Kenya to stage US roadshow in drive for $3b Eurobond

[Tony254]

no please.

It is not such an Interesting topic because no one wants to criticize their govt. Many people like to support their govt and when it goes wrong, they would rather keep quiet. It is basic human nature hata nyinyi news za T.Z mbaya pia huwa haina wachangiaji wengi

 

[Kobello]

Wakopeshaji wasipojitokeza utakumbuka kunitag. Kenya si hiyo lower Least Developed Country ya Tz, ushawishi tunao maanake tunajielewa. Nyinyi hata kwenye ramani hamjulikani mlipo.

hehehe,safi mpe za uso,Kenya sio ldc my fren

Hahahahahahaha you mean that you are superstitious? That is a sign that you come from an LDC sincerely.

There are LDC countries with a higher, GDP and GDP per capita than a lot of non-LDC countries. Sudan for example, is an LDC country but has a higher GDP and GDP per capita than Kenya, Swaziland, Congo-Brazzaville or Zimbabwe which are non-LDC countries.

A nation can choose not to be included into LDC category. Ghana chose not be included for example. Kenya was never included and so many other Nations that would've otherwise be included, were not in 1971.

Inclusion criteria changes with time, making some of the now non-LDC countries fit the criteria but since they were not included in 1971, or chose not to be included, they remain non-LDC countries that have LDC characteristics.

Graduation criteria shifts too. It gets harder with higher levels of GDP, EVI and HAI and six years (two three year terms) of monitoring by UN Development Policy and Analysis division before graduation. A country can graduate based on GDP only, but GNP per capita has to be above $2484.

In 2013, Kenya's GNP stood at $1150. That was 5 years ago, and shot up to $1380 after rebasing recently. If Kenya chose to include itself into LDC category in 1971, it wouldn't have graduated up to now, since it would still be under monitoring by UN Development Policy and Analysis division. It would still be an LDC. So is Zimbabwe, Swaziland, Congo-Brazzaville etc..

Countries chose to be included to get preferential trade deals and grants by UN bodies and other international financial institutions. Kenya for example in the last ten years, had a GDP of $35.9b in 2008 and a public debt of $8.7b and borrowed (neglecting interest rate since those are paid to roll over the debt) $36b to make it $45b in 2017 which rose the GDP to S70b.

Conclusion??
Just be analytical and stop raising your pompoms whenever your country's name is mentioned. It's the dumbest thing to loan your GDP up. You borrowed $36b just to raise your GDP by $36b. productivity? Zero! And to me, that's an LDC in reality. Wake up and smell the coffee my friends! It's 6am in Smartland!

 

[pingli-nywee]

In summary you mean Tz chose to be included in lower Least Developed Countries together with Somaliyaa? I get you.

 

[mwaswast]

There are LDC countries with a higher, GDP and GDP per capita than a lot of non-LDC countries. Sudan for example, is an LDC country but has a higher GDP and GDP per capita than Kenya, Swaziland, Congo-Brazzaville or Zimbabwe which are non-LDC countries.

A nation can choose not to be included into LDC category. Ghana chose not be included for example. Kenya was never included and so many other Nations that would've otherwise be included, were not in 1971.

Inclusion criteria changes with time, making some of the now non-LDC countries fit the criteria but since they were not included in 1971, or chose not to be included, they remain non-LDC countries that have LDC characteristics.

Graduation criteria shifts too. It gets harder with higher levels of GDP, EVI and HAI and six years (two three year terms) of monitoring by UN Development Policy and Analysis division before graduation. A country can graduate based on GDP only, but GNP per capita has to be above $2484.

In 2013, Kenya's GNP stood at $1150. That was 5 years ago, and shot up to $1380 after rebasing recently. If Kenya chose to include itself into LDC category in 1971, it wouldn't have graduated up to now, since it would still be under monitoring by UN Development Policy and Analysis division. It would still be an LDC. So is Zimbabwe, Swaziland, Congo-Brazzaville etc..

Countries chose to be included to get preferential trade deals and grants by UN bodies and other international financial institutions. Kenya for example in the last ten years, had a GDP of $35.9b in 2008 and a public debt of $8.7b and borrowed (neglecting interest rate since those are paid to roll over the debt) $36b to make it $45b in 2017 which rose the GDP to S70b.

Conclusion??
Just be analytical and stop raising your pompoms whenever your country's name is mentioned. It's the dumbest thing to loan your GDP up. You borrowed $36b just to raise your GDP by $36b. productivity? Zero! And to me, that's an LDC in reality. Wake up and smell the coffee my friends! It's 6am in Smartland!

But you don't have a higher GDP than Kenya true or false?

 

[Kobello]

But you don't have a higher GDP than Kenya true or false?

False

 

[Kobello]

In summary you mean Tz chose to be included in lower Least Developed Countries together with Somaliyaa? I get you.

Yes, in a way. It could've chosen to say no like Zimbabwe did.

There are LDCs doing better in so many aspects than non-LDCs. Since 2008 for example, if a country has a population of more than 75 million, then it will never be categorized as an LDC just based on Population.

But that doesn't mean that Ethiopia is out of LDC, since once you are in, you get out following a procedure that takes a minimum of 6 years and a shifting threshold.

 

[pingli-nywee]

Yes, in a way. It could've chosen to say no like Zimbabwe did.

There are LDCs doing better in so many aspects than non-LDCs. Since 2008 for example, if a country has a population of more than 75 million, then it will never be categorized as an LDC just based on Population.

But that doesn't mean that Ethiopia is out of LDC, since once you are in, you get out following a procedure that takes a minimum of 6 years and a shifting threshold.

Why the long lecture brother. We have all already accepted your country's self afflicated lower LDC status. Cool down

 

[Kobello]

Why the long lecture brother. We have all already accepted your country's self afflicated lower LDC status. Cool down

Im not the type that looks at things superficially neither am I a novice nor an ape (aping/copying). I like to go deep when I discuss things or when I see cheerleaders like you.

Always yapping about LDC this and LDC that .... like it means what you think. So, there goes a free lesson, pass it to your leaders too.

 

[3rd man]

In summary you mean Tz chose to be included in lower Least Developed Countries together with Somaliyaa? I get you.

huyu ni mmoja wa kilaza mzee upara anaongelea kuhusu😀

 

[pingli-nywee]

Im not the type that looks at things superficially neither am I a novice nor an ape (aping/copying). I like to go deep when I discuss things or when I see cheerleaders like you.

Always yapping about LDC this and LDC that .... like it means what you think. So, there goes a free lesson, pass it to your leaders too.

Please go deeper, you will learn that getting to a middle income economy status is up there on the list of Tanzania's 'VISION 2025'. Kenya did not write that so called vision for you! Thats why am not getting what you are yapping about.

 

[Kobello]

Please go deeper, you will learn that getting to a middle income economy status is up there on the list of Tanzania's 'VISION 2025'. Kenya did not write that so called vision for you! Thats why am not getting what you are yapping about.

That's a World Bank classification, while LDC is a UN classification. Two different sets of criteria.

According to World Bank a country with a GNP of $1,006 to $3,955 is considered a lower middle class country.

A country with GNP of $3,956 to $12,235 is considered an upper middle income country.

Seychelles for example, is a high income country, while Brazil, India, Russia, China and South Africa (BRICS) are upper middle Income countries.

So, you be the judge of what that means.

 

[pingli-nywee]

That's a World Bank classification, while LDC is a UN classification. Two different sets of criteria.

According to World Bank a country with a GNP of $1,006 to $3,955 is considered a lower middle class country.

A country with GNP of $3,956 to $12,235 is considered an upper middle income country.

Seychelles for example, is a high income country, while Brazil, India, Russia, China and South Africa (BRICS) are upper middle Income countries.

Swali langu kuu ni, kwanini Tanzania wana azimio la kujinasua kutoka LDC, hadi nchi yenye uchumi wa Middle Income kabla ya 2025? Kama huwezi jibu, fungua uzi mwingine wa kuwaelimisha wenzako kuhusu nchi za LDC. Hayo mimi nayajua. Ulichemsha ulipo sema kwamba Tz mmependa nyinyi wenyewe kuwa kwenye LDC.

 

[Tony254]

There are LDC countries with a higher, GDP and GDP per capita than a lot of non-LDC countries. Sudan for example, is an LDC country but has a higher GDP and GDP per capita than Kenya, Swaziland, Congo-Brazzaville or Zimbabwe which are non-LDC countries.

A nation can choose not to be included into LDC category. Ghana chose not be included for example. Kenya was never included and so many other Nations that would've otherwise be included, were not in 1971.

Inclusion criteria changes with time, making some of the now non-LDC countries fit the criteria but since they were not included in 1971, or chose not to be included, they remain non-LDC countries that have LDC characteristics.

Graduation criteria shifts too. It gets harder with higher levels of GDP, EVI and HAI and six years (two three year terms) of monitoring by UN Development Policy and Analysis division before graduation. A country can graduate based on GDP only, but GNP per capita has to be above $2484.

In 2013, Kenya's GNP stood at $1150. That was 5 years ago, and shot up to $1380 after rebasing recently. If Kenya chose to include itself into LDC category in 1971, it wouldn't have graduated up to now, since it would still be under monitoring by UN Development Policy and Analysis division. It would still be an LDC. So is Zimbabwe, Swaziland, Congo-Brazzaville etc..

Countries chose to be included to get preferential trade deals and grants by UN bodies and other international financial institutions. Kenya for example in the last ten years, had a GDP of $35.9b in 2008 and a public debt of $8.7b and borrowed (neglecting interest rate since those are paid to roll over the debt) $36b to make it $45b in 2017 which rose the GDP to S70b.

Conclusion??
Just be analytical and stop raising your pompoms whenever your country's name is mentioned. It's the dumbest thing to loan your GDP up. You borrowed $36b just to raise your GDP by $36b. productivity? Zero! And to me, that's an LDC in reality. Wake up and smell the coffee my friends! It's 6am in Smartland!

Hahaha. You think you are the only economist in JF? Hahaha hio smartland iko wapi pia mimi nikuje? The U.N, The World Bank and IMF are the three main bodies collecting statistics for all countries. The world bank itself set criteria for being classified middle income and we met the target. What World Bank cares about is GDP per capita and not GDP only as you falsely stated. Our GDP per capita is more than $1, 500. Tanzania's GDP per capita is less than $ 1, 000. Don't even think of competing with Kenya. While I don't support rampant govt borrowing, I won't keep quite when you insinuate that the world bank was crazy to rank Kenya as MIC.

 

[Kobello]

Hahaha. You think you are the only economist in JF? Hahaha hio smartland iko wapi pia mimi nikuje? The U.N, The World Bank and IMF are the three main bodies collecting statistics for all countries. The world bank itself set criteria for being classified middle income and we met the target. What World Bank cares about is GDP per capita and not GDP only as you falsely stated. Our GDP per capita is more than $1, 500. Tanzania's GDP per capita is less than $ 1, 000. Don't even think of competing with Kenya. While I don't support rampant govt borrowing, I won't keep quite when you insinuate that the world bank was crazy to rank Kenya as MIC.

First of all, you need to take your time and read carefully between the spaces. I.ve never said the UN criteria is based on GDP only. The UN criteria is a bit more complicated than what your amateurish mind has grasped so far.

The UN criteria is the one that classifies LDCs and the criteria are set by The Committee for Development Policy. They use GNI per Capita (or GNP per capita), Human Asset Index (HAI) and Economic viability Index (EVI) and there are things they look at to determine those indices (I can school you on that if you want, but ask first).

The World Bank is the one categorizing countries based on the level of Income only. The WB is the one categorizing Lower middle, upper middle, High and Low Income countries based solely on their GNI per capita using The Atlas Method(read my previous posts slowly to save you a headache).

The IMF, classifies countries for Analytical purposes (Done by World Economic Outlook) as Advanced Economies and Emerging Developing Countries. Emerging Developing countries can be more classified as

(1) Low-income developing countries
(2) Emerging and other developing countries

I have never said, nor insinuated that The WB was wrong for ranking Kenya as a lower middle Income country, No! Kenya is. Kenya's GNP stands at $1380,. What Im trying to say is, classification differs depending on the Organizational methodology and you can sometimes find an LDC performing better than non LDCs in some Organizations classifications.

 

[Kobello]

Swali langu kuu ni, kwanini Tanzania wana azimio la kujinasua kutoka LDC, hadi nchi yenye uchumi wa Middle Income kabla ya 2025? Kama huwezi jibu, fungua uzi mwingine wa kuwaelimisha wenzako kuhusu nchi za LDC. Hayo mimi nayajua. Ulichemsha ulipo sema kwamba Tz mmependa nyinyi wenyewe kuwa kwenye LDC.

Huelewi na unajichanganya. In vision 2025, Tanzania inataka kuwa middle Income Country based on World Bank criteria, not based on UN committee for Development Policy criteria ambayo hutoa nchi kutoka LDC.

Tanzania will still be an LDC for at least 15 -20 years from Now, minimum. Kwa sababu graduation from LDC is very very vigorous. Usipende kuangalia mambo juujuu kwa sababu utajichanganya na kuonekana huelewi unachozungumza.

Acha kuchanganya categories. Unaelewa?

 

[Tony254]

First of all, you need to take your time and read carefully between the spaces. I.ve never said the UN criteria is based on GDP only. The UN criteria is a bit more complicated than what your amateurish mind has grasped so far.

The UN criteria is the one that classifies LDCs and the criteria are set by The Committee for Development Policy. They use GNI per Capita (or GNP per capita), Human Asset Index (HAI) and Economic viability Index (EVI) and there are things they look at to determine those indices (I can school you on that if you want, but ask first).

The World Bank is the one categorizing countries based on the level of Income only. The WB is the one categorizing Lower middle, upper middle, High and Low Income countries based solely on their GNI per capita using The Atlas Method(read my previous posts slowly to save you a headache).

The IMF, classifies countries for Analytical purposes (Done by World Economic Outlook) as Advanced Economies and Emerging Developing Countries. Emerging Developing countries can be more classified as

(1) Low-income developing countries
(2) Emerging and other developing countries

I have never said, nor insinuated that The WB was wrong for ranking Kenya as a lower middle Income country, No! Kenya is. Kenya's GNP stands at $1380,. What Im trying to say is, classification differs depending on the Organizational methodology and you can sometimes find an LDC performing better than non LDCs in some Organizations classifications.

Good you have clarrified. I was going to eat your ass alive with statitistics from WB until tomorrow. As for the U.N classification, who cares? No one takes the U.N seriously anymore. They can rank us where they want.

 

[pingli-nywee]

Sijaelewa, kwasababu hujajibu swali langu. Kobello badala ya blah blah nyingi we mtafute raia wa Somalia mjadili kuhusu uLDC wenu wa kujitakia na mtakavohakikisha mmebaki humo humo. Mi ni mkenya bana misamiati hiyo siikumbuki vizuri. Kama hujajua tulishatokaga huko zamani sana!

 

[Tony254]

First of all, you need to take your time and read carefully between the spaces. I.ve never said the UN criteria is based on GDP only. The UN criteria is a bit more complicated than what your amateurish mind has grasped so far.

The UN criteria is the one that classifies LDCs and the criteria are set by The Committee for Development Policy. They use GNI per Capita (or GNP per capita), Human Asset Index (HAI) and Economic viability Index (EVI) and there are things they look at to determine those indices (I can school you on that if you want, but ask first).

The World Bank is the one categorizing countries based on the level of Income only. The WB is the one categorizing Lower middle, upper middle, High and Low Income countries based solely on their GNI per capita using The Atlas Method(read my previous posts slowly to save you a headache).

The IMF, classifies countries for Analytical purposes (Done by World Economic Outlook) as Advanced Economies and Emerging Developing Countries. Emerging Developing countries can be more classified as

(1) Low-income developing countries
(2) Emerging and other developing countries

I have never said, nor insinuated that The WB was wrong for ranking Kenya as a lower middle Income country, No! Kenya is. Kenya's GNP stands at $1380,. What Im trying to say is, classification differs depending on the Organizational methodology and you can sometimes find an LDC performing better than non LDCs in some Organizations classifications.

World Bank Country and Lending Groups – World Bank Data Help Desk

Naona mahali umetoa hiyo data yako ya world bank ya gnp per capita. You have just copied and pasted everything as it appears in the link. Anyway most of what you have said is true. Kudos.

 

[pingli-nywee]

Good you have clarrified. I was going to eat your ass alive with statitistics from WB until tomorrow. As for the U.N classification, who cares? No one takes the U.N seriously anymore. They can rank us where they want.

Anabadilisha gia baada ya kugundua kwamba kwenye vision yao ya 2025, wanataka kufanya vitu ambavyo Kenya tulishayatimiza zamani sana. Mwanzoni alisema Tz ni LDC, kwa kupenda kwao. Bottom line, bado hawajajinasua!

 

[Tony254]

Anabadilisha gia baada ya kugundua kwamba kwenye vision yao ya 2025, wanataka kufanya vitu ambavyo Kenya tulishayatimiza zamani sana. Mwanzoni alisema Tz ni LDC, kwa kupenda kwao. Bottom line, bado hawajajinasua!

Haha ni kajanja sana.