Julian, hapana. Kama wewe umeamua kuwa academician, basi cheza ngoma ya academics! YOU ARE TRYING TO BE PHILOSOPHICAL! Kutetea uozo lakini mi na wanabodi wenzangu tunasema hapana!! Enzi za kuangalia kisomo kwa utendaji kimekwisha! Warioba and co. should go back to school period! PWU bwana hakina hadhi ya kuproduce VC wa institution kama MU! Nimekiangalia..just google..its useless institution..Jamani...Harafu inaonekana watu humu wanahisia..sijui kwa sababu some are the product of this questionable system ya MU.....The fact remains MU needs to be serious if at all it is to be taken serious..HAKUNA MWENYE CHUKI NA WARIOBA...watu waende shule wasome.......
Baadhi ya Lecturers wa Mzumbe wana degree Feki - VC wao naye FEKI
Baadhi ya Lecturers wa Mzumbe wana degree Feki - VC wao naye FEKI
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Julian Emmanuel
Member
- Mar 6, 2007
- 38
- 6
Ndugu yangu Mikuki
Bado Sijakuelewa unaposema elimu ya mtu haipimwi kwa utendaji wake wa kazi bado nashangaa maana sijaelewa unamaanisha nini.
Tofautisha utendaji kazi na ubabaishaji,
elimu inamjengea mtu uwezo wa
1 kubuni
2 kupanga
3 kuandaa
4 kutekeleza
5 kupima matokeo ya mpango
yote hayo matano kitaalamu
ubabaishaji ni ile dhana ya mtu kutoweza kuvikamilisha vipengele hivyo vitano katika taaluma yake bali anachokifanya ni kujifanya yuko "bize" mbele za watu na kutoa "orders" kwa wengine, huo si uchapa kazi bali ni ubabaishaji.
Msimamo wangu unabaki pale pale kuwa elimu ya mtu haipimwi kwa cheti chake wala chuo alichosomea
bali uwezo wake wa kutekeleza yale ambayo elimu hiyo ilimlenga awe na uwezo wa kuyafanya.
Ni wakati kila mmoja ajiulize yeye anaweza kufanya nini katika taaluma yake na hiyo ndio elimu aliyo nayo na si karatasi (cheti) alichopewa wala si "initials" alizoongezewa (kama Dk, Eng, nk)
/COLOR]
Bado Sijakuelewa unaposema elimu ya mtu haipimwi kwa utendaji wake wa kazi bado nashangaa maana sijaelewa unamaanisha nini.
Tofautisha utendaji kazi na ubabaishaji,
elimu inamjengea mtu uwezo wa
1 kubuni
2 kupanga
3 kuandaa
4 kutekeleza
5 kupima matokeo ya mpango
yote hayo matano kitaalamu
ubabaishaji ni ile dhana ya mtu kutoweza kuvikamilisha vipengele hivyo vitano katika taaluma yake bali anachokifanya ni kujifanya yuko "bize" mbele za watu na kutoa "orders" kwa wengine, huo si uchapa kazi bali ni ubabaishaji.
Msimamo wangu unabaki pale pale kuwa elimu ya mtu haipimwi kwa cheti chake wala chuo alichosomea
bali uwezo wake wa kutekeleza yale ambayo elimu hiyo ilimlenga awe na uwezo wa kuyafanya.
Ni wakati kila mmoja ajiulize yeye anaweza kufanya nini katika taaluma yake na hiyo ndio elimu aliyo nayo na si karatasi (cheti) alichopewa wala si "initials" alizoongezewa (kama Dk, Eng, nk)
/COLOR]
Julian,
Nakubaliana kabisa na wewe kuwa uelimikaji wa mtu haupimwi tu na vyeti pamoja na titles alizonazo nazo kama Dr., Eng. etc ni pamoja na matokeo yaani ufanisi katika utendaji katika fani. Kama hiyo ni kweli, ni kwa nini basi Prof Warioba na kundi lake wakaenda jichotea vyeti toka katika vyuo bogus? si wangebakia na elimu zao Masters pamoja na utumishi wao uliotukuka? leo hoo tusingekuwa tunajadili suala la vyeti feki ndani ya academia. In short Warioba et al walikuwa na tamaa ya titles and at the end of the day they even make us question their credibilities to be in academia!
Nakubaliana kabisa na wewe kuwa uelimikaji wa mtu haupimwi tu na vyeti pamoja na titles alizonazo nazo kama Dr., Eng. etc ni pamoja na matokeo yaani ufanisi katika utendaji katika fani. Kama hiyo ni kweli, ni kwa nini basi Prof Warioba na kundi lake wakaenda jichotea vyeti toka katika vyuo bogus? si wangebakia na elimu zao Masters pamoja na utumishi wao uliotukuka? leo hoo tusingekuwa tunajadili suala la vyeti feki ndani ya academia. In short Warioba et al walikuwa na tamaa ya titles and at the end of the day they even make us question their credibilities to be in academia!
Julian Emmanuel
Member
- Mar 6, 2007
- 38
- 6
mTz
Mbona ndugu zangu hatuelewani?
njia ninayowapa ndio njia pekee ya kujua nani anajua nini!
huweza kufanya kazi zinazotakiwa kufanywa na mtu mwenye taaluma ya profesa wakati wewe taaluma yako ni masters tu ukazifanya kwa ufanisi bali itakuwa ubabaishaji.
Taaluma anayopewa mtu huwa inampa uwezo fulani sawa na kutengeneza kifaa ili kiwe na uwezo wa kufanya kazi fulani. Ukitengeneza kifaa ukakiita jina fulani hatuhitaji kuangalia unasifika vipi kwa utengenezaji wa hivyo vifaa au hauna leseni ya kuvitengeneza, bali ukitengeneza kifaa ukakiita simu tunachoangalia ni je kinaweza kufanya shughuli ambazo kitu kinachoitwa simu kinatakiwa kufanya? kama kinaweza hiyo ni simu haijalishi nani katengeneza, kama hakiwezi kutokana na jinsi kilivyo tengenezwa na si kutokana na sababu zinazokubalika kitaalamu basi hiyo sio simu haijalishi mtengenezaji ni nani uwe unasifika au hujulikani.
Ukitengeneza kitu ukakiita kompyuta kama hakiwezi kufanya shughuli ambazo komputer inatakiwa kufanya kutokana na kilivyotengenezwa basi hiyo si kompyuter. kompyuter haiwi kompyuter kutokana na nani aliitengeneza bali kutokana na inaweza kufanya nini.
Chuo kikitoa mhitimu kikamuita Mwanasheria katika ngazi ya shahada kama hawezi kufanya shughuli zinzzotakiwa kufanywa na mtu mwenye taaluma hiyo huyo si mwanasheria kwa ngazi hiyo hata kama chuo alichosomea kinasifika vipi. Chuo kikitoa Mhandisi wa shahada kama hawezi kufanya zile shighuli ambazo mtu mwenye taaluma kwa ngazi hiyo anaweza kufanya sio mhandisi hata kama chuo chake kinasifika vipi.
Kwa upande mwingine kama mtu anaweza kufanya hizokazi za mtu mwenye taaluma hiyo katika ngazi hiyo hata kama chuo alichosoma hakifahamiki basi huyo anayohiyo taalum.
Naomba tusichanganye, Pale ninaposema uwezo wa mtu kufanya kazi sina maana ya mtu kusema mimi nataka mtu wa kupanga mafaili yangu na sifa zake inabidi awe na shahada fulani na mtu akifika akayapanga hayo mafaili basi tuseme shahada yake ni sahihi
Bali namaanisha kuwa kwa kila mchepuo au taaluma kila ngazi kuna malengo ambayo wanaweka kwamba mtu tukisha mpatia elimu hii, mhitimu anatakiwa kuwa na uwezo wa kufanya moja, mbili, tatu ...
basi mtu bila kufikia malengo hayo (kwa minimum requirement) anakuwa hana hiyo taaluma hata kama amesoma wapi na kama mtu akifikia hayo malengo anakuwa nayo hiyo taaluma bila kujali kapitia wapi.
Swala la kufoji vyeti linatokana na ubabaishaji katika wale wanaohitaji watu wenye taaluma fulani. Kama ukiangalia vyeti kuwa hiyo ndio taaluma ya watu basi watu watafoji vyeti lakini kama utaangalia uwezo wao bali watu watatafuta elimu maana uwezo wako huwezi kuufoji.
Mbona ndugu zangu hatuelewani?
njia ninayowapa ndio njia pekee ya kujua nani anajua nini!
huweza kufanya kazi zinazotakiwa kufanywa na mtu mwenye taaluma ya profesa wakati wewe taaluma yako ni masters tu ukazifanya kwa ufanisi bali itakuwa ubabaishaji.
Taaluma anayopewa mtu huwa inampa uwezo fulani sawa na kutengeneza kifaa ili kiwe na uwezo wa kufanya kazi fulani. Ukitengeneza kifaa ukakiita jina fulani hatuhitaji kuangalia unasifika vipi kwa utengenezaji wa hivyo vifaa au hauna leseni ya kuvitengeneza, bali ukitengeneza kifaa ukakiita simu tunachoangalia ni je kinaweza kufanya shughuli ambazo kitu kinachoitwa simu kinatakiwa kufanya? kama kinaweza hiyo ni simu haijalishi nani katengeneza, kama hakiwezi kutokana na jinsi kilivyo tengenezwa na si kutokana na sababu zinazokubalika kitaalamu basi hiyo sio simu haijalishi mtengenezaji ni nani uwe unasifika au hujulikani.
Ukitengeneza kitu ukakiita kompyuta kama hakiwezi kufanya shughuli ambazo komputer inatakiwa kufanya kutokana na kilivyotengenezwa basi hiyo si kompyuter. kompyuter haiwi kompyuter kutokana na nani aliitengeneza bali kutokana na inaweza kufanya nini.
Chuo kikitoa mhitimu kikamuita Mwanasheria katika ngazi ya shahada kama hawezi kufanya shughuli zinzzotakiwa kufanywa na mtu mwenye taaluma hiyo huyo si mwanasheria kwa ngazi hiyo hata kama chuo alichosomea kinasifika vipi. Chuo kikitoa Mhandisi wa shahada kama hawezi kufanya zile shighuli ambazo mtu mwenye taaluma kwa ngazi hiyo anaweza kufanya sio mhandisi hata kama chuo chake kinasifika vipi.
Kwa upande mwingine kama mtu anaweza kufanya hizokazi za mtu mwenye taaluma hiyo katika ngazi hiyo hata kama chuo alichosoma hakifahamiki basi huyo anayohiyo taalum.
Naomba tusichanganye, Pale ninaposema uwezo wa mtu kufanya kazi sina maana ya mtu kusema mimi nataka mtu wa kupanga mafaili yangu na sifa zake inabidi awe na shahada fulani na mtu akifika akayapanga hayo mafaili basi tuseme shahada yake ni sahihi
Bali namaanisha kuwa kwa kila mchepuo au taaluma kila ngazi kuna malengo ambayo wanaweka kwamba mtu tukisha mpatia elimu hii, mhitimu anatakiwa kuwa na uwezo wa kufanya moja, mbili, tatu ...
basi mtu bila kufikia malengo hayo (kwa minimum requirement) anakuwa hana hiyo taaluma hata kama amesoma wapi na kama mtu akifikia hayo malengo anakuwa nayo hiyo taaluma bila kujali kapitia wapi.
Swala la kufoji vyeti linatokana na ubabaishaji katika wale wanaohitaji watu wenye taaluma fulani. Kama ukiangalia vyeti kuwa hiyo ndio taaluma ya watu basi watu watafoji vyeti lakini kama utaangalia uwezo wao bali watu watatafuta elimu maana uwezo wako huwezi kuufoji.
Julian Emmanuel
Member
- Mar 6, 2007
- 38
- 6
Bogus university according to whom? and by what criteria?
Personally i regard university to be good or bogus based on how it fullfills its obligation the most important is creating people with knowledge.
not by perception where you can find somebody saying certain university is bad because so and so is saying is bad, how is it bad? somebody doenst know.
It is not fair as well to critisize it based on geagraphical location, for instance someone finding university in rwanda and then because of his/her haterage to that country then somebody says it must be bad.
If accrding to your definition bogus university means University which is not registered with certain group i can not support you or them on that. My defition is based on performance on objectives of that university and not membership of certain groups.
To cut short Personally i think what determines level of education of the so called Warioba is what he has in his head and not where he got that.
If in his head he has that knowledge of PHD he is real doctorate no matter his path
If he doesnt then he is not no matter his path,
not only him even others including you if you have any certificate which you can not deffend using your head, that is "feki" no matter how good your school was
Lets not make this issue personal, are you among the "team"? unfortunately I'm not. Now back to issue.
To cut short Personally i think what determines level of education of the so called Warioba is what he has in his head and not where he got that
. If in his head he has that knowledge of PHD he is real doctorate no matter his path If he doesnt then he is not no matter his path, not only him even others including you if you have any certificate which you can not deffend using your head, that is "feki" no matter how good your school was.
Then why take all trouble to grab a bogus PhD qualification from a bogus university? Can you please take time to read these attachments to understand what I'm talking about.
To cut short Personally i think what determines level of education of the so called Warioba is what he has in his head and not where he got that
. If in his head he has that knowledge of PHD he is real doctorate no matter his path If he doesnt then he is not no matter his path, not only him even others including you if you have any certificate which you can not deffend using your head, that is "feki" no matter how good your school was.
Then why take all trouble to grab a bogus PhD qualification from a bogus university? Can you please take time to read these attachments to understand what I'm talking about.
mTz,
Ndg yangu, hongera sana kwa kuchukua jukumu la kuelimisha, ndio uzuri wa JF kuna walimu wazuri tu
actually what you underlined hapo juu, nami nilikuwa nataka kuuliza kaswali kidogo kwa ndg yetu Julian.
Julian,
sina hakika wewe ni nani, and its not that important mimi au mwingine kufahamu at the moment.
katika ulimwengu wa elimu kuna kitu chaitwa STANDARD,
kila kitu kina level of STANDARD set ili kukidhi malengo fulani iwe ni katika maisha yetu ya kila siku (be it politically, economically or socially) + Elimu zetu.
sasa unapoingia katika mifumo ya kielimu, kuna STANDARD zake zimekuwa set. Agreed, kuna watu leave alone having Masters degree, they just have a bachelor degree and they did wonders (be it administration wise, katika research both scientific, social, political and economical researches.......i mean sio mmoja ni wengi tu are fantastic at their own level or sometimes even more na hapo ndipo unasikia mtu anaambiwa fanya mitihani fulani na andika paper wa kadha na anatumikiwa shahada au stashahada kulingana na........... again standards set), however all that does not nullify the education level standards set by an institution and associations zinazotambulika kimataifa
na ndio maana utakuta hata wale mabaharia wana levels zao, Medical Doctors pia, Wahasibu pia, Wahandisi pia, walimu wa Vyuo Vikuu pia etc etc.
The valid point of yours ni kwamba you can have so many degrees and hata to PhD level, lakini kama performance yako na ujuzi wa subject matter bado ni hafifu then ni sawa na ZERO.
Vile vile ni vyema ukakubali kuwa Universities zina standards zake agreed kimataifa ili ku-protect interest za viumbe hapa duniani, sasa kama wewe umeamua ku-call you own house a University that provides degrees up to PhD level, the question is to who's/whom's standards ili umfanyie nani kazi?
now the problem comes when you want to be part of the system ambayo ina standard tofauti na hiyo nyumba yako uliyoamua kuiita University.
kwa hiyo Warioba kujua the subject matter ni sahihi kwani naamini ana elimu nzuri tu hadi level ya masters lakini PhD!!!! no man he can do better than what he obtained,
I believe his bachelor and/or masters ina maana zaidi kuliko hiyo PhD feki isiyotambulika na Taifa letu......you know what i mean....!?
Ndg yangu, hongera sana kwa kuchukua jukumu la kuelimisha, ndio uzuri wa JF kuna walimu wazuri tu
actually what you underlined hapo juu, nami nilikuwa nataka kuuliza kaswali kidogo kwa ndg yetu Julian.
Julian,
sina hakika wewe ni nani, and its not that important mimi au mwingine kufahamu at the moment.
katika ulimwengu wa elimu kuna kitu chaitwa STANDARD,
kila kitu kina level of STANDARD set ili kukidhi malengo fulani iwe ni katika maisha yetu ya kila siku (be it politically, economically or socially) + Elimu zetu.
sasa unapoingia katika mifumo ya kielimu, kuna STANDARD zake zimekuwa set. Agreed, kuna watu leave alone having Masters degree, they just have a bachelor degree and they did wonders (be it administration wise, katika research both scientific, social, political and economical researches.......i mean sio mmoja ni wengi tu are fantastic at their own level or sometimes even more na hapo ndipo unasikia mtu anaambiwa fanya mitihani fulani na andika paper wa kadha na anatumikiwa shahada au stashahada kulingana na........... again standards set), however all that does not nullify the education level standards set by an institution and associations zinazotambulika kimataifa
na ndio maana utakuta hata wale mabaharia wana levels zao, Medical Doctors pia, Wahasibu pia, Wahandisi pia, walimu wa Vyuo Vikuu pia etc etc.
The valid point of yours ni kwamba you can have so many degrees and hata to PhD level, lakini kama performance yako na ujuzi wa subject matter bado ni hafifu then ni sawa na ZERO.
Vile vile ni vyema ukakubali kuwa Universities zina standards zake agreed kimataifa ili ku-protect interest za viumbe hapa duniani, sasa kama wewe umeamua ku-call you own house a University that provides degrees up to PhD level, the question is to who's/whom's standards ili umfanyie nani kazi?
now the problem comes when you want to be part of the system ambayo ina standard tofauti na hiyo nyumba yako uliyoamua kuiita University.
kwa hiyo Warioba kujua the subject matter ni sahihi kwani naamini ana elimu nzuri tu hadi level ya masters lakini PhD!!!! no man he can do better than what he obtained,
I believe his bachelor and/or masters ina maana zaidi kuliko hiyo PhD feki isiyotambulika na Taifa letu......you know what i mean....!?
Ogah,
Nashukuru mkuu, tusaidiane kumuelewesha ndugu yetu Julian. Kama ulivyosema suala la standards ni muhimu sana katika vyuo vikuu. Katika vyuo vyetu hasa UDSM na SUA huwezi kuwa mwalimu kama hauna GPA ya 3.8 and 3.5 respectively at undergraduate degree na kwa Masters lazima uwe na average B or above. Actually in those universities (if not mistaken) hata ukiwa na PhD kama haujafikia kigezo cha undergraduate bado haupewi kazi, though I feel that is a bit unfair.
To be sincere, once in academia there is no shortcut, PhD lazima iwe ya kueleweka. Kama haiwezekani basi one has to go and look for job somewhere else. I am actaully wondering Pale MU since Warioba was the boss during tranformation, kwanini asingeweka sheria kuwa one can rise up to a rank associate professor with Masters as it is/used to be (not sure) in UDSM. Hapo angepeta kiulaini na leo hii tusingekuwa tunaongelea haya.
I can understant tatizo la baadhi ya watu wa MU hasa ambao umri umesogea, its quite a hasle kuanza kuhangaika na PhD uzeeni. Lakini Warioba angetumia busara kidogo hata kuweka utaratibu kuwa members wote hasa wanaokaribia retirement age wangepewa option kutokuwa promoted to the next rank if it required a PhD na wale vijana wote wanegambiwa waende shule proper. I think the same deal was struck when chuo cha ushirika Moshi became part of SUA. Sasa tatizo ni kuwa walivyoona kuwa IDM inakuwa MU kila mtu kachangamkia PhD za ubwete, very unfortunate. Lakini kwa system yetu bongo ya laisse faire watapeta tu na kibaya wazee kama Warioba wameinfect hako syndrome mpaka kwa vijana kama Kamala, God knows how many more in MU will follow his footsteps.
Nashukuru mkuu, tusaidiane kumuelewesha ndugu yetu Julian. Kama ulivyosema suala la standards ni muhimu sana katika vyuo vikuu. Katika vyuo vyetu hasa UDSM na SUA huwezi kuwa mwalimu kama hauna GPA ya 3.8 and 3.5 respectively at undergraduate degree na kwa Masters lazima uwe na average B or above. Actually in those universities (if not mistaken) hata ukiwa na PhD kama haujafikia kigezo cha undergraduate bado haupewi kazi, though I feel that is a bit unfair.
To be sincere, once in academia there is no shortcut, PhD lazima iwe ya kueleweka. Kama haiwezekani basi one has to go and look for job somewhere else. I am actaully wondering Pale MU since Warioba was the boss during tranformation, kwanini asingeweka sheria kuwa one can rise up to a rank associate professor with Masters as it is/used to be (not sure) in UDSM. Hapo angepeta kiulaini na leo hii tusingekuwa tunaongelea haya.
I can understant tatizo la baadhi ya watu wa MU hasa ambao umri umesogea, its quite a hasle kuanza kuhangaika na PhD uzeeni. Lakini Warioba angetumia busara kidogo hata kuweka utaratibu kuwa members wote hasa wanaokaribia retirement age wangepewa option kutokuwa promoted to the next rank if it required a PhD na wale vijana wote wanegambiwa waende shule proper. I think the same deal was struck when chuo cha ushirika Moshi became part of SUA. Sasa tatizo ni kuwa walivyoona kuwa IDM inakuwa MU kila mtu kachangamkia PhD za ubwete, very unfortunate. Lakini kwa system yetu bongo ya laisse faire watapeta tu na kibaya wazee kama Warioba wameinfect hako syndrome mpaka kwa vijana kama Kamala, God knows how many more in MU will follow his footsteps.
Julian Emmanuel
Member
- Mar 6, 2007
- 38
- 6
Sijui kwa nini hatuelewani
Standards in process are there to protect the quality of outputs but they do not guarantee that the out put product must be of quality if those standards are met in process.
some of those standards are influenced by political move but not set based on what products must be.
sometimes there is no constant monitoring programs to ensure that these standards are met by those registered members throughout.
sometimes these standards are affected by corruption.
others are affected by peoples belives and proud. mfano zamani wahitimu wa kutoka vyuo vya ufundi kama DIT walikataliwa kujiunga na Board ya Wahandisi, hii ilitokana na imani za watu fulani, bila kufanya changes yoyote within DIT uongozi wa bodi ya wahandisi ulivyobadilika wakakubaliwa kujiunga.
sasa katika mazingira kama haya hatuwezi kusema kwa sababu chuo fulani hakijasajiliwa na fulani hakina ubora au kwa sababu chuo fulani kimesajiliwa na fulani kina ubora.
ndio maana nikasema tuwe tunatest kila product
ikionekana kuwa na viwango vinavyohitajika basi tunasema hiyo ni bora.
kiwango cha ubora kwa msomi ni elimu aliyoipata.
Nikichukulia mifano mingi katika nchi yetu ukienda katika wizara na mashirika mbali mbali kuna watu wengi wana hizo mnaita "goog degrees" kutoka vyuo vinavyosifika kutoka ulaya
lakini hao hao fuatilia utendaji wao, wananunua vifaa feki, wanaingia mikataba mibovu, kwa ujumla what we call "value for money" katika procurement zao mbalimbali hakuna lakini wanabaki wakijivunia vyuo walivyo soma. na wengi sio kwa sababu ya kuongwa bali kutokana na uwezo wao mdogo katika mambo hayo.
ila mtizamo hapa naona ni ule ule maana inaonekana kuna watu wanasema ubora wa bidhaa ni vyeti vya ubora alivyonavyo mtengenezaji au mtengenezaji anasifa gani. Lakini mimi napenda kuwashauri kuwa ubora wa bidhaa uko kwenye bidhaa yenyewe. iko chini ya viwango imetengenezwa na mtu anayesifika haifai, inakiwango imetengenezwa na mtu asiyefahamika inafaa.
ndio maana mimi nasema ukisema wewe ni mhandisi
hata kama ulipita chuo kizuri sana cha kihandisi, hata kama bodi ya wahandisi imekusajili kama huwezi " focus and plan future, design and implement and maintaining in your area of field" wewe si mhandisi.
hivyo watu tusiwahukumu kwa vyeti vyao bali elimu waliyoipata.
unacheti kizuri kutoka chuo kizuri unaenda kunua generator unaleta mbovu inashindwa kufanya kazi basi tunajua cheti chako feki, chuo hakifahamiki unanunua generator nzuri unaitunza vizuri katika garama zinazohitajika basi tunajua cheti chako is good certificate.
siku zote mtu asiyejua huwa akisema kitu fulani hakifai ukimuuliza kwa nini atakuambia kwa sababu fulani kasema. ila anayejua akisema hakifai atakupa sababu za hicho kitu kwa nini hakifai hivyo tunaposema kitu fulani hakifai mfano degree lazima sisi tuwe na vigezo na sio kusikiliza kama kuna mtu au taasisi iliyosema hakifai maana huyo aliyesema anasema ili na sisi ama tukubaliane nae au tutofautiane nae kulingana na vigezo alivyovitumia.
mimi nafikiri utata huu utaondoka kama tutaamua kuangalia elimu aliyonayo mtu maana kama mkiangalia chuo alichosoma mtu je yule aliyenunua cheti kutoka katika chuo kizuri je huyo cheti chake ni sahihi au feki na kwa nini
Standards in process are there to protect the quality of outputs but they do not guarantee that the out put product must be of quality if those standards are met in process.
some of those standards are influenced by political move but not set based on what products must be.
sometimes there is no constant monitoring programs to ensure that these standards are met by those registered members throughout.
sometimes these standards are affected by corruption.
others are affected by peoples belives and proud. mfano zamani wahitimu wa kutoka vyuo vya ufundi kama DIT walikataliwa kujiunga na Board ya Wahandisi, hii ilitokana na imani za watu fulani, bila kufanya changes yoyote within DIT uongozi wa bodi ya wahandisi ulivyobadilika wakakubaliwa kujiunga.
sasa katika mazingira kama haya hatuwezi kusema kwa sababu chuo fulani hakijasajiliwa na fulani hakina ubora au kwa sababu chuo fulani kimesajiliwa na fulani kina ubora.
ndio maana nikasema tuwe tunatest kila product
ikionekana kuwa na viwango vinavyohitajika basi tunasema hiyo ni bora.
kiwango cha ubora kwa msomi ni elimu aliyoipata.
Nikichukulia mifano mingi katika nchi yetu ukienda katika wizara na mashirika mbali mbali kuna watu wengi wana hizo mnaita "goog degrees" kutoka vyuo vinavyosifika kutoka ulaya
lakini hao hao fuatilia utendaji wao, wananunua vifaa feki, wanaingia mikataba mibovu, kwa ujumla what we call "value for money" katika procurement zao mbalimbali hakuna lakini wanabaki wakijivunia vyuo walivyo soma. na wengi sio kwa sababu ya kuongwa bali kutokana na uwezo wao mdogo katika mambo hayo.
ila mtizamo hapa naona ni ule ule maana inaonekana kuna watu wanasema ubora wa bidhaa ni vyeti vya ubora alivyonavyo mtengenezaji au mtengenezaji anasifa gani. Lakini mimi napenda kuwashauri kuwa ubora wa bidhaa uko kwenye bidhaa yenyewe. iko chini ya viwango imetengenezwa na mtu anayesifika haifai, inakiwango imetengenezwa na mtu asiyefahamika inafaa.
ndio maana mimi nasema ukisema wewe ni mhandisi
hata kama ulipita chuo kizuri sana cha kihandisi, hata kama bodi ya wahandisi imekusajili kama huwezi " focus and plan future, design and implement and maintaining in your area of field" wewe si mhandisi.
hivyo watu tusiwahukumu kwa vyeti vyao bali elimu waliyoipata.
unacheti kizuri kutoka chuo kizuri unaenda kunua generator unaleta mbovu inashindwa kufanya kazi basi tunajua cheti chako feki, chuo hakifahamiki unanunua generator nzuri unaitunza vizuri katika garama zinazohitajika basi tunajua cheti chako is good certificate.
siku zote mtu asiyejua huwa akisema kitu fulani hakifai ukimuuliza kwa nini atakuambia kwa sababu fulani kasema. ila anayejua akisema hakifai atakupa sababu za hicho kitu kwa nini hakifai hivyo tunaposema kitu fulani hakifai mfano degree lazima sisi tuwe na vigezo na sio kusikiliza kama kuna mtu au taasisi iliyosema hakifai maana huyo aliyesema anasema ili na sisi ama tukubaliane nae au tutofautiane nae kulingana na vigezo alivyovitumia.
mimi nafikiri utata huu utaondoka kama tutaamua kuangalia elimu aliyonayo mtu maana kama mkiangalia chuo alichosoma mtu je yule aliyenunua cheti kutoka katika chuo kizuri je huyo cheti chake ni sahihi au feki na kwa nini
Julian,
You are very correct na ndio maana nilisema...............kuna watu leave alone having Masters degree, they just have a bachelor degree and they did wonders (be it administration wise, katika research both scientific, social, political and economical researches.......i mean sio mmoja ni wengi tu are fantastic at their own level or sometimes even more na hapo ndipo unasikia mtu anaambiwa fanya mitihani fulani na andika paper wa kadha na anatumikiwa shahada au stashahada kulingana na........... again standards set), however all that does not nullify the education level standards set by an institution and associations zinazotambulika kimataifa...........
kwa mara nyingine umesema vema tui-test kila product.......sawa kabisa
Katika Statistics kuna kitu kinaitwa "a normal distribution curve", kw ahiyo basi posibility ya kupata product nzuri nakubali ni uwezo wa product yenyewe kuperform, however HOW MANY products??, ukii-K test hizo product zako utakuta, product unazozizungumzia is negligible, sasa where do we draw a line here......ndio maaana suala la STANDARD comes into play maana yake ni kuwa kuna product zitakuwa karibu sana na mean na zingine zitakuwa katika acceptable level with a normal curve.
sasa ukimleta Warioba ili aingie katka curve ndipo hapo inakuwa matatizo, kwa sababu ili uingie katka curve kuna criteria set ili ku-achieve the goal ambayo ni UBORA, hizo criteria Warioba hana!!!
Warioba can be exceptional, agreed BUT the danger is, ukiruhusu watu wafanye kama alivyofanya, hivi unafkiri , mtu kama Nungwi si ndio itakuwa worse ndg yangu
You are very correct na ndio maana nilisema...............kuna watu leave alone having Masters degree, they just have a bachelor degree and they did wonders (be it administration wise, katika research both scientific, social, political and economical researches.......i mean sio mmoja ni wengi tu are fantastic at their own level or sometimes even more na hapo ndipo unasikia mtu anaambiwa fanya mitihani fulani na andika paper wa kadha na anatumikiwa shahada au stashahada kulingana na........... again standards set), however all that does not nullify the education level standards set by an institution and associations zinazotambulika kimataifa...........
kwa mara nyingine umesema vema tui-test kila product.......sawa kabisa
Katika Statistics kuna kitu kinaitwa "a normal distribution curve", kw ahiyo basi posibility ya kupata product nzuri nakubali ni uwezo wa product yenyewe kuperform, however HOW MANY products??, ukii-K test hizo product zako utakuta, product unazozizungumzia is negligible, sasa where do we draw a line here......ndio maaana suala la STANDARD comes into play maana yake ni kuwa kuna product zitakuwa karibu sana na mean na zingine zitakuwa katika acceptable level with a normal curve.
sasa ukimleta Warioba ili aingie katka curve ndipo hapo inakuwa matatizo, kwa sababu ili uingie katka curve kuna criteria set ili ku-achieve the goal ambayo ni UBORA, hizo criteria Warioba hana!!!
Warioba can be exceptional, agreed BUT the danger is, ukiruhusu watu wafanye kama alivyofanya, hivi unafkiri , mtu kama Nungwi si ndio itakuwa worse ndg yangu
Julian Emmanuel
Member
- Mar 6, 2007
- 38
- 6
Ogah
i am not here to defend Warioba
mimi nilichokiongelea ni criteria iliyotumika ambayo ndio mtizamo wa jamii yetu. Kwamba tunahukumu vitu kwa history not by their quality and then tunahitimisha qualitywise.
Inawezekana It is true the case of warioba but the point has been defended not correctly according to my opinion.
kuna watu wamefanya mambo ambayo ni evidence hadharani kama mikataba ya uchimbaji wa madini.
hatuna ushahidi kuwa they were corrupted why not question their capacity education wise, to me that could be the best aproach rather the current move
i am not here to defend Warioba
mimi nilichokiongelea ni criteria iliyotumika ambayo ndio mtizamo wa jamii yetu. Kwamba tunahukumu vitu kwa history not by their quality and then tunahitimisha qualitywise.
Inawezekana It is true the case of warioba but the point has been defended not correctly according to my opinion.
kuna watu wamefanya mambo ambayo ni evidence hadharani kama mikataba ya uchimbaji wa madini.
hatuna ushahidi kuwa they were corrupted why not question their capacity education wise, to me that could be the best aproach rather the current move
Julian Emmanuel
Member
- Mar 6, 2007
- 38
- 6
umeleta mfano mzuri ila usioendenana na utetezi wenu
chukulia kijana anayetoka shule A aliyepata division 4 katika matokeo ya kidato cha nne pekeyake katika shule yake na wenzake 99 wakapata div 1 na shule nyingine B kijana akapata div 1 peke yake na wenzake 99 katika shule yake wana div 3 na 4
ukichora normal curve yako au ukitafuta average shule A imefaulu kuliko shule B na inawezekana shule B ikaonekana imefeli.
lakini kufeli kwa shule B hakumfelishi huyu kijana aliyepata Div 1 katika shule B, na kufaulu kwa shule A hakumfaulishi huyu kijana aliyepata Div 4 katika shule A.
hivyo kufaulu kwa shule tutaangalia normal curve au average
lakini kwa mtu hatuangalii average ya shule kusema kafaulu au la
tunaangalia matokeo yake mwenyewe.
ila kwa kutambua kuwa kuna wizi wa mitihani na nini inawezekana aliyepata division three katika mtihani akawa anajua kuliko aliyepata division one.
ndio maana nasema elimu ya mtu ni kile alichokiongeza kichwani sio kile kiko kwenye karatasi
Julian,
Ni kweli kabisa unavyosema
..............elimu ya mtu ni kile alichokiongeza kichwani sio kile kiko kwenye karatasi...........
na ndio maana tunawaambia akina Warioba et al wayaache hayo makaratasi FEKI kwani vichwa vyao bila hayo makaratasi feki bado vyaweza kuwa ni vizuri tu.
Back to Statistics
Naona unaongea zaidi katka exceptions, Hakuna anayekataa kwamba kuna kitu kuwa exception!!, na mfano wa shule ulizotaja, unatakiwa uzame tena ktk shule ya statistics ndio utaelewa nasema nini otherwise nafurahi kuwa unakubali kwamba statistically ulichoongea ni true, TOFAUTI inakuwepo katika degree/level of freedom/acceptability, na kwa hiyo wakati wa kuselect vichwa bora hata yule aliyefaulu ktk shule ya vilaza statistics itamkumba tu, na the same standard zitakuwa applied kwake
unaweza kupata division one katka vilaza, sasa uki-combine hiyo division yako one ktka shule ya vipanga na bado jogoo wako aakawika basi ni lazima utakuwa ndani ya normal curve na huwezi kuachwa, lakini ikionekana umechanganya div one yako halafu ikatoka nje ya curve, ndg yangu wee utakuwa ni msalie mtume tu
Hizo shule mbili kama zina standards sawa then inakuwa rahisi zaidi kuchambua nani kilaza na nani kipanga.
anyway i got to go. later........, its very interesting anyway!!
Ni kweli kabisa unavyosema
..............elimu ya mtu ni kile alichokiongeza kichwani sio kile kiko kwenye karatasi...........
na ndio maana tunawaambia akina Warioba et al wayaache hayo makaratasi FEKI kwani vichwa vyao bila hayo makaratasi feki bado vyaweza kuwa ni vizuri tu.
Back to Statistics
Naona unaongea zaidi katka exceptions, Hakuna anayekataa kwamba kuna kitu kuwa exception!!, na mfano wa shule ulizotaja, unatakiwa uzame tena ktk shule ya statistics ndio utaelewa nasema nini otherwise nafurahi kuwa unakubali kwamba statistically ulichoongea ni true, TOFAUTI inakuwepo katika degree/level of freedom/acceptability, na kwa hiyo wakati wa kuselect vichwa bora hata yule aliyefaulu ktk shule ya vilaza statistics itamkumba tu, na the same standard zitakuwa applied kwake
unaweza kupata division one katka vilaza, sasa uki-combine hiyo division yako one ktka shule ya vipanga na bado jogoo wako aakawika basi ni lazima utakuwa ndani ya normal curve na huwezi kuachwa, lakini ikionekana umechanganya div one yako halafu ikatoka nje ya curve, ndg yangu wee utakuwa ni msalie mtume tu
Hizo shule mbili kama zina standards sawa then inakuwa rahisi zaidi kuchambua nani kilaza na nani kipanga.
anyway i got to go. later........, its very interesting anyway!!
na ndio maana tunawaambia akina Warioba et al wayaache hayo makaratasi FEKI kwani vichwa vyao bila hayo makaratasi feki bado vyaweza kuwa ni vizuri tu.
Haswa! na mimi hio ndio point yangu kubwa, why should one ruin his/her distinguished career with a qulification from a controversial university?
More on PWU saga
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Western_University
http://www.irishasia.com/node/66
http://www.nghtrainingireland.com/html/article.html
http://diplomamillnews.blogspot.com/2005_11_01_archive.html
http://archives.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/2005/11/11/story419393466.asp
http://archives.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/2005/11/16/story786123690.asp
Haswa! na mimi hio ndio point yangu kubwa, why should one ruin his/her distinguished career with a qulification from a controversial university?
More on PWU saga
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Western_University
http://www.irishasia.com/node/66
http://www.nghtrainingireland.com/html/article.html
http://diplomamillnews.blogspot.com/2005_11_01_archive.html
http://archives.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/2005/11/11/story419393466.asp
http://archives.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/2005/11/16/story786123690.asp
Kitila Mkumbo
JF-Expert Member
- Feb 25, 2006
- 3,355
- 1,991
Sijui Nungwi yuko wapi, nimeshangaa sana kwenye report ya January 2007 kuhusu ranking za vyuo, yaani Mzumbe sio miongoni mwa vyuo bora 100 katika bara la Afrika! Yaani hawapo katika top 100 African universities na kelele zote hizi, hivi wanafundisha vitu gani hasa pale?!
Here is a link for the latest ranking of African Universities
http://www.webometrics.info/top100_continent.asp?cont=africa
http://www.webometrics.info/top100_continent.asp?cont=africa
Dua
JF-Expert Member
- Nov 14, 2006
- 3,236
- 676
The times higher education suppliment
Insiders and outsiders lend a balanced view
Acknowledgments
The World University Rankings are co-ordinated by Martin Ince ([email protected]),
contributing editor of The Times Higher. He would like to thank Nunzio Quacquarelli and Ben Sowter of QS and their colleagues, as well as the staff of The Times Higher, for their participation in this project.
Kwa sababu wengi wetu tumeonyesha shauku ya kulinganisha UDSM na Mzumbe mimi ambaye naona wote ni wamba ngozi nimeonelea niweke hii ambayo ni tofauti kidogo na ile wanayotumia wenzetu katika kutathmini nini kinafundishwa na quality yake ikoje.
Ni aibu kwa Tanzania kuendelea kupigiana kelele na kulinganisha vyuo vyetu ambavyo bado havijawa na hadhi ya kimataifa. Katika vyuo 200 vilivyoorodheshwa hapa sisi tupo wapi? Ni jukumu la serikali kulipa kipaumbele suala la elimu ili tuondokane na adha ya kuwa wafanyaji kazi wa mataifa mengine. Mwalimu aliweza wakati TZ ilikuwa bado changa na masikini kuliko tulivyo leo hii.
Insiders and outsiders lend a balanced view
Acknowledgments
The World University Rankings are co-ordinated by Martin Ince ([email protected]),
contributing editor of The Times Higher. He would like to thank Nunzio Quacquarelli and Ben Sowter of QS and their colleagues, as well as the staff of The Times Higher, for their participation in this project.
Kwa sababu wengi wetu tumeonyesha shauku ya kulinganisha UDSM na Mzumbe mimi ambaye naona wote ni wamba ngozi nimeonelea niweke hii ambayo ni tofauti kidogo na ile wanayotumia wenzetu katika kutathmini nini kinafundishwa na quality yake ikoje.
Ni aibu kwa Tanzania kuendelea kupigiana kelele na kulinganisha vyuo vyetu ambavyo bado havijawa na hadhi ya kimataifa. Katika vyuo 200 vilivyoorodheshwa hapa sisi tupo wapi? Ni jukumu la serikali kulipa kipaumbele suala la elimu ili tuondokane na adha ya kuwa wafanyaji kazi wa mataifa mengine. Mwalimu aliweza wakati TZ ilikuwa bado changa na masikini kuliko tulivyo leo hii.
FairPlayer
JF-Expert Member
- Feb 27, 2006
- 4,145
- 733
- Thread starter
- #180
MtZ na Ogah,
Mmepata NUNGWI mwingine? maana naona mnauliza swali hasemi yes or no. Anaaza hadith ndeeeeeeefu.
Poleni
FD
Mmepata NUNGWI mwingine? maana naona mnauliza swali hasemi yes or no. Anaaza hadith ndeeeeeeefu.
Poleni
FD