Uganda government has amnesty law for rebel soldiers that encourage them to abandon Kony and come home,this has made some of UPDF battalions 100% composed of Joseph Kony's once child soldiers-most of them forced to join Kony when they were teens,so denied education and other social manner-so we can say uganda army have questionable level of education compare to othersWhat's the average education level of a UPDF recruit? My hunch is that they are not well educated. In Kenya you cannot be an officer if you have not completed a certain level of education, I believe at least tertiary. So KPDF is more than likely made up of better educated folks.
yea, but still a lot of the birds listed on that JWTZ orbat are not serviceable at all, especially the transports and the rotaries. And reading through the orbats again, the Kenyan one is wrong also. KDF has 60 MD500's, not 5 as written on that list
Lets be honest here, it is very hard (there is no shortcut) to obtain the reliable figures of any serious army inventories, not surprisingly others here want to score quick points by putting forward what we already know (figures from Wiki...).
Simple questions to ask yourself are first, why the Orbat (which is a more reliable source) still shows 5 MD500s while the Wiki (a very unreliable source) shows 60 MD500s?
Secondly, aren't the guys who update all the Orbats (i.e., KDF's, TPDF's, UPDF's) knows that Wikipedia do exist? if the answer is affirmative why then they don't use it as a source???... :lol:
Just to give you a clue of how secretive these armies can be, sometimes ago GOT handed a Gold Mine to the TPDF (Yes, a tangible Gold Mine property). However, as we discuss this no single cent from this venture has been accounted for, the public doesn't know how the raised cash have been spent and so forth...The point i want to make here is that in TZ the official budget for the MOD is not the actual budget read by the Finance Minister!. There is lot more going on behind the scenes/public scrutiny....under the dogma of National Security!
Lets be honest here, it is very hard (there is no shortcut) to obtain the reliable figures of any serious army inventories, not surprisingly others here want to score quick points by putting forward what we already know (figures from Wiki...).
Simple questions to ask yourself are first, why the Orbat (which is a more reliable source) still shows 5 MD500s while the Wiki (a very unreliable source) shows 60 MD500s?
Secondly, aren't the guys who update all the Orbats (i.e., KDF's, TPDF's, UPDF's) knows that Wikipedia do exist? if the answer is affirmative why then they don't use it as a source???... :lol:
Just to give you a clue of how secretive these armies can be, sometimes ago GOT handed a Gold Mine to the TPDF (Yes, a tangible Gold Mine property). However, as we discuss this no single cent from this venture has been accounted for, the public doesn't know how the raised cash have been spent and so forth...The point i want to make here is that in TZ the official budget for the MOD is not the actual budget read by the Finance Minister!. There is lot more going on behind the scenes/public scrutiny....under the dogma of National Security!
Good Lord on a mule....:lol: @least you could have bring your sensible guesses on the table tomilay, you can't just begin to argue without any counter figure(s). If i said earlier that function MD=5 and you dispute it for 60 then you must provide a proof....sounds trivial isn't it??tomilay said:Bantugbro,
Your argument seems to suggest that since none of us really know the figures, then you must be right. Do you realize the absurdity of such an argument; that you are right because no one knows the facts? Is there such a thing as an argument from ignorance?
In my opinion you can still make a sensible guess about the credibility of some information. Even though I don't know the hardware in South Africa's inventory, I can say without looking stupid that South Africa's military is superior to Zambia's or Zimbabwe's. All this is based on many factors, not the least of which is the respective economies. Bigger economies normally mean a more powerful military - its just the way it works. In the event of a war, they can mobilize better and call upon more resources. The only exceptions to this rule I can think of are dysfunctional states like the DRC.
First of, it's not very difficult to obtain reliable figures for any African military's inventory. SIPRI keeps a very up to date record of all arms transfers and if that's not enough, a subscription to janes should do the trick...the fact that YOU don't know where to look does not mean that the information is not out there.
Secondly, on what basis have you decided that the guys who keep that website you link to are more reliable? Just because you say so doesn't mean that that's the case...in fact, that orbat they've got as i've pointed out (and have provided a manifest to boot) is horribly out of date. They have listed airframes which went out of service as long ago as 1994...and you want us to believe that they are reliable. Come of it dude! I didn't say that Kenya has 60 MD500's because I saw it on wikipedia...
Bantugbro, compare the state of those JWTZ buffaloes with the KAF ones as seen in this clip from early this year;
It really is mind boggling if you consider the fact that we acquired these airframes at around the same time. What the hell did you do to yours?
In research, there is no better way of convincing your audience than providing reliable source(s), now do so. You can go the SIPRI way, the Janes way, the RANDS way but please not the Wiki way.....
Still looks good....
so what did you do to yours?
If you roll back to my earlier post you will find i already mentioned that the Orbat i provided doesn't list lot of new birds.You're the one providing us with dodgy sources which list aircraft which were mothballed 15 years ago...i've just proven it by providing an up to date manifest and pictures of the aircraft in question...have you anything to say about that?
If you roll back to my earlier post you will find i already mentioned that the Orbat i provided doesn't list lot of new birds.
Yours has two main problems, (i) you haven't provided any source, (ii) Orbat incomplete....
Good Lord on a mule....:lol: @least you could have bring your sensible guesses on the table tomilay, you can't just begin to argue without any counter figure(s). If i said earlier that function MD=5 and you dispute it for 60 then you must provide a proof....sounds trivial isn't it??
In research, there is no better way of convincing your audience than providing reliable source(s), now do so. You can go the SIPRI way, the Janes way, the RANDS way but please not the Wiki way.....
Yes, I knoiw that you had mentioned that...my point is, you are providing an orbat which is listing scrap metal...have you really had a look at the photos i've provided of the aircraft your sources list as extant?
What do you mean mine has two problems...I haven't provided any orbat here yet, we were discussing the one you've provided. look at the manifest...and the photos!
That being said Kenya and Uganda/Tz will never go to war. If they ever do, I am also certain, Kenya has the means to guarantee that nobody's rag tag army is walking into Nairobi.
World Air Forces Tanzania Air Force
These people have got serial numbers too.