Kesi ya Raila Odinga ya Uchaguzi...

Kesi ya Raila Odinga ya Uchaguzi...

Mkuu Kiranga

Nijuavyo mimi Uhuru hawezi kuapishwa mpaka kesi ya msingi itakapoamuliwa na supreme court nipo tayari kusahihishwa.Nadhani kuna muda wa siku 14 kesi itatakiwa kusikilizwa na kutolewa hukumu.Ngoja niwaite magwji wengine wa katiba ya Kenya wanaweza kutusaidia zaidi ukwelikitugani Ab-Titchaz


Unafungua kesi ya kutaka ushahidi wakati Uhuru anaota mizizi katika Urais, ataapishwa kesi yako haijafika popote, mwishowe rais kashajizatiti huwezi kumtoa.

Kama angetaka kumchallenge kungetakiwa pigo takatifu.

Pigo takatifu lina hatari ya kurudisha vurugu kama za mwaka 2007.

Raila hataki/anaogopa kujirudia vurugu, sensibly so.

Therefore, Raila hawezi kum challenge Uhuru effectively katika nchi ambayo rule of law iko shaky kama Kenya.
 
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Mkuu Kiranga

Nijuavyo mimi Uhuru hawezi kuapishwa mpaka kesi ya msingi itakapoamuliwa na supreme court nipo tayari kusahihishwa.Nadhani kuna muda wa siku 14 kesi itatakiwa kusikilizwa na kutolewa hukumu.Ngoja niwaite magwji wengine wa katiba ya Kenya wanaweza kutusaidia zaidi ukwelikitugani Ab-Titchaz

Interesting,

Zikipita siku 14 je?

This is Africa, people have disappeared for less than the presidency.

ICC imeshindwa kumshitaki Muthaura kwa sababu "mashahidi wanakufa" na wengine wanaogopa.

Go figure!

Raila amethibitisha udhaifu aliousema Miguna kwa kuto strategize vizuri voter registration ya nguvu kwenye strongholds zake. Halafu Mudavadi kachukua a lot of Raila's likely voters.

Those 4100 votes were so crucial kwa sababu kura zingeenda raundi ya pili Uhuru ngoma yake ingekuwa nzito.

Na si nzito kwa maana ya kuukosa urais tu.

The Hague ingekuwa inamuita "Come baby, come" kama anavyosema Miguna.
 
Jamaa akishaapishwa akapewa madaraka yote ya Urais, Raila Odinga asahau! yale yale ya Mwai Kibaki!
 
Interesting,

Zikipita siku 14 je?

This is Africa, people have disappeared for less than the presidency.

No, Katiba ya Kenya is clear! The Supreme Court will have to give its decision within those 14 days. Period.
 
No, Katiba ya Kenya is clear! The Supreme Court will have to give its decision within those 14 days. Period.

Kesi ya Safari.com kutafuta ushahidi ikichukua a convoluted turn na kuchukua miezi mitatu?

Uhuru ataapishwa au?

Kama ataapishwa halafu ikaonekana ameiba kura mwezi mmoja baada ya kuapishwa itakuwaje? Atatolewa urais uchaguzi urudiwe raundi ya pili? Au akishaapishwa ndo kama bongo, imetoka?

This is a genuine set of questions, nataka kujua kwa maana it is central to how things will turn out.

Kama Uhuru is inventive enough kuiba kura, what makes you think he will not be inventive enough to play the delay game?

My question is, who is favored by delay here? What happens if the case against Safari.com lags due to all kinds of technicalities? Or Safari.com are destroying evidence as we speak to the extent that by the time they are called in court the evidence is already destroyed/ irrelevant?
 
Kesi ya Safari.com kutafuta ushahidi ikichukua a convoluted turn na kuchukua miezi mitatu?

Uhuru ataapishwa au?

Kama ataapishwa halafu ikaonekana ameiba kura mwezi mmoja baada ya kuapishwa itakuwaje? Atatolewa urais uchaguzi urudiwe raundi ya pili? Au akishaapishwa ndo kama bongo, imetoka?

This is a genuine set of question, nataka kujua kwa maana it is central to how things will turn out.

Kama Uhuru is inventive enough kuiba kura, what makes you think he will not be invventive enough to play the delay game?

My question is, who is favored by delay here? What happens if the case against Safari.com lags due to all kinds of technicalities? Or Safari.com are destroying evidence as we speak to the extent that by the time they are called in court the evidence is already destroyed/ irrelevant?
Ndio uzuri wa Katiba mpya ya Kenya. Supreme Court has only 14 days to decide a petition on presidential poll. Hawana mwaka mzima. They will have to do it. Kwa hiyo hakuna cha miezi mitatu wala nini - 14 days, kwisha. Watasema Uhuru kashinda kihalali - anaapishwa, ama hakushinda kihalali, uchaguzi unarudiwa within 60 days of the court's decision.
 
Ndio uzuri wa Katiba mpya ya Kenya. Supreme Court has only 14 days to decide a petition on presidential poll. Hawana mwaka mzima. They will have to do it. Kwa hiyo hakuna cha miezi mitatu wala nini - 14 days, kwisha. Watasema Uhuru kashinda kihalali - anaapishwa, ama hakushinda kihalali, uchaguzi unarudiwa within 60 days of the court's decision.

Exactly my suspicion.

All Uhuru has to do now is delay this Safari.com case. There is law, and then there is justice. The two need not be tantamount.

Once Uhuru is sworn in, the whole thing is over. On the one hand there is a utilitarian value in that, a shaky presidency is undesirable.Ikiwezekana rais aapishwe na kutolewa na mahakama baada ya mwezi itakuwa dhahama. On the other hand, sealing in a crook as a president simply for utilitarian motives is hardly justice.

Constitutional jurisprudence scholars might debate.

This is where my question comes in.

Kama Uhuru kweli kaiba kura, organization na clout inayohitajika kuiba kura ni kubwa sana kuliko organization na clout inayohitajika kudelay case kwenye nchi ambayo rule of law ni shaky. Tushaona delay game in the justice system for lesser cases in tighter jurisdictions. Ma mafia bosses hapo Southern District of NY. Mara shahidi kaumwa, mara kapotea, mara file limeibiwa, mara kampuni imekuwa bankrupt na kufungwa overnight! Kama stakes ziko kwenye delay tu nina mashaka sana kama kesi inaenda popote.

Watoto wa Dar maskani ya "Food World" wanakwambia "ukipata viza huwezi kukosa nauli".

Sasa Uhuru kashapata viza, mnategemea atakosa nauli hata ya kukopa?

Raila ana save face tu, aonekana kafa kiume na kaonewa mpaka mahakamani huko, lakini strategically hama kitu kitakachobadilika hapa. Especially because the whole thing is time dependent.

Otherwise ni ku involve mass action which is risky, can turn bloody and Raila after the 2007 debacle does not seem to be too keen on that.
 
Kwanza katika hizo siku 14 zishapita ngapi?

Maana tusihesabu "siku 14" za kikatiba wakati kumbe nyingine zishapita.
 
Kwanza katika hizo siku 14 zishapita ngapi?

Maana tusihesabu "siku 14" za kikatiba wakati kumbe nyingine zishapita.

The petitioners have one week to legally challenge an election (the one week is from the day the results were announced) and then depending on when they actually file their petition the Supreme Court then has 14 days to rule on the challenge.
 
Raila anachotafuta ni Uhuru amuite pembeni na kumuuliza unataka nini aseme ninataka unipe wizara 5. Ama ambiwe basi kapumzike mafao ya uwaziri mkuu utapata, maana mafao nayo yanaonekana kuwa ktk hali tete.

Kama anasema IEB imemuonea na iko staged na kibaki kwa kumpa push Uhuru, kwanini tusiamini pia hiyo court nayo ilikuwa tayari iko staged na Kibaki kwa kumpa push Uhuru.
Na kama anaamini court hiyo itatoa hukumu ya haki basi na sisi pamoja nayeye hatunabudi kuamini IEB nayo ilitenda haki ktk kutanganza matokeo, maana ya kwamba wakuu wa vyombo hivi wameteuliwa na entity moja.
 
The petitioners have one week to legally challenge an election (the one week is from the day the results were announced) and then depending on when they actually file their petition the Supreme Court then has 14 days to rule on the challenge.

Matokeo yametangazwa March 09, leo March 13. Siku nne tayari hizo.

Natafuta kuona kama Raila kasha file petition naona "to file", "will file" sioni "filed".

Inaonekana anahitaji evidence ku solidify case. Inawezekana aka file kabla ya kuhakikisha evidence na anataka ku file dakika ya mwisho ili awe na muda zaidi wa kuandaa evidence.

Tatizo ni, hata aki maximize muda wake na kutumia siku 21 zote, atakuwa na muda wa kutosha ku gather evidence ya kutosha?

Atapata ushirikiano katika kesi ya Safari.com?

Majaji wanaweza kuwa impartial especially sehemu ambayo iko so politically charged with a combustive atmosphere?
 
Matokeo yametangazwa March 09, leo March 13. Siku nne tayari hizo.

Nimetoka kuangalia Citizen TV's news at 9. Wamesema kwamba CORD wana hadi Jumatatu, tarehe 18 ku-file petition yao. Tokea hapo Supreme Court ina hadi tarehe 1, mwezi April kutoa ruling yake. Sasa hapo kulingana na ruling itakavyokuwa inauguration date nayo itakuwa adjusted accordingly. Kama petition ya CORD ikitupiliwa mbali basi Uhuru ataapishwa tarehe 8, April.

Natafuta kuona kama Raila kasha file petition naona "to file", "will file" sioni "filed".

Inaonekana anahitaji evidence ku solidify case. Inawezekana aka file kabla ya kuhakikisha evidence na anataka ku file dakika ya mwisho ili awe na muda zaidi wa kuandaa evidence.

Tatizo ni, hata aki maximize muda wake na kutumia siku 21 zote, atakuwa na muda wa kutosha ku gather evidence ya kutosha?

Atapata ushirikiano katika kesi ya Safari.com?

Majaji wanaweza kuwa impartial especially sehemu ambayo iko so politically charged with a combustive atmosphere?

It is very hard to overturn presidential election results - hivyo nadhani itakula kwa Odinga tu. But we shall see.
 
Mkuu Kiranga

Nijuavyo mimi Uhuru hawezi kuapishwa mpaka kesi ya msingi itakapoamuliwa na supreme court nipo tayari kusahihishwa.Nadhani kuna muda wa siku 14 kesi itatakiwa kusikilizwa na kutolewa hukumu.Ngoja niwaite magwji wengine wa katiba ya Kenya wanaweza kutusaidia zaidi ukwelikitugani Ab-Titchaz


Ushasema yote mkuu afu pia Nyani Ngabu akaongozea kidogo. Kwa hivyo mimi sina la ziada kuchangia hapa.

By the way pia ikumbukwe ni 14 business/working days.
 
Personally nimeanza kumuona Odinga anaonyesha dalili za ubabaishaji.

Siku ile ya uchaguzi alisema ana vidhibiti vyote vya jinsi uchaguzi ulivyoharibiwa na aliashiria kuwa Jumatatu asubuhi akiamka kituo cha kwanza ni Mahakamani.

Sasa kama mpaka sasa anakusanya vidhibiti ina maana ile sentensi wakati anaitoa alikuwa hana uhakika na vidhibiti vyake!

Nakumbuka Dr. Slaa alinikasirikia sana nilipoanzisha thread inayosema "Chadema Hawana Mkakati Endeleeni na Shughuli Zenu" baada ya Slaa kuahidi kuonyesha ushahidi wa kuibiwa kura kwenye uchaguzi mkuu wa mwaka 2010. Mpaka leo hakuna ushahidi wowote na naona dalili kama hayo yanaweza kujirudia kwa mjomba wetu mtu mzima Raila Odinga.

Katika thread hiyo Slaa alijibu hivi:

ZeMarcopolo,

Asante kwa post yako. Hata hivyo:

1.
i) Mgombea Urais wa CHADEMA ndiye pia Katibu Mkuu wa CHADEMA. Katibu Mkuu wa Chama na kwa maana hii, ndiye mpishi Mkuu wa Mikakati ya Chama. Inashangaza kuona mtu asiyefahamu kinachoendelea Chama kutangaza hadharani kuwa hakuna mkakati unaoendelea na kuwa wanachadema wamahadaika. Ninatoa Mwito kwa Wanachadema halisi kukataa upotoshaji huu wa makusudi, kwa malengo ya kuindoa Chadema kwenye mikakati yake. Napenda kumjulisha mhusika na wote wenye fikra hizo kuwa wamepotea njia na wasubiri. Kama anayeandika ni mwanachadema, basi ni vizuri aandike jina lake la kweli ili tumjue na tujue anajua nini, au anapindisha nini na kwa lengo gani. Wanachama ninawaomba watulie tuli kwa kuwa Viongozi wao ni makini, na meli inayoongozwa na viongozi wao makini haitayumbishwa hata tone na force au mtu mwingine yeyote popote alipo na kwa nia yoyote aliyo nayo.
ii) Chadema inafanya kazi zake kwa mujibu wa Katiba yake, Kanuni yake na maadili yake. Haifanyi kazi kwa pressure za nje. Haifanyi kazi hata kwa pressure za wanachama wake kwa vile Wanachama ndani ya Chadema wana wajibu wao, majukumu yao na haki zao. Viongozi wana wajibu wao, majukumu yao na haki zao. Siyo kila mwanachama kwa kila kitu anaweza kufahamu kila hatua ya utekelezaji au ya mipango. Hata nyumbani mama anapopika jikoni siyo wote waliokaa sebuleni wanajua kinachoendelea jikoni. Subira pekee ndio itakayoeleza ni nini kilikuwa kinapikwa, labda wakisie tu kutokana na harafu harufu inayonukia.
iii) Kwa msingi huo ukifuatilia para ya kwanza kuwa kuna wafuasi wa chadema wamehadaika, mtoa ataarifa, japo haelezi yeye ni nani, source ya information yake ni nini jambo ambalo kwa dhahiri lingeliweza kuwatoa mashaka wanachadema anaowaita "wamehadaika". Ningemshauri kama ana nia njema ajitambulishe kwa hao anaowashauri yeye ni nani kama ni mwanachadema cheo chake ni nini na kama siyo mwanachadema amepata wapi taarifa yake kiasi cha kutaka kuwadanganya na kuwapotosha siyo tu wanachadema lakini Watanzania wengi walioipigia Kura. Hakuna maficho kuwa mamilioni ya Watanzania waliipigia kura Chadema na wao ndio hasa wenye kuongojea hatima ya kura zao kuliko wanachadema. Inalekea ZeMarcopolo siyo mdadisi, mtafiti wa kutosha kujua centre of conflict iko wapi. Napenda kumfahimisha kuwa Centre of Conflict haiko chadema bali kwa Watanzania maelfu kila kona ya nchi ambao kura zao zilichakachuliwa na wao ndio mashahidi wa awali wa uchakachuaji huo. Kama lengo la mwandishi ni kupotosha umma huo, basi amepotoka, na hilo halitatokea kwa kuwa kama mgombea Urais na Katibu Mkuu wa Chadema nina mawasiliano ya karibu sana na Watanzania hao wala siyo wana Chadema tu. Watanzania watapenda kujua kama ZeMarcopolo atakuwa jasiri na kujitambulisha kwa jina lake halisi na kwa cheo chake ili tuweze kuthamini ushauri wake. Atakuwa mtanzania wa karne ya 47 atakayesikiliza ushauri wa mtu asiye na ujasiri wa hata kuonyesha jina lake halisi. Ndio maana Dr. Slaa niko hapa kwa jina langu bila maficho, na wako humu jamvini wapambanaji ambao hawajifichi wako kwa majina yao, na wanaposimamia jambo kila mmoja anajua ujasiri wao.

2) ZeMarcopolo unasema kuwa 'shughuli za chadema zimeelekezwa kwenye shughuli za kibunge'. Chadema imepewa kura hata baada ya uchakachuaji zaidi ya 2 Millioni. Sasa ulitaka wafanye nini walale na kustarehe na hizo kura? Watanzania wengi wanaiona Chadema ndio matumaini yao pekee ya kuwakomboa kwenye makucha ya CCM na umaskini uliosababishwa na CCM. Hivyo ni dhahiri, pamoja na mikakakati yake mingine Chadema inashughulikia maswala ya kuimarisha Wabunge wake ( wabunge wanajua mipango na mikakati iliyoko kuwaimarisha), ipo kwenye mipango ya kuunda Baraza lake la Mawaziri kivuli (baada ya Serikali kuundwa-wengi hawaelewi tafsiri ya hili baada ya msimamo wa Chadema kukataa kutambua Matokeo ya Uchaguzi ningeliwashauri wawasiliane na Wanasheria wao ili kujua tafsiri halisi ya Hatua hiyo). Hiyo nayo ni shughuli za Bunge na Watanzania wengi wanahamu ya kujua Baraza Kivuli litakuwa na sura gani na itatendaji kazi zake kwa maslahi yao na Taifa kwa ujumla. Ni mtu asiyejua tu anaweza kutoa kauli kama ya ZeMarcopolo. Chadema haina kazi mmoja tu wala mkakati mmoja tu katika ukombozi wa Taifa hili. Aliyefunga akili yake kwa malengo anayofahamu tu ndiyo anaweza kutoa kauli na ushauri wa aina hiyo.

3) ZeMarcopolo ni vema akajua kuwa Chadema inaendeshwa kwa katiba, Kanuni, Maadili na Itafaki inayojulikana. Chadema siyo Brief case political party kama anavyofikiri. Kama ni mtafiti angelijua hilo au kama hana nia na lengo lilifichika pia angelikuwa na njia nyingi za kujua hilo. Hivyo, ni vyema akajua kuwa Chadema katika utekelezaji wa majukumu yake haisukumwi na mtu yeyote wala wanachama wa kawaida ( wanachama wanaelimishwa na wakielimishwa wanaridhika kama tulivyofanya kwa wale waliotaka kujua nini kinaendelea). Wanachama ndani ya Chadema wana haki zao, majukumu na wajibu wao, na viongozi nao wana majukumu, haki na wajibu wao. Hivyo katika utekelezaji wa majukumu hatusukumwi na pressure ya mtu awaye yeyote, wa ndani au wa nje kwa vile tunasukumwa tu na Katiba, Kanuni, Maadili na Itifaki ya chama. Mchakato unaoendelea utakapopitia kwenye vyombo vyote vya maamuzi utatolewa hadharani na si kabla ya hapo. Pamoja na hilo, ni vyema ZeMarcopolo akaelewa kuwa walaio chakachuliwa kura ni watanzania na wao wanamawasiliano kwa njia mbalimbali na Chama na wanaridhika na hatua tunazochukua. Kama yuko ambaye haridhiki ana lake jambo, na kwa vyovyote vile si rahisi kumridhisha kila mtu mmoja mmoja japo tunajitahidi. Ndio maana naandika kwa kina ili ZeMarcopolo aelewe kuwa kazi na hasa maswala magumu kama haya hayafanywi kwa emotions, wala kukurupuka. Yeye mwenyewe anajua uwezo wa Dr. Slaa kufanya utafiti, na kuwa hatoi kauli mpaka utafiti umefika mahali pake. Ningependa pia ZeMarcopolo aelewe kuwa vidhibiti ni watanzania wenyewe waliochakachuliwa kura zao, na Dr.Slaa ni conduit tu ya kukataa matokeo hayo. Kama haamini haya atashangaa wakati mwafaka utakapofika.

4) ZeMarcopolo anatoa ushauri kwa wafuasi wa CHADEMA kuwa waendelee na kazi zao. Hapa kuna jambo. Sijui ZeMarcopolo lini amekuwa msemaji wa Chadema kiasi cha kuwataka Wanachadema "waendelee na kazi zao" Nadhani mwenye macho haambiwi kutazama na nipende tu kumwambia ZeMarcopolo kuwa Watanzania wa 2010 siyo mwaka 47 wanaweza kuchambua pumba na mchele. Nadhani wanafahamu kabisa malengo ya ushauri huu, na ni kwa manufaa ya nani. Tumekusoma ZeMarcopolo. Hata Kauli kuwa "viongozi wanagombea uongozi wa Kambi ya Upinzani ni wa upotoshaji". Ah, nani anagombea. Kambi imeisha kuundwa, tayari kuna Kiongozi wa Kambi rasmi ya Upinzani, kuna Mnadhimu Mkuu wa Kambi (Chief Whip) na kuna Deputy Leader. Sasa nafasi zipi zinagombaniwa na viongozi. Kwa kauli hii tu unaweza pia kumsoma lengo lake ni nini ZeMarcopolo.

5) ZeMarcopolo anatoa ushauri kuwa tuwape Mwongozo wafuasi wetu. Nataka kumjulisha kuwa Tumeisha kutoa mwongozo siyo tu kwa Wafuasi wa Chadema bali kwa Watanzania walioibiwa na kuchakuliwa kura zao. Kimsingi licha ya miongozo mingine ya ndani, kuwa " Tumekataa kutambua matokeo na kumtambua Rais aliyepatikana kwa matokeo haya ( issue hapa ni UHALALI WA RAIS NA SI UWEPO wa kisheria wa Rais mtu asipoelewa au kutaka kutambua tofauti kati ya maneno haya mafupi ya kisheria atateseka daima). Huu ni mwongozo kwa Watanzania wategemee nini. Matokeo ya jambo la kutegemewa limekwisha kuonekana kwa matendo "Kususia shughuli anazofanya Rais" kuna mwongozo gani zaidi ya huu. Wabunge wametoka nje ya Bunge na Chadema imepongezwa na wote wenye nia njema na Taifa hili, na kitendo cha kutoka nje ya Bunge Duniani kote ni kitendo cha kawaida kwenye Mabunge. Kuna mwongozo gani zaidi ya huu. Au ZeMarcopolo anataka tumwage hadharani na mengine ambayo yako Jikoni? Naomba avute subira atayaona, kama siyo kwa matendo basi kwa kauli.

Chadema inapenda na inakaribisha Ushauri. Lakini Upotoshaji wa aina yeyote ile utajibiwa papo hapo ili Malengo yetu yasivurugwe na wasioitakia mema, na pia kulinda Watanzania tuliowaahidi kuwa tutawatumikia bila maslahi yeyote binafsi.

Dr. Slaa akisoma maneno yake haya leo lazima aone aibu. Wasiwasi wangu ni kwa mjomba nae kuishia huku...
 
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