Prof. Joseph Mbele atoa andiko kupinga kauli ya Dr. Mwakyembe

[Nyani Ngabu]

Mtu ambaye anataka kucheza soka, ukimshinda katika tennis, halafu ukamcheka kwamba hajawahi kuwa mwanamichezo mzuri, unamuonea.

Yeye ni mwanamichezo mzuri katika mchezo wa soka.

Wewe unampima uanamichezo kwa kigezo cha tennis.

Waafrika hatukuwahi kuwa na mshawasha wa kutaka maendeleo ya kiuchumi.

Mshawasha wetu kwa miaka mingi sana umekuwa wa kutaka kuwa na mahusiano mazuri na wenzetu, kufanya subsistence farming, ufugaji wa kiushkaji, kumsifu chifu, siku zinaendelea.

Ndoyo maana mpaka leo rais anavunja katiba keft, right and center. Wananchi wanamshangilia. Wengi sana.

Ni utamaduni wetu huo, mkubwa hakosei.

Hata akikosea, usiseme kakosea, sema "washauri wake wamemshauri vibaya".

Ukisema kakosea, utaharibu "social harmony".

Hatukutaka mali sana, kwa sababu bara letu limejaa mali ni kitu tunachukulia for granted, hatuna haja yakulimbikiza mali. Utalimbikiza nyama iwe yako mwenyewe kwanza utaitynza wapi? Halafu wenzako wana njaa, utajisikiaje kuwa na nyama kibao wakati wenzako wana njaa?

Waziri Mkuu wa Uingereza Winstin Churchill alisema kwamba watu wa Uganda walikuwa hawana pressure na maisha, kwa sababu nchi yai mazao yanazaa mwaka mzima (hakuna winter) kuna misitu, mashamba na matunda mengi, maji kika mahali kuanzia mito mpaka ziwa, hawana tabu. Hawana pressure ya kulimbukiza mali, kwa sababu walijua wakikosa sana watachuma maembe watakula, maisha poa tu. Hawahitaji stock market.

Wageni wamekuja na model moya, weka nyama kwenye friji, kila mtu atajiju.

Sasa sie ambao hatuna utamaduni wa umimi, tukishindwa kujilimbikizia mali na kuendelea kiymuchumi, tunashindea mchezo ambao sio wetu.

Tumekua tunacheza soka.

Leo unatupima uanamichezo wetu kwa mechi ya tennis?

Ndiyo maana hata keo haya mambo ya kigeni ya vyama vya siasa, mara demikrasia, mara banking system, mara serikali ya mihimiki mitatu inayotazamana, mara bunge ka Westminster, mara kusoma Chuo Kikuu, kwa sehemu kubwa ni mambo ya maigizo tu. Si mambo ambayo yanatoka ndani kabisa ya utamaduni wetu.

Tunaigiza tu.

Mchezo wa tennis, wa kigeni. Unatushinda. Wa kwetu soka umetupwa.

Sasa kama sisi Waafrika hatukuwahi kuwa na mshawasha wa kutaka maendeleo ya kiuchumi, nini kinatufanya tusiendelee kuishi bila huo mshawasha?

Ila, historia ya falme na himaya za zamani inaonyesha kuwa mshawasha wa biashara na ujasiriamali ulikuwepo.

Hayo mambo mawili si ndo kiini cha maendeleo ya kiuchumi?

 

[Castr]

Acha ujinga. The strong ones cannot be colonized. Wote waliokuwa colonized its because they were weak.

Na matusi tena? Wewe level yako siyo ya kujadiliana na mimi

 

[Kiranga]

The African had little appetite for conquest and exploration?

Ever heard of the Pre-Colonial Mfecane wars?

How do you think those came to be if weren’t for King Shaka’s expansionism?

Those influential African kingdoms of Mali under Sundiata Keita, Songhai Empire under Muhammad Askia, the kingdom of Aksum and others didn’t just pop up like mushrooms in the bushes.

They were created. There were conflicts. There were conquests in the process.

To say that the African had little appetite for conquest and exploration is just not factually correct.

I’d be in agreeance with you if you tell me maybe he didn’t have the means and ways for the exploration and conquest of much far and away lands as the reason why he didn’t do it.



Again, this is not factually correct.

Africans warred against each other during Pre-Colonial times.

Those conflicts arose due to invasions, impositions, etc.





Savagery is part of the human condition. It existed in Africa before its contact with the Europeans.

When the Europeans came they just brought a different kind of it.



That’s a bit too harsh. I didn’t take it that seriously.



It was never great. It has never been great. It has the potential to be great. But it’s got a long ways to go before it can get there!



Afrocentric propaganda. That’s what they propagate.

One hqs to remember that the Mfecane wars sounds so long ago only because if the frame of reference of the yound Africa of "independent" nation states that gained their indepwndence after WWII, mostly in the sixties.

In the larger frame of things, the Mfecane wars happenned between 1815 and 1840. Way after the Arabs raided East Africa and estabkished trade routes.

Why, tye Dutch wntered South Africa in 1652.

By the time of Mfecane Wars. We were already inculcated with the greed if wanting to dominate ithers and being of influence like the wite man.

The Arabs infkuenced a lot in West Africa. A lot if what is considered African culture is actually Arab culture.

So, the context must be cinsidered. The frame of reference must be considered.

I am talking about the deep past, nit 1815 Africa.

 

[Kiranga]

Sasa kama sisi Waafrika hatukuwahi kuwa na mshawasha wa kutaka maendeleo ya kiuchumi, nini kinatufanya tusiendelee kuishi bila huo mshawasha?

Ila, historia ya falme na himaya za zamani inaonyesha kuwa mshawasha wa biashara na ujasiriamali ulikuwepo.

Hayo mambo mawili si ndo kiini cha maendeleo ya kiuchumi?

Tunaendelea kuishi bila huo mshawasha.

Ila, tunadanganyana kwamba hatuendelei kuishi bika huo mshawasha.

Watanzania wengi kwa mfano, hawaweki kipaumbele kwenye maendeleo ya kiuchumi.

Wanaweka kipaumbele kwenye kuwa na maisha ya urahisi yasiyo na tabu.

Tungeweka kipaumbele kwenye kuwa na maendeleo ya kiuchumi, tungeona tu maendeleo ya kiuchumi yanakija, hata bika kuoangwa na serikali. Hata kwa mtindo wa organic development tu.

Wewe angalia tu watu wanavyochangiana kwenye misiba na harusi, social events.

Halafu angalia watu wanavyochangiana kwenye kusoma, kuanzisha biashara, kilimo.

Hizo historia zinaonesha mshawasha wa biashara na ujasiliamali katika subsistence level. Ndiyo maana Waafrika hawakwenda Ulaya au Asia kutawala nchi za huko, Waarabu na Wazungu ndio wamekuja Afrika kutawala.

 

[Basi Nenda]

Huyo Prof nilipoona kavaa kofia imeandikwa "Make Africa great again"Nimekata tamaa hata kusoma bandiko lake. Ingawa hata mimi nampinga Mwakyembe.
Can he tell us when Africa was great?Bora hata angesema make Africa great.

We were great
The word great fall under many aspects, it doesn't always deal with the economy

 

[Basi Nenda]

Kiukweli huyo mbele hana tofauti na mwakyembe. Huwa napata shida sana kuwaelewa hawa wanajiita wasomi waliolowea huko nje. Sasa msaada wake kwa nchi yake ni upi?. Si lazima uajiriwe,kama wewe ni prof,basi kichwa chako kicheze kila namna,unaweza ukawa mfugaji wa mfano,au mkulima wa zao fulani wa mfano,au ukaanzisha jambo na ukaajiri vijana wengi. Yaani prof anazidiwa na Diamond msaniii wa darasa la saba maarifa (hata kama ni form 4). Diamond ameajiri vijana,anasadia jamii. Ona maprof wetu,ona kilichoandikwa kwenye kofia yake,ona anavyozidi kuzeekea nchi za watu,ona alivyochoka hata kimuonekano tu. Na hiyo kofia wazungu wanabaki kutuzooom tu,huyu ni prof toka Tz. Bora asingezaliwa tu

Si hata ushauri alioutoa kwa mwaki chunga ni msaada tosha

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

One hqs to remember that the Mfecane wars sounds so long ago only because if the frame of reference of the yound Africa of "independent" nation states that gained their indepwndence after WWII, mostly in the sixties.

In the larger frame of things, the Mfecane wars happenned between 1815 and 1840. Way after the Arabs raided East Africa and estabkished trade routes.

Why, tye Dutch wntered South Africa in 1652.

By the time of Mfecane Wars. We were already inculcated with the greed if wanting to dominate ithers and being of influence like the wite man.

The Arabs infkuenced a lot in West Africa. A lot if what is considered African culture is actually Arab culture.

So, the context must be cinsidered. The frame of reference must be considered.

I am talking about the deep past, nit 1815 Africa.

How deep do you wanna go?

Coz we can go back as far as the 1400s during the Songhai empire under the leadership of Sunni Ali, who himself was a political prisoner in the Mali empire. Mali empire ruled Songhai at the time. Mali ruling over Songhai, that is not conquest?

Later on Songhai was ruled by Askia Muhammad, who brought it to the height of power.

That height of power didn’t just come with nothing. He conquered the surrounding areas.

Songhai was also very instrumental in the slave trade.

How do you think slaves were obtained? Usually they were captives of wars captured during raids and whatnot.

This proves that not all was hunky-dory. There was strife amongst the societies.

And that’s exactly how Songhai fell: internal strife and civil war.

But, we can also go back as far as the 1200s during which the Mali empire was established.

As it grew stronger, it took over surrounding kingdoms.

In the 1300s that’s when Mansa Musa made the trip to Mecca with his 60,000 people entourage in tow. Making Floyd ‘Money’ Mayweather’s entourage look like child’s play.

Haya mambo ya ma entourage hayajaanza majuzi. Kina Mansa Musa walikuwa wanafanya kufuru isiyoelezeka.

Kwa hiyo hapo utaona kwamba, Afrika hakukuwa na amani kivile.

Mifarakanono ilikuwepo. Na chanzo cha mifarakano hiyo mara nyingi ilikuwa ni falme na himaya kutaka kujitanua na kutawala wengine.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Tunaendelea kuishi bila huo mshawasha.

Ila, tunadanganyana kwamba hatuendelei kuishi bika huo mshawasha.

Watanzania wengi kwa mfano, hawaweki kipaumbele kwenye maendeleo ya kiuchumi.

Wanaweka kipaumbele kwenye kuwa na maisha ya urahisi yasiyo na tabu.

Tungeweka kipaumbele kwenye kuwa na maendeleo ya kiuchumi, tungeona tu maendeleo ya kiuchumi yanakija, hata bika kuoangwa na serikali. Hata kwa mtindo wa organic development tu.

Wewe angalia tu watu wanavyochangiana kwenye misiba na harusi, social events.

Halafu angalia watu wanavyochangiana kwenye kusoma, kuanzisha biashara, kilimo.

Hizo historia zinaonesha mshawasha wa biashara na ujasiliamali katika subsistence level. Ndiyo maana Waafrika hawakwenda Ulaya au Asia kutawala nchi za huko, Waarabu na Wazungu ndio wamekuja Afrika kutawala.

You have a good point there.

Generally speaking, we like to take the path of least resistance...

‘Kuweka kipaumbele kwenye kuwa na maisha ya urahisi yasiyo na tabu’

Mifano ya hiyo ipo mingi mno aisee....

 

[Kiranga]

How deep do you wanna go?

Coz we can go back as far as the 1400s during the Songhai empire under the leadership of Sunni Ali, who himself was a political prisoner in the Mali empire. Mali empire ruled Songhai at the time. Mali ruling over Songhai, that is not conquest?

Later on Songhai was ruled by Askia Muhammad, who brought it to the height of power.

That height of power didn’t just come with nothing. He conquered the surrounding areas.

Songhai was also very instrumental in the slave trade.

How do you think slaves were obtained? Usually they were captives of wars captured during raids and whatnot.

This proves that not all was hunky-dory. There was strife amongst the societies.

And that’s exactly how Songhai fell: internal strife and civil war.

But, we can also go back as far as the 1200s during which the Mali empire was established.

As it grew stronger, it took over surrounding kingdoms.

In the 1300s that’s when Mansa Musa made the trip to Mecca with his 60,000 people entourage in tow. Making Floyd ‘Money’ Mayweather’s entourage look like child’s play.

Haya mambo ya ma entourage hayajaanza majuzi. Kina Mansa Musa walikuwa wanafanya kufuru isiyoelezeka.

Kwa hiyo hapo utaona kwamba, Afrika hakukuwa na amani kivile.

Mifarakanono ilikuwepo. Na chanzo cha mifarakano hiyo mara nyingi ilikuwa ni falme na himaya kutaka kujitanua na kutawala wengine.

When talking about Sunni Ali, you have to remememember that Sunni and Ali are both Islamic names.

At that point there was already Islamic influence on Africans. The Sultans were already Islamic converts. Mansa Musa went to Mecca for Hajj about 1324-1325.

I did not say all was hunky dory. I said Africans did not prioritize conquest and economic growth.

That is why on that very Hajj trip, Mansa Musa made it rain gold in Cairo.

He have away so much gold as alms intil gokd lost its value, there was an inflatiin for years because Mansa Musa gave so much gold.

That is an African Sultan.

 

[Hismastersvoice]

Huyo Prof nilipoona kavaa kofia imeandikwa "Make Africa great again"Nimekata tamaa hata kusoma bandiko lake. Ingawa hata mimi nampinga Mwakyembe.
Can he tell us when Africa was great?Bora hata angesema make Africa great.

Afrika ilikuwa juu ndiyo sababu wazungu walikuja japo hawakuwa ndugu huku, baada ya hapo wakaanza kugawana viwanja na rasrimali.

 

[Komeo Lachuma]

Nioneshe tusi ili niombe ban. Maana inaonekana hata matusi hujui ni nini.

Na matusi tena? Wewe level yako siyo ya kujadiliana na mimi

 

[wa stendi]

Na wewe ulibahatika kupitia mziki wake

[emoji115]

 

[Castr]

Nioneshe tusi ili niombe ban. Maana inaonekana hata matusi hujui ni nini.

Kwani unatakaje?

 

[Analogia Malenga]

When was Africa great?

Afrika was great from the dawn of civilization, It then ceased after the mass murder that happened in Kemit,

 

[dnjoki]

Najua ni Ngwini. Namfahamu nilikuwa namsoma back then. Ila leo nilivyoona kavaa kofia imeandikwa Make Africa great again nikamuona hajielewi. Hana tofauti na wale wa slogan ya make Tanzania great again. Sijui hata lini Tanzania ilikuwa great. Kama tu Nyerere mwenyewe alifia kwa wakoloni St Thomas London Uingereza.

You are "right".

 

[dnjoki]

Kwani unakuwa great hivi hivi tu ? Kuna vitu vinahitaji ujasiri na maarifa unatakiwa uvifanye ili uwe great.Unafikiri unalala unaamka na kuwa great ? Growth yenyewe haipo natural unatakiwa ule na ujikinge na magonjwa ili ukue.

You are "right".

 

[dnjoki]

Nimesoma sio tu historia bali prehistoria pia. Africa was never great.

You are "right".

 

[mlimangulu]

Yes Africa were great! Kipindi cha dola kubwa kama dola la Mali chini ya Manka Lankan Mussa Afrika ilikuwa na nguvu sanavhata kipindi cha dola la Ghana na soghay bado tulikua bora sana he umefikiri Afrka kipindi cha Dola la kimisri ambapo ustaarabu duniani ndio ulipoanzia kipindi cha Pharaoh tulikua bora kuliko wao

 

[Komeo Lachuma]

Nataka inavyotakiwa.

Kwani unatakaje?

 

[Nyumisi]

Hizo tambo za kujivuna kuhusu elimu na mafanikio awaachie watani zangu wahaya..