Uchochezi wa Mohamed Said na dhihaka kwa Wapigania Uhuru wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar

Uchochezi wa Mohamed Said na dhihaka kwa Wapigania Uhuru wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar

mzee mwanakijiji said:
la hasha; nimekuuliza kwa sababu ulichosema ni too general kiasi kwamba kinaweza kuhusiana na somo lolote. Hayo uliyotoa yanatofa kuwa mwongozo kwa mwanafunzi wa chuo kikuu au hata high school.

Sasa uandishi wa historia una kanuni tofauti kidogo. Nitakuwekea hapa kama zinavyopatikana kutoka hapa


  1. the recognition of a historical problem or the identification of a need for certain historical knowledge.
  2. the gathering of as much relevant information about the problem or topic as possible.
  3. if appropriate, the forming of hypothesis that tentatively explain relationships between historical factors.
  4. the rigorous collection and organization of evidence, and the verification of the authenticity and veracity of information and its sources.
  5. the selection, organization, and analysis of the most pertinent collected evidence, and the drawing of conclusions; and
  6. the recording of conclusions in a meaningful narrative.


sasa, bw. Said yeye hakuanza vizuri kaanza na hitimisho ambalo alilipata kwa wazee wake. Kwamba - nyerere aliwadhulumu waislamu na kuwatenga. Kutoka hapo akatoka na kuanza kutafuta ushahidi wa kuthibitisha nadharia yake aliyopewa na wazee wake. Katika kufanya hivyo; akakusanya ushahidi ule tu wenye kukubaliana na nadharia yake. Halafu mwishoni akaweka conclusion kuwa kweli nyerere aliwadhulumu waislamu. Hitimisho ambalo tayari alikuwa amelifikia kabla ya kufanya utafiti.

That my friend is an absurdity of the first category.
Click to expand...


sawa sawa,,

ni haki yako wewe kuyasema hayo kama mwanakijiji,
na hupingwi kwa mawazo yako,na msimamo wako unaheshimiwa..!

Wewe kitabu kinaenda kwenye toleo la tatu sasa na kupata kupewa thamani na vyuo vikuu vyenye heshima hapa ulimwenguni et sasa wewe uje na hoja ya kusema kwamba ilianza conclusion kwanza kabla ya utafiti??

Katika utafit wowote ule lazima identification of the problem of the topic ipewe kipaombele mkuu,,
sasa naona unataka kupotosha na kuwajaza watu fikra zako useme hizo ni fikra za moh said,watu siku hizi hawako ivo,akili za kuambiwa wao wanachanganya na zao,,
katika hili hapa sisi tumeshachanganya na zetu mwanakijiji..
 
Nyani Ngabu said:
Kile ni kitabu cha fiction bana.
Click to expand...

Aaaah, ahsante sana. Jibu zuri sana tena sana.

Ndiyo maana Mohamed Said anaalikwa kuongelea maandiko yake kwenye vyuo mbali mbali kwa sababu ndogo tu; SIYO 'fiction" bana!
 
THE BIG SHOW said:
sawa sawa,,

ni haki yako wewe kuyasema hayo kama mwanakijiji,
na hupingwi kwa mawazo yako,na msimamo wako unaheshimiwa..!

Wewe kitabu kinaenda kwenye toleo la tatu sasa na kupata kupewa thamani na vyuo vikuu vyenye heshima hapa ulimwenguni et sasa wewe uje na hoja ya kusema kwamba ilianza conclusion kwanza kabla ya utafiti??

Katika utafit wowote ule lazima identification of the problem of the topic ipewe kipaombele mkuu,,
sasa naona unataka kupotosha na kuwajaza watu fikra zako useme hizo ni fikra za moh said,watu siku hizi hawako ivo,akili za kuambiwa wao wanachanganya na zao,,
katika hili hapa sisi tumeshachanganya na zetu mwanakijiji..
Click to expand...

sidhani kama umechanganya na za kwako; unazitumia za Mohammed Said na unaamini anasema kweli na hivyo hutaki kuhoji msingi wa ukweli huo ni nini. Miye nimekusaidia tu kukufungua mawazo kuwa mtu akidai kitu haijalishi ni nani, haijalishi dai lake limekaa bila kuulizwa kwa miaka mingapi na haijlishi hata kama amepata tuzo kama siyo ukweli bado siyo ukweli.

Hata hivi sasa tunavyozungumza unaonekana umeamini alichosema Mohammed Said lakini nikikukuliza wewe maswali ya hicho ulichosoma hutakuwa na majibu zaidi ya kukimbilia kujihami kwenye maandishi ya Mohammed Said.
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji said:
la hasha; nimekuuliza kwa sababu ulichosema ni too general kiasi kwamba kinaweza kuhusiana na somo lolote. Hayo uliyotoa yanatofa kuwa mwongozo kwa mwanafunzi wa chuo kikuu au hata high school.

Sasa uandishi wa historia una kanuni tofauti kidogo. Nitakuwekea hapa kama zinavyopatikana kutoka HAPA


  1. the recognition of a historical problem or the identification of a need for certain historical knowledge.
  2. the gathering of as much relevant information about the problem or topic as possible.
  3. if appropriate, the forming of hypothesis that tentatively explain relationships between historical factors.
  4. The rigorous collection and organization of evidence, and the verification of the authenticity and veracity of information and its sources.
  5. The selection, organization, and analysis of the most pertinent collected evidence, and the drawing of conclusions; and
  6. the recording of conclusions in a meaningful narrative.


Sasa, Bw. Said yeye hakuanza vizuri kaanza na hitimisho ambalo alilipata kwa wazee wake. Kwamba - NYERERE ALIWADHULUMU WAISLAMU NA KUWATENGA. Kutoka hapo akatoka na kuanza kutafuta ushahidi wa kuthibitisha nadharia yake aliyopewa na wazee wake. Katika kufanya hivyo; akakusanya ushahidi ule tu wenye kukubaliana na nadharia yake. halafu mwishoni akaweka conclusion kuwa kweli Nyerere aliwadhulumu Waislamu. Hitimisho ambalo tayari alikuwa amelifikia kabla ya kufanya utafiti.

That my friend is an absurdity of the first category.
Click to expand...

Kwani lipi si kweli? ushamuona Mshume kwenye maandiko ya kivukoni? Ushamuona Tosiri?

Hivi wewe ulifikiri uhuru umekuja bila kupiganiwa? au fikt=ra zako zinakutuma kuwa Nyerere alikuwa "superman"? si angeudai Uhuru kuanzia Butiama kama ni yeye pekee ndiye shujaa wa kupigania Uhuru? kilimpeleka nini kuwekwa kwa Abdul Wahid Sykes, Mtaa wa Stanley? Kariakoo, Da Es Salaam.

Unaijuwa maana ya Dar Es Salaam?
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji said:
sidhani kama umechanganya na za kwako; unazitumia za Mohammed Said na unaamini anasema kweli na hivyo hutaki kuhoji msingi wa ukweli huo ni nini. Miye nimekusaidia tu kukufungua mawazo kuwa mtu akidai kitu haijalishi ni nani, haijalishi dai lake limekaa bila kuulizwa kwa miaka mingapi na haijlishi hata kama amepata tuzo kama siyo ukweli bado siyo ukweli.

Hata hivi sasa tunavyozungumza unaonekana umeamini alichosema Mohammed Said lakini nikikukuliza wewe maswali ya hicho ulichosoma hutakuwa na majibu zaidi ya kukimbilia kujihami kwenye maandishi ya Mohammed Said.
Click to expand...

Hivi wewe, Abdulwahid Sykes siyo wa ukweli? Kleist Sykes siyo wa ukweli, Mashado siyo wa ukweli? Tosiri siyo wa ukweli, Ali Sykes siyo wa ukweli, Abbas Sykes siyo wa ukweli? Phombeah siyo wa ukweli, Obote siyo wa ukweli?

Wa ukweli ni wewe na nyerere na kanisa katoliki tu?

Unamjuwa Father Kit Cunningham? hukusoma alipofundisha?
 
mzee mwanakijiji said:
sidhani kama umechanganya na za kwako; unazitumia za mohammed said na unaamini anasema kweli na hivyo hutaki kuhoji msingi wa ukweli huo ni nini. Miye nimekusaidia tu kukufungua mawazo kuwa mtu akidai kitu haijalishi ni nani, haijalishi dai lake limekaa bila kuulizwa kwa miaka mingapi na haijlishi hata kama amepata tuzo kama siyo ukweli bado siyo ukweli.

Hata hivi sasa tunavyozungumza unaonekana umeamini alichosema mohammed said lakini nikikukuliza wewe maswali ya hicho ulichosoma hutakuwa na majibu zaidi ya kukimbilia kujihami kwenye maandishi ya mohammed said.
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wewe ni mtafiti na mwanidish mzuri sana naamin,,
na bila shaka mimi ni miongoni mwa wasomaji wazuri sana,kile cha kivukoni nimekisoma na hiki cha moh said pia nimekisoma,

nimeshawishika kukiamini hiki cha moh said,vipi nimefanya dhambi??

Je huoni sasa una nafasi ya kutumia weledi wako wa utafit na uandish ukaandika ukweli unaoufaham ili ukasaidia kutuzindua wengi tuliopotoka?

Kama huoni umuhimu wa kuandika,ni kwa nini?

Na nisimuamini ndug moh said kwa nini??
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji said:
la hasha; nimekuuliza kwa sababu ulichosema ni too general kiasi kwamba kinaweza kuhusiana na somo lolote. Hayo uliyotoa yanatofa kuwa mwongozo kwa mwanafunzi wa chuo kikuu au hata high school.

Sasa uandishi wa historia una kanuni tofauti kidogo. Nitakuwekea hapa kama zinavyopatikana kutoka HAPA


  1. the recognition of a historical problem or the identification of a need for certain historical knowledge.
  2. the gathering of as much relevant information about the problem or topic as possible.
  3. if appropriate, the forming of hypothesis that tentatively explain relationships between historical factors.
  4. The rigorous collection and organization of evidence, and the verification of the authenticity and veracity of information and its sources.
  5. The selection, organization, and analysis of the most pertinent collected evidence, and the drawing of conclusions; and
  6. the recording of conclusions in a meaningful narrative.


Sasa, Bw. Said yeye hakuanza vizuri kaanza na hitimisho ambalo alilipata kwa wazee wake. Kwamba - NYERERE ALIWADHULUMU WAISLAMU NA KUWATENGA. Kutoka hapo akatoka na kuanza kutafuta ushahidi wa kuthibitisha nadharia yake aliyopewa na wazee wake. Katika kufanya hivyo; akakusanya ushahidi ule tu wenye kukubaliana na nadharia yake. halafu mwishoni akaweka conclusion kuwa kweli Nyerere aliwadhulumu Waislamu. Hitimisho ambalo tayari alikuwa amelifikia kabla ya kufanya utafiti.

That my friend is an absurdity of the first category.
Click to expand...

Hivi wewe mwandishi wa vijarida, una ubavu wa kusema "Bw. Said hakuanza vizuri"? umeshaandika historia yako? ya baba'ko? ya wazee wako? hata uweze kukosoa maandiko ya mohamed Said ambae kitabu chake kina miaka 15 sokoni na chapa ya tatu?

Amma kweli wewe u mwana kijiji, tena kilichokosa masomo.
 
zomba said:
hivi wewe, abdulwahi dsykes siyo wa ukweli? Kleist sykes siyo wa ukweli, mashado siyo wa ukweli? Tosiri siyo wa ukweli, ali sykes siyo wa ukweli, phombeah siyo wa ukweli, obote siyo wa ukweli?

Wa ukweli ni wewe na nyerere na kanisa katliki tu?

Unamjuwa father kit cunningham? Hukusoma alipofundisha?
Click to expand...

basi aandike ukweli anaoujua yeye tupate kuusoma na kuuelewa..!!
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji said:
Unajua ananikumbusha sana hapa Marekani ambapo mtu kakulia in 'the hood' kiasi kwamba anafikiria 'the hood' ndio Marekani. Kwa mtu kama huyo "point of reference" ni mtaa wake. Bw. Said kakulia hapo Dar na kasikiliza masimulizi ya wazee hawa wa Dar na bila ya kuyachuja wala kuyapima akayaamini kabisa na matokeo yake point of reference ya Tanganyika ni hapo tu. Wazee wakisema "hatukumjua Nyerere" basi anafikiri wamesema "Nyerere alikuwa hajulikani Tanganyika" na hivyo yeye anaandika "Nyerere hakuwa anajulikana Tanganyika"! Ukimuuliza kwanini anasema "wazee wangu waliniambia!"...

Na ukimuuliza zaidi anajikunyata pembeni...

"Miye sijibu maswali yote" anasema....
Click to expand...

Wewe nae, hiyo Merekani sisi tumeivaa, wewe unaiona ya maana sana? kwa hiyo "in the hood" ni Handeni? na siyo Merekani?

Wewe ndio kama kipofu aliyeona punda, huko Merekani ulienda kupandia ndege wapi kaba ya kwenda? Handeni International Airport?

Wengine tunawajuwa wanaishi Merekani kama "disables". Jee hulijuwi hilo?

Unfortunate victim of ambiguity.
 
Gwalihenzi said:
Sijakuelewa, mswada wake nani?Tewa? kwa hiyo uandishi wako pamoja na majigambo yako yote ni wa "hear say" tu!
Click to expand...

Mtu anakwambia "nimesoma" wewe unamwambia "hearsay".

Are you for real?
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji said:
zomba said:
wenzako wakija na kuanza kutukana dini yako usiwe wa kwanza kusema 'wametutukana'... kipimo unachotumia kwa wengine kitatumiwa dhidi yako...
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Tazama fikra, zinafanana hazifanani?
Tazama sharubu, zinafanana hazifanani?
Tazama dini zinafanana hazifanani?
Tazama ma boss wao wanafanana hawafanani?
Tazama udikteta unavyotofautiana, mmoja dikteta mzuri, mmoja dikteta mbaya.

Kuna nini cha kupima zaidi ya hayo? urefu? ufupi? umri?
Click to expand...
 
THE BIG SHOW said:
wewe ni mtafiti na mwanidish mzuri sana naamin,,
na bila shaka mimi ni miongoni mwa wasomaji wazuri sana,kile cha kivukoni nimekisoma na hiki cha moh said pia nimekisoma,

nimeshawishika kukiamini hiki cha moh said,vipi nimefanya dhambi??

Je huoni sasa una nafasi ya kutumia weledi wako wa utafit na uandish ukaandika ukweli unaoufaham ili ukasaidia kutuzindua wengi tuliopotoka?

Kama huoni umuhimu wa kuandika,ni kwa nini?

Na nisimuamini ndug moh said kwa nini??
Click to expand...

sawa; kwenye ukurasa wa ngapi wa kitabu cha Kivukoni panaposema Nyerere alisema amepigania uhuru peke yake; na ni ukurasa gani unasema Nyerere alisema aandikwe yeye peke yake tu na si wengine. Unaweza ukaweka na nukuu yake.
 
Jasusi said:
Ya Camp David tena? wahenga wanasemaje vile? Ficha ujinga wako. Tangu Lini Menachem Begin akawa Moshe Dayan?
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Maandiko yako ntakubandikia hapa kwa mara nyingine. Sema Su!
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji said:
Unajua ananikumbusha sana hapa Marekani ambapo mtu kakulia in 'the hood' kiasi kwamba anafikiria 'the hood' ndio Marekani. Kwa mtu kama huyo "point of reference" ni mtaa wake. Bw. Said kakulia hapo Dar na kasikiliza masimulizi ya wazee hawa wa Dar na bila ya kuyachuja wala kuyapima akayaamini kabisa na matokeo yake point of reference ya Tanganyika ni hapo tu. Wazee wakisema "hatukumjua Nyerere" basi anafikiri wamesema "Nyerere alikuwa hajulikani Tanganyika" na hivyo yeye anaandika "Nyerere hakuwa anajulikana Tanganyika"! Ukimuuliza kwanini anasema "wazee wangu waliniambia!"...

Na ukimuuliza zaidi anajikunyata pembeni...

"Miye sijibu maswali yote" anasema....
Click to expand...

MM,

Naamini umetumia ''kujikunyata'' kama pambo la lugha hukuwa na maana
ya mimi kunyongea.

Ikiwa umetumia neno ''kujikunyata'' kwa maana yake halisi basi nakueleza
mimi sijukunyati kwa mtu yoyote yule.

Nimeandika kuhusu historia ya wazee wangu mie bado kijana na Nyerere yu
hai.

Nikamweleza marehemu Abdulwahid Sykes na mchango wa Waislam Nyerere
yu hai.

Magazeti yale yakakusanywa yakachomwa moto nami nikilijua hilo na sikuogopa.

Majibu yakatoka Dodoma CCM kunijibu na nikaingia katika mnakasha na mabingwa
wa historia wa CCM bila hofu.

Hivi kweli inayumkinika nije nijikunyate kwako wewe?

Hebu staladhi hapa chini:

[TABLE="class: MsoNormalTable"]
[TR]
[TD] In supporting Nyerere for his recent call and taking up the challenge to record a correct history which he had for the first time advanced in 1974 and again in 1985 the present author published an article in African Events [1] in which Abdulwahid and other forgotten TANU pioneers received prominence. In that article the author did what no other scholar had done before.

He mentioned the fact that Muslims were in the forefront during the struggle for independence. It was at that time taboo to associate Islam or Muslims with the independence movement. The author received sharp rebuke from a Party historian, Dr Mayanja Kiwanuka, a leading member of the panel which wrote the Party book Historia ya Chama Cha TANU 1954-1977, the official history of the Party. The Party historian had this to say:[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 601"] ''(the)... article...argues that although Muslims in Tanzania played a crucial role in the struggle for independence, there is a deliberate effort to downplay their contribution. Consequently, the entire article contains half-baked fairy tales to sustain his argument, more so by mentioning names of several TANU stalwarts who happened to be Muslims...The greatness of TANU, indeed that of its founder-leader, Mwalimu Nyerere, is that, in so short a time since its inception, it managed to weave together into a formidable, relatively homogenous nationalist movement, a people so ethnically, culturally and religiously diverse... Said's major goal is to sow seeds of discord, and at any price, truth to him is a matter to be ignored.'' [2][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 601"] This was the reaction from Kiwanuka, who supervised the research on the official history of the party, reducing a research article to what he called a ‘fairy tale'. The author was also accused of lying. Kiwanuka, not deviating from the Party stand, emphasised ‘the greatness of the party and its founder-leader'. Kiwanuka was at that time the Assistant Secretary in the Department of Political Propaganda and Mass Mobilisation of the Chama Cha Mapinduzi. Kiwanuka had as an undergraduate student at University of Dar es Salaam, written on post-independence Muslim-Christian relations.[3] [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 601"][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[1]See M. Said, ‘In Praise of Ancestors' Africa Events, London, March/April 1988, pp. 37-41.
[2]See Africa Events, May, 1988, letter by Dr K. Mayanja Kiwanuka.
 [3]K. Mayanja Kiwanuka,
The Politics of Islam in Bukoba District (1973), B.A. Thesis, University of Dar es Salaam.

Mimi sikujikunyata kwa hawa nijikunyate kwako.

Sijibu kwa kuwa maswali yenu mengine yanachusha hayamtii mtu hamu ya kuandika.
 
Mohamed Said said:
Mimi sikujikunyata kwa hawa nijikunyate kwako.

Sijibu kwa kuwa maswali yenu mengine yanachusha hayamtii mtu hamu ya kuandika.
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Napendekeza tufanye mazungumzo na wewe nikuhoji kuhusu ulichoandika tuone utavumilia kwa muda gani kutetea hoja zako. Sidhani kama umeshakutana na maswali ninayouliza mimi.
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji said:
Napendekeza tufanye mazungumzo na wewe nikuhoji kuhusu ulichoandika tuone utavumilia kwa muda gani kutetea hoja zako. Sidhani kama umeshakutana na maswali ninayouliza mimi.
Click to expand...

Si ndiyo nakuambia unachusha.

Taarifa zote kwenye post unakuja na hii.
 
Mag3 said:
Nadhani umefika wakati mwafaka wa kumuumbua huyu mchochezi anayetumia kalamu yake kupandikiza chuki baina ya jamii ya Watanzania bila kutambua athari za hizi juhudi zake. Mohamed Said ni mtu hatari aliyeweza kuwarubuni na kuwateka wengi wenye uelewa finyu kwa kivuli cha dini, mfano hai unapatikana humu...wapo waamini wake ambao kwa upofu wao wameshindwa kabisa kuzitambua hila zake huyu mchochezi. Hapa chini ninampa maswali machache mapya ambayo natumaini yatawafumbua macho waliofunikwa na wingu zito na kushindwa kabisa kumwona huyu mchochezi kwa rangi yake;


  1. African Association (AA) kama ilivyo chimbuko lake ni nini, iliasisiwa lini, na nani na kwa malengo yapi?
  2. Kwa nini baadaye ilibidi jina hili libadilike na kujulikana kama TAA?
  3. Je ilikuwa lazima mtu awe mkaazi wa Dar es Salaam ili aweze kuwa Kiongozi wa TAA?
  4. Mawasiliano ya kwanza kabisa kati ya Mwalimu Nyerere na wazee wako wa Gerezani yalifanyika lini?
  5. Hayo mawasiliano yalianzishwa na nani, Mwalimu Nyerere au wazee wako wa Gerezani?
  6. Nani alifanya "approach" ya kwanza kumfikia (kumtembelea) mwingine...Mwalimu Nyerere au wazee wako wa Gerezani.
  7. Je kuna mikutano yoyote ilifanyika nyumbani kwa Mwalimu Nyerere akiwa Pugu? Kama ilifanyika ni ipiilikuwa ajenda kuu?
  8. Mkutano wa TAA wa October, 1953 ulifanyika katika nyumba iliyokuwa New Street, Dar es Salaam...hii nyumba ilikuwa ya nani, ilijengwa na nani na kwa malengo gani?
  9. Katika kubuni jina TANU, pendekezo la kwanza lilikuwa TAU (kumbuka Kenya tayari walikuwa na KAU)...je ni nani alipendekeza neno "National" liongezwe na kwa sababu zipi?
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Heanding ya huu uzi imeandikwa Uchochezi wa Mohamed Said unatakiwa usithibitishe siyo kujifariji na kujiliwaza na maswali yako ambayo hayana tija.

Hapa siyo chumba cha mtihani kama unajua chochote kuhusu historia ya Tanganyika andika watu wasome. Halafu unajidanganya sana eti imefika wakati wa kumuumbua Mohamed Said watu wanajielewa huwezi kuwashikia watu akili.

Bila Mohamed Said wewe ungejua kuwa Mama Maria Nyerere alipewa duka mtaa wa Mchikichi anauza mafuta ya Taa.

Ungejua kuwa Nyerere alikuwa anakaa nyumba kwa Abdulwahid.

Angalia usije kupata ungojwa wa moyo bure kitabu kina mwaka wa 15 wameshindwa kina Nyerere na wenzake kumuumbua uje kumuumbua wewe na vimaswali vyako vya chekechea huku umejificha nyuma ya Laptop.
 
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