The case against MUSTAFA MKULO

[CottonEyeJoe]

na aliyekwambia hivyo ni nani ?? nimesema nilichosema kutokana na maneno uliyosema !

Fair enuff..... At the moment we are discussing Mkullo hayo ya Mbowe we will be and are being discusssed... My take though is that being a harcore "personal" defaulter is different than running a company that is defaulting....

 

[KadaMpinzani]

Fair enuff..... At the moment we are discussing Mkullo hayo ya Mbowe we will be and are being discusssed... My take though is that being a harcore "personal" defaulter is different than running a company that is defaulting....

swadakta ! tupo pamoja ! sasa tuendelee kumuongelea mkullo....najua watu walishaanza waliposikia mbowe nae anatiwa kwenye kundi moja na mkullo, ohh kada attack !

 

[KadaMpinzani]

...Mbowe na Mkullo wooote ni mafisadi tu!!! hawafai kupewa hata ujumbe wa nyumba kumi kumi.

wewe huwa unaniacha hoi sana pale unapotoa dozi kali kama hii halafu unakimbia.....lol...thats great though !

 

[William J. Malecela]

Fair enuff..... At the moment we are discussing Mkullo hayo ya Mbowe we will be and are being discusssed...

Mkuu Heshima Mbele,

Acha hizi nyepesi nyepesi, kama Mkullo na Mbowe wanadaiwa na kwa kudaiwa huko wanavunja sheria hata moja ya jamhuri yetu, tena kwa makusudi au kwa visingizio vya sheria, kwa wale tunaosimamia ukweli na haki, hapa JF, ina-raise some serious question on their integrity au commitment kwa taifa letu, na hasa sisi wananchi,

Maaana kama this is true, can we trust them with our nation kama hatuwezi kuwaamini na hizo hela ndogo sana? Tujifunze kusimamia ukweli wakuu bila ya kuangaliana usoni au vyama vya siasa!

Hii ishu ni taifa first, halafu vyama baadaye, Yes I said it! kama wanadaiwa na wanavunja sheria zetu za taifa, walipe tena now, au waache uongozi!

Tuache utoto hapa wakuu, taifa linatuangalia hapa!

 

[Kuhani]

... At the moment we are discussing Mkullo hayo ya Mbowe we will be and are being discusssed... My take though is that being a harcore "personal" defaulter is different than running a company that is defaulting....

That means you are comparing the two. You are defending Mbowe, even as you purport to say that we're talking about Mkulo.

Can't have it both ways. Just say this is about Mkulo, and put a period there.

Then we can move forward with Mkulo discussion.

 

[CottonEyeJoe]

That means you are comparing the two. You are defending Mbowe, even as you purport to say that we're talking about Mkulo.

Can't have it both ways. Just say this is about Mkulo, and put a period there.

Then we can move forward with Mkulo discussion.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbyuNmCtOD8[/media]

All I am saying is that resistance to pay a personal debt and the resistance of corporate entinty (or even country for that matter) are to different things. The latter is does not directly mean that you cant lead a company or Country for that matter....

 

[William J. Malecela]

All I am saying is that resistance to pay a personal debt and the resistance of corporate entinty (or even country for that matter) are to different things. The latter is does not directly mean that you cant lead a company or Country for that matter....

sheria inasema nini mkuu, ndicho cha muhimu kama hawavunji sheria hakuna ishu kabisaa, lakini kama wanavunja basi kuna political ishu tena nzito sana!

 

[CottonEyeJoe]

Guys I think we are discussing 3 people and only mentioning 2, Since a corporation is deemed to be a person in its own right; we are discussing Mkullo, Mbowe & the company which Mbowe is running sasa kati ya hawo watatu ni kina nani wame-default????

 

[Kuhani]

All I am saying is that resistance to pay a personal debt and the resistance of corporate entinty (or even country for that matter) are to different things. The latter is does not directly mean that you cant lead a company or Country for that matter....

Hata mimi nilianza kwa kusema deni la Mbowe sio deni lake, bali la kampuni yake. Wengine wakasema deni lake limeshalipwa, wengine wakasema bado, wewe ukasema deni lake afadhali kuliko la Mkulo, lakini ukataka tumuongelee Mkulo.

Sasa umeniwekea spichi ya Nyerere ili kutetea deni la Mbowe. Ume assume kwamba, na mimi naamini kama wewe, kwamba, chochote atakachosema Nyerere basi ni Injili ya Kweli.

Lakini hata nikikubali kwamba Nyerere ndio anajua falsafa zote za maadili ya kulipa na kutolipa madeni, hata Nyerere mwenyewe hajatofautisha kati ya deni la Shirika na deni mtu binafsi katika kile ki-spichi.

In fact, ametumia mfano wa deni la mtu binafsi kujenga hoja kuhusu deni la Taifa. Kwa hiyo, hata hiyo Injili ya Nyerere hujaisoma na kuilewa vizuri. Ulivyoitumia, inazidi kudhoofisha pointi yako mwenyewe.

Sasa tumuweke Nyerere pembeni, turudi kwa Mbowe na Mkulo. Au uache kumtetea Mbowe ili tubaki kwa Mkulo!

Huwezi kushurutisha sisi tuongelee Mkulo huku wewe unamtetea Mbowe.

 

[Mkandara]

Jamani mwee,
Nilidhani hapa ni mahala pa kujadili mada kama inavyoletwa...
Swala kubwa hapa ni Mkullo na nadhani kuna watu mnajaribu kupotosha maana ya hoja hii kwa kuingiza siasa.
Mkullo hajazungumziwa kama mtu wa kawaida mwanasiasa isipokuwa tunajulishwa jinsi nchi yetu inavyoliwa na viongozi ambao wanachukua madaraka makubwa huku wakidaiwa fedha za walalahoi...Mbowe nani kwanza?... sii mwenyekiti wa Chadema sasa ana ubavuy gani wa kuvta fedha serikalini kupitia benki zetu bila taratibu zinazokubalika.
Huyo Mbowe anajulikana na kisheria kesi yake ipo mahakamani na anaendelea kulipa lakini huyu Mkullo hili ni janga jipya na kapewa nafasi KUBWA sana ya kuendeleza kutumaliza!...
Jamani, jamani litazameni Azimio la Zanzibar kwa macho ya uchungu, kwani Mbowe hakupewa mkopo huo kwa kufuata taratibu za Azimio hilo isipokuwa aliomba mkopo huo kama wafanyabiashara wengine wote ambao wanalipa ama wamechelewa kulipa..
Hawa mafisadi tunaowazungumzia wametumia fedha za wananchi kujijengea mitaji ambayo dhamana yake ni nafasi zao ktk serikali!...
Mtanisamehe wakuu lakini kama ndio mtaji wenyewe ndio huu basi ama kweli NDIVYO TULIVYO!

 

[Kuhani]

Jamani mwee,

Nilidhani hapa ni mahala pa kujadili mada kama inavyoletwa...
Swala kubwa hapa ni Mkullo na nadhani kuna watu mnajaribu kupotosha maana ya hoja hii kwa kuingiza siasa.

...Huyo Mbowe anajulikana na kisheria kesi yake ipo mahakamani na anaendelea kulipa lakini huyu Mkullo hili ni janga jipya na kapewa nafasi KUBWA sana ya kuendeleza kutumaliza!...
Jamani, jamani litazameni Azimio la Zanzibar kwa macho ya uchungu, kwani Mbowe hakupewa mkopo huo kwa kufuata taratibu za Azimio hilo isipokuwa aliomba mkopo huo kama wafanyabiashara wengine wote ambao wanalipa ama wamechelewa kulipa...

Unaona tatizo hapo?

Nambie sasa, ni nani analeta Siasa?

 

[Mzee Mwanakijiji]

Kama tunajali maendeleo ya taifa kwa manufaa ya taifa basi wote wanaolitia hasara taifa ni lazima tuwakemee. Tukichagua chagua ooh fulani sio waziri inasabisha watu waanze kujiuliza lengo kuu lililopo, hasahasa iwapo watu haohao wanaomtetea mtia hasara taifa kwa kigezo cha kutokuwa waziri wamedhihirika kuwa mstari wa mbele kukemea hasara inayoletewa taifa na watanzania wenye asili ya kiasia au wahindi, je hawa ni mawaziri?
Wote tuwakemee.

hili la Mbowe nilishalitolea maoni huko nyuma na anayetaka kujua maoni yangu arudi akaangilie. Sipendi kweli kujirudia rudia. Mmeshasema Mbowe anadaiwa, it has been established; tunajua amelipa kiasi gani, na deni lililosalia hata NSSF wenyewe hawajui... Yaani hatuwezi kuzungumzia kitu hicho hicho alimradi tunarudia kilichokwishasemwa.

Kama kuna mtu ana info mpya kuhusu madeni mapya ya Mbowe ambayo hajalipa bandikeni hapa thread, lakini haiwezekani kuwa tukizungumzia madeni mapya ya x,y kwa vile tu ni CCM basi mnakimbilia "Mbowe". Kama kuna mtu ana data mpya kuhusu Mbowe na madeni yake wekeni data katika mapambano haya all are fair!

 

[KadaMpinzani]

hili la Mbowe nilishalitolea maoni huko nyuma na anayetaka kujua maoni yangu arudi akaangilie. Sipendi kweli kujirudia rudia. Mmeshasema Mbowe anadaiwa, it has been established; tunajua amelipa kiasi gani, na deni lililosalia hata NSSF wenyewe hawajui... Yaani hatuwezi kuzungumzia kitu hicho hicho alimradi tunarudia kilichokwishasemwa.

Kama kuna mtu ana info mpya kuhusu madeni mapya ya Mbowe ambayo hajalipa bandikeni hapa thread, lakini haiwezekani kuwa tukizungumzia madeni mapya ya x,y kwa vile tu ni CCM basi mnakimbilia "Mbowe". Kama kuna mtu ana data mpya kuhusu Mbowe na madeni yake wekeni data katika mapambano haya all are fair!

deni ni lile lile ambalo halijalipwa, spin it any angle, lakini mbowe anadaiwa !

 

[Mtanganyika]

hili la Mbowe nilishalitolea maoni huko nyuma na anayetaka kujua maoni yangu arudi akaangilie. Sipendi kweli kujirudia rudia. Mmeshasema Mbowe anadaiwa, it has been established; tunajua amelipa kiasi gani, na deni lililosalia hata NSSF wenyewe hawajui... Yaani hatuwezi kuzungumzia kitu hicho hicho alimradi tunarudia kilichokwishasemwa.

Kama kuna mtu ana info mpya kuhusu madeni mapya ya Mbowe ambayo hajalipa bandikeni hapa thread, lakini haiwezekani kuwa tukizungumzia madeni mapya ya x,y kwa vile tu ni CCM basi mnakimbilia "Mbowe". Kama kuna mtu ana data mpya kuhusu Mbowe na madeni yake wekeni data katika mapambano haya all are fair!

No matter what way we're going to take MMK, swala la attachement ya NSSF and Mbowe will be there. Kama mbowe anadaiwa na Mkullo anadaiwa then wote ni wadeni. Hakuna small mdeni au big mdeni, mdeni ni mdeni. Mbowe will be part of NSSF drowning back as well as Mr. Mkullo. We can go east or decide to drive west but that will remain the reality.

 

[Tujisenti]

Subiri kidogo akiisha iba vijisente huko Hazina atalipa tu. Lazma JK ana sababu yakumuweka hapo alipo.

 

[Mzee Mwanakijiji]

No matter what way we're going to take MMK, swala la attachement ya NSSF and Mbowe will be there. Kama mbowe anadaiwa na Mkullo anadaiwa then wote ni wadeni. Hakuna small mdeni au big mdeni, mdeni ni mdeni. Mbowe will be part of NSSF drowning back as well as Mr. Mkullo. We can go east or decide to drive west but that will remain the reality.

Ninakuelewa.. ni sawa sawa na watu walioshikwa kwenye time warp ambao wao jambo halina mwisho, wanakuwa kama misukule au vinyamkela.. Sasa wale ambao wanataka kung'ang'ania ya Mbowe kwa sababu tu Mkullo katajwa kwenye yake basi waendelee hivyo na ni haki yao.

Ndio maana katika ripoti yangu ya awali, nimemzungumzia Mkullo na suala lake la sasa sijaangalia jambo jingine lolote. Sasa kama inawapa watu unafuu kuwa kwa vile Mkullo ana deni ambalo hajalipa na limezaa riba kubwa hiyo (kama ya Mbowe) basi waendelee kuwafananisha.

Lakini kwangu, nachukulia kila mtu na issue yake, Mbowe atabeba msalaba wake na Mkullo atabeba wa kwake.. wale wanaofikiria kwa vile Mkullo kabebeshwa wa kwake basi kila mdaiwa mwingine naye abebeshwe regardless sina cha kuwasaidia.

Lakini utabakia pale pale.. Mbowe ana madeni yake na issue zake, na Mkullo anaya kwake, Mzindakaya ana ya kwake.. n.k na kila mmoja atahukumiwa kwa yake. Nyinyi ambao mnaona ukimhukumu huyu basi na huyu umhukumu ilimradi tu uonekane umehukumu endeleeni.

 

[Fundi Mchundo]

That the Minister of Finance Mr. Mustafa Haidi Mkullo owe one of our premier Bank a loan of 30,000,000 plus accrued interest to the total of about 24,000,000 ( a debt of abt 54,000,000). It has been allegedly estabilished with documentary proof that Mr. Mkullo while he was a Deputy Minister of Finance alipatiwa mkopo huo ambao hadi hivi sasa hajalipa kitu chochote kinachoeleweka....

So, anapojiandaa kusimama kusoma bajeti vile vinzi vinavyozunguka vimeahidi kuonesha ushahidi wa deni hilo kubwa muda mfupi baada kabla ya yeye kusoma bajeti hiyo.. so, kama ninyi na miye nimekaa ku subiri kuona kama 'vyalika'?

Mimi hii habari haijanikalia vizuri, maana naona imejaa innuendos! Kama hawa wakuu documentary proof wanayo, watuambie basi jina la benki, kiasi cha pesa kamili (sio hizo round figures na abts),lini Mheshimiwa alikopa, alitumia jina gani (yeye binafsi, kampuni yake n.k) na alikopa kwa makusudi gani. Hapo ndio ahukumiwe.

Au ndiyo uandishi wetu? Kila taarifa kama vile tunang'olewa meno!

 

[WildCard]

Wote wawili Mkulo na Mbowe WAMEKOPA, HAWAKUIBA. Na benki zina namna ya kushughulikia madeni haya hata zenyewe zinaposhindwa kuyakusanya.
Kinachonishangaza ni Mkulo kukopa "visenti" hivi wakati ameondoka NSSF akiwa hajambo kabisa. Ni yeye aliewabadilishia maisha wanasiasa wengi tu.

 

[omarilyas]

Mkullo is another Mbowe!!!!
I dont see why the name of the bank in this case is withheld, any reason MMK? Alichukua huu mkopo lini exactly?

Hawa ni watu wawili tofauti,

Mkullo alichukua mkopo akiwa naibu waziri wa fedha. Yaani anakop the same people ambao anapaswa kuwasimamia. Huu si uongozi na ni ufisadi kwa maana ya kuwa ametumia madaraka yake vibaya. Na mbaya zaidi ni hili la kutolipa maana sasa akiwa kama waziri wa fedha na huku anadaiwa na benki anayopaswa kuisimamia kamwe hawezi kutekeleza majukumu yake ipasavyo. hivi hii sio moja ya benki zilizotumika kupitisha fedha za wananchi katika amana ya EPA? Sasa ikiwa hivyo inakuwaje kiutendaji kwa upande wa mkulo?

Tanzanianjema

 

[Mzee Mwanakijiji]

Sijui hii kitu ina ukweli kiasi gani..... amueni wenyewe!