Tafadhali usirudie tena kuwaombea wafu. It's a waste of time

[Setfree]

Raha ya milele uwape ee Bwana, na mwanga wa milele uwaangazie. Wapumzike kwa amani. Amina. 🙏🏽

Maombi ya aina hii yanaishia hewani tu.

 

[Setfree]

We unaona waste of time lakini wenzako wanafarijiana kwa ibada hiyo ya misa ya kuwaombea wafu. Acha kutumia imani huku background yako ni siasa tupu unaleta kwa mgongo wa imani ya kidini, unatumikia ajira yako upande wa siasa zilizokupa ajira

Hisia zako zinakudanganya tu.

Paulo anatuambia tufarijiane kwa maneno ya Mungu (1 Wathesalonike 4:18) sio kwa kuwaombea wafu.

Mtu aliyekufa katika Kristo atafufuliwa siku ya kuja kwa Yesu, huyo hatuna haja ya kumlilia. Na mtu aliyekufa katika dhambi, huyo tayari yuko kuzimu. Hata tukilia na kuomboleza siku 100 haisaidii lolote. Hawezi kutolewa kuzimu na kuingizwa peponi. Ndio sababu nimesema it's a waste of time kuwaombea wafu.

 

[Setfree]

Tumeambiwa tuombe jambo lolote, kwahyo usipangie watu cha kuomba_

Yohana 14:13 Nanyi mkiomba lo lote kwa jina langu, hilo nitalifanya, ili Baba atukuzwe ndani ya Mwana.

Biblia haisemi tu tuombe lolote. Inasema pia tuombe sawasawa na mapenzi ya Mungu ndio tutapewa
(1 Yohana 5:14-15)

Kumbuka habari ya mama yao wana wa Zebedayo, aliomba (lolote) lakini hakupewa.
Mathayo 20:20-22
"Ndipo mama yao wana wa Zebedayo akamwendea [Yesu] pamoja na wanawe, akamsujudia, na kumwomba kitu. Akamwambia, Wataka nini? Akamwambia, Agiza kwamba hawa wanangu wawili waketi mmoja mkono wako wa kulia, na mmoja mkono wako wa kushoto, katika ufalme wako. Yesu akajibu akasema, Hamjui mnaloliomba..."

Wanaoombea wafu, hawajui wanaloliomba, na ndiyo sababu hawapati hata majibu.

 

[Setfree]

Wahenga walisema "tusiandikie mate wakati wino upo." Mleta mada ametoa vifungu vinavyothibitisha kwamba maombi ya wafu ni kupoteza muda. Sasa ingefaa wanaoombea wafu na wao waje na ushahidi unaothibitisha pasina shaka kwamba maombi yao yanajibiwa. Kwa maneno mengine, waeleze kwamba walimuombea fulani aliyefariki kisha akaenda kuzimu lakini baada ya maombi yao, huyo fulani akatolewa kuzimu akapelekwa peponi. Ushahidi huo ukitolewa utafunga kabisa mjadala huu.

Umenena vema, mkuu

 

[Magobe T]

Mkuu, I appreciate your perspective, and I certainly have no intention of dismissing anyone's convictions. However, theological claims should not be sustained merely by personal preference, inherited tradition, or subjective experience. They must withstand the scrutiny of Scripture.

My position is not that praying for the dead is ineffective simply because I personally do not practise it. Rather, I am challenging the biblical legitimacy of the practice itself. The pertinent question, therefore, is not whether you or others find it meaningful, but whether Scripture provides a sound doctrinal basis for it.

If you possess compelling biblical evidence demonstrating that prayers offered on behalf of the deceased can alter their eternal destiny or spiritual condition, I would genuinely welcome the opportunity to examine it. An appeal to personal conviction, however sincerely held, cannot substitute for scriptural substantiation.

Respectfully, theological disagreement should be settled through sound biblical examination, not through attempts to silence those who hold a contrary interpretation.

So what is your problem if you don't pray for the dead and another person prays for the dead? What do you lose theologically as you call it because I'm just imagining if you don't lose anything, why bother? Why should I bother because you pray or don't pray the way you do? Is that not writing on another person's wall, and what justification do you give on that?

 

[Magobe T]

Biblia haisemi tu tuombe lolote. Inasema pia tuombe sawasawa na mapenzi ya Mungu ndio tutapewa
(1 Yohana 5:14-15)

Kumbuka habari ya mama yao wana wa Zebedayo, aliomba (lolote) lakini hakupewa.
Mathayo 20:20-22
"Ndipo mama yao wana wa Zebedayo akamwendea [Yesu] pamoja na wanawe, akamsujudia, na kumwomba kitu. Akamwambia, Wataka nini? Akamwambia, Agiza kwamba hawa wanangu wawili waketi mmoja mkono wako wa kulia, na mmoja mkono wako wa kushoto, katika ufalme wako. Yesu akajibu akasema, Hamjui mnaloliomba..."

Wanaoombea wafu, hawajui wanaloliomba, na ndiyo sababu hawapati hata majibu.

Wahenga walisema "tusiandikie mate wakati wino upo." Mleta mada ametoa vifungu vinavyothibitisha kwamba maombi ya wafu ni kupoteza muda. Sasa ingefaa wanaoombea wafu na wao waje na ushahidi unaothibitisha pasina shaka kwamba maombi yao yanajibiwa. Kwa maneno mengine, waeleze kwamba walimuombea fulani aliyefariki kisha akaenda kuzimu lakini baada ya maombi yao, huyo fulani akatolewa kuzimu akapelekwa peponi. Ushahidi huo ukitolewa utafunga kabisa mjadala huu.

Kama yeye hajaona tatizo, wewe unayesema badala yake thibitisha kwamba alichoweka ndiyo uthibitisho kwamba hatuwezi kuwaombea wafu.

 

[Magobe T]

Wahenga walisema "tusiandikie mate wakati wino upo." Mleta mada ametoa vifungu vinavyothibitisha kwamba maombi ya wafu ni kupoteza muda. Sasa ingefaa wanaoombea wafu na wao waje na ushahidi unaothibitisha pasina shaka kwamba maombi yao yanajibiwa. Kwa maneno mengine, waeleze kwamba walimuombea fulani aliyefariki kisha akaenda kuzimu lakini baada ya maombi yao, huyo fulani akatolewa kuzimu akapelekwa peponi. Ushahidi huo ukitolewa utafunga kabisa mjadala huu.

Kwa hiyo, kwako wewe, huyo mleta mada akishakusanya vifungu kadhaa kwenye Biblia na kuviwrka hapa ndio inakuwa uthibitisho, au uthibitisho ni yeye kuonyesha kuwa kuwaombea watu ni "waste of time" kama alivyosema?

 

[Magobe T]

Ni watawa na makasisi wangapi walisema? Hans Küng, Girolamo Savolanora, kina Malachi Martin, kina Jan Hus kina Martin Luther nandiyo walikuwa watu wenye uelewa mkubwa kabisa na kanisa na wanajua kila kitu ushauri wangu mfatilie sana Hans Küng utanielewa maana yangu ni hivi kila taasisi ina changamoto zake.

Angalizo sikuandika hayo kulikosoa kanisa lolote nimempa huyo mkuu hapo ushauri wao wanajifanya biblia wanaijua sana kuliko hata waliofanya ikawafikia kwasababu bila kanisa katoliki isingekuwa hapo ilipo.

Kwasababu hizo Aprocypha books wakati wa Baraza ndiyo vilitengwa.

Kwa hiyo, Hans Kung ndiye Mungu wako? Kwani akisema yeye, ndiyo Kanisa Katoliki limfuate? Hans Kung ni nani kwa Kanisa Katoliki, ni msemaji au nani?

 

[little master]

Kuna mamb

o mtahangaika nayo, lakini hayatawasaidia. Maoni ya mtu hayawezi kuwa basis ya argument ya kylikosoa Kanisa Katoliki.

Ni watawa na makasisi wangapi walisema? Hans Küng, Girolamo Savolanora, kina Malachi Martin, kina Jan Hus kina Martin Luther nandiyo walikuwa watu wenye uelewa mkubwa kabisa na kanisa na wanajua kila kitu ushauri wangu mfatilie sana Hans Küng utanielewa maana yangu ni hivi kila taasisi ina changamoto zake.

Angalizo sikuandika hayo kulikosoa kanisa lolote nimempa huyo mkuu hapo ushauri wao wanajifanya biblia wanaijua sana kuliko hata waliofanya ikawafikia kwasababu bila kanisa katoliki isingekuwa hapo ilipo.

Kwasababu hizo Aprocypha books wakati wa Baraza ndiyo vilitengwa.

Kwa hiyo, Hans Kung ndiye Mungu wako? Kwani akisema yeye, ndiyo Kanisa Katoliki limfuate? Hans Kung ni nani kwa Kanisa Katoliki, ni msemaji au nani?

Duh yawezekana hata flateri tu hujafika hapa najichosha.

 

[Magobe T]

Maombi ya aina hii yanaishia hewani tu.

Justification?

 

[Magobe T]

Ni watawa na makasisi wangapi walisema? Hans Küng, Girolamo Savolanora, kina Malachi Martin, kina Jan Hus kina Martin Luther nandiyo walikuwa watu wenye uelewa mkubwa kabisa na kanisa na wanajua kila kitu ushauri wangu mfatilie sana Hans Küng utanielewa maana yangu ni hivi kila taasisi ina changamoto zake.

Angalizo sikuandika hayo kulikosoa kanisa lolote nimempa huyo mkuu hapo ushauri wao wanajifanya biblia wanaijua sana kuliko hata waliofanya ikawafikia kwasababu bila kanisa katoliki isingekuwa hapo ilipo.

Kwasababu hizo Aprocypha books wakati wa Baraza ndiyo vilitengwa.

Duh yawezekana hata flateri tu hujafika hapa najichosha.

Nilifika na kuzidi zaidi, labda sijakuelewa au hujanielewa.

 

[Setfree]

Justification?

Hebrews 9:27
‘And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.’
Justification: Death marks the end of a person's earthly life, and Scripture points to judgment thereafter, not a second opportunity through prayers offered by the living.

 

[Setfree]

So what is your problem if you don't pray for the dead and another person prays for the dead? What do you lose theologically as you call it because I'm just imagining if you don't lose anything, why bother? Why should I bother because you pray or don't pray the way you do? Is that not writing on another person's wall, and what justification do you give on that?

My concern is not what I personally lose, but whether what we practise is supported by Scripture. If the Bible teaches that death is followed by judgment (Hebrews 9:27), then praying for the dead has no biblical basis for changing their eternal destiny.