuki na upuuzi mwingine kama huo. Narudia, onesha angalau mstari mmoja ambao nimehusisha na suala la udini.
Kichuguu,
Na-review sources hapa kuhusu vita hivi. Vita vya 1972 vilikuwa na elements za watanzania kumrudisha Obote. Kumbuka Obote alikuwa ni Trio katika siasa za ukombozi: Nyerere, Obote, and Kaunda.
Kufikia 1978, technically Obote hakuwa na umuhimu wowote katika masuala ya ukombozi. Marais wa Msumbiji na Angola tayari walishaingia kambini.
Na wakati huo huo kulikuwa na wanajeshi watanzania wanaopigana vita vya proxy nchi Msumbiji na Zimbabwe. Hivyo Tanzania haikuwa na sababu ya kufungua front nyingine ya kumrudisha Obote Uganda.
Vita vya Uganda vilianza baada ya vikosi vya majeshi ya Uganda kuanza kupigana vyenyewe. Vikosi vingine vilikimbilia Tanzania na Idi Amin alifikiri kuwa Tanzania ndio chanzo cha migogoro ya wanajeshi wake. Na akahamua kuvamia Tanzania.
Kwa kuwa alijileta mwenyewe, agenda ya kumrudisha Obote ikawa ndani ya meza. Kutokana na uhusiano wa Nyerere na Obote wa miaka ya 60, Nyerere ali-prefer Obote. Lakini waganda wengine hawakumtaka. Na Nyerere alishamwambia Museveni kuwa kijana una uchu na madaraka.
Waberoya;
"Nimekupa mifano tu mkuu, nimekaa uganda na ninaweza kukueleza mengi ya huko, Stop calling Amin a dictator, just because you studied that in history does mean so!! just because western propaganda it does mean so!! waingereza ndio walimuita sana Amin baada ya kuwafanyia yale mambo!!! USA at that very time mnamwita amin dicator bado walikuwa na mahusiano mazuri sana ya kibiashara, please find in literature!!"
We have right to differ on this argument. Did you read the link you posted? I did agree with the paper in the sense that I had most of the information; So what I know is not about Western propaganda; how do you describe a person who ordered his troop to commit mass killings? You mentioned about US business relationship with Amin; President Carter sanctioned Amin, let me remind you US will do business with any country as long as their interest is served. Calling Nyerere dictator? just give me one example of atrocity committed by Mwl. Nyerere (R.I.P); by the way I have been to Uganda several times never heard anybody mentioned good thing about Amin, may be we need to make a trip together. Most Ugandans remember him for the pain suffered.
Chama
Gongo la Mboto DSM