Tundu Lissu: Mwl. Nyerere alizoea kuishi kwa uongo na udanganyifu

[Kisenga]

@Ngw'amapalala,, naomba usikilize vizuri speech ya Lissu..ile mifano 4 aliyotoa ili kuthibitishia bunge la katiba kuwa muungano ulikuwepo hauna uhalali kisheria..si dhani ametusi Nyerere..but baba wa taifa si mungu..ni binadamu kama sisi..kwa kuna makosa aliyofanya, nadhani ukisifia hata alikosea unaidumaza akili yako

 

[Kamuzu]

Ukweli lazima usemwe hata kama ni mchungu, Mzee wa watu anavuliwa nguo akiwa kabulini. 'Walio wengi' vumilieni na kukubali kubadilika ili kuiponya NCHI.


Historia haiishiwi wino.

 

[TUJITEGEMEE]

Valid point wrong approach used...if at all this is what Lissu said.

 

[Kimweri]

It' sad when 40M Tanzanian expects these baboons to fix our issues, current issues, they go about to attack a dead man 15 years removed from earth. worse they attack a man who publicly agreed to having made mistakes, which according to his religion he practically repented for.
So, if Nyerere, had to take steps to protect the UNION during the cold war, what is the story here? was Tundu Lisu on Nyerere's shoes to understand the implication of the decisions he took?it's always very easy to criticize a dead person, when he can't reply for himself. Tundu this was a Mistake., A huge one. if you expected to score political points for this, i believe you will be disappointed. Not because, you are wrong, simply because it's a political blunder.

Even if Nyerere lied, that doesn't stop current leaders from deciding their own destiny, you can squarely make your ideology be know without attacking a dead guy. This blame game has now been taken far enough by CDM/Lissu.

The way he attacked everyone is like justifying he is a saint,which he unfortunately isn't. One can easily make his opinion known by highlighting what's wrong with the Union, and steps to fix it.

 

[chikutentema]

Topic: Tundu Lissu: Mwl. Nyerere alizoea kuishi kwa uongo na udanganyifu!

Udini at Work

 

[adolay]

Mkuu hapo kwenye black nakubaliana na wewe kabisa coz haiwezekani Nyerere aiue Tanganyika iliyokuwepo miaka mingi kabla ya yeye kuzaliwa halafu historia ikamuacha hivi hivi. Alijaribu sana kumfanyia vitina mzee wa watu Jumbe na kumtia kizuizini kisa tu kuhoji mambo ya muungano. Nyerere amemchukia Malecela kisa tu kuruhusu muswada wa Tanganyika kujadiliwa bungeni.

Naamini hata Nyerere pia alijua fika kuwa there is a year when his brutality might be spoken and that year is this year, YES let it be this year

What makes you keep on complaining?

Go ahead, what restrict you anyway? this is crazy, that man died more than 20yrs a go but yet nothing has been done

than complaining... you must be not serious guys and this defines the impotent of your brains living on the past than the present.

 

[Rich Pol]

Hana adabu wala nidhamu! Sijui kama kuna wakubwa kwao.

 

[Mshume Kiyate]

Tundu Lissu, alichosema ni sawa namuunga mkono kuhusu Nyerere.

 

[Kimweri]

It is of extreme danger to make generalizations without having a full picture. Lissu was barely a teenager when the Union was made. Unless he has proof beyond reasonable doubts that the UNION is illegal, i don't think making empty accusations is the way to go. He is a lawyer for Christ sake, swearing day in, day out for a country he DEEMS illegal? for consistency, and moral point of view, i expect him to file a legal proceeding to challenge legal status of the Union, Otherwise he should keep his noise to a minimum.

Hapa sasa hata Mtikila anaoneakana ana busara kuliko huyu Lissu.

 

[Ng'wamapalala]

Una maana gani Ndg yangu Ng'wamapalala? Huu ni wakati wa kujifunza!

Mkuu, huhitaji kweli mbali kufahamu kama Mwl. Nyerere hakuwa mtu wa kawaida katika jamii ya Kitanzania na hata nje ya mipaka yake.

Kama kiongozi aliyeweza kuwafanya wananchi wengi na ameendelea vile vile mpaka sasa kuifanya waukubali uwongo wake na udikteta wake kutokana na 'faida' iliyopatikana katika matendo hayo, basi hiyo tu inajitoshereza kusema Mwl. Nyerere hakuwa mtu wa kawaida!.

 

[The Boss]

It is of extreme danger to make generalizations without having a full picture. Lissu was barely a teenager when the Union was made. Unless he has proof beyond reasonable doubts that the UNION is illegal, i don't think making empty accusations is the way to go. He is a lawyer for Christ sake, swearing day in, day out for a country he DEEMS illegal? for consistency, and moral point of view, i expect him to file a legal proceeding to challenge legal status of the Union, Otherwise he should keep his noise to a minimum.

Hapa sasa hata Mtikila anaoneakana ana busara kuliko huyu Lissu.

Sometimes naona Lissu hana tofauti na Lema

 

[Mamndenyi]

Tindu lisu uliyesoma bure leo unaweza kumtukana Nyerere? Siasa imekupa kiburi? Nimekutemea mate usoni puuuuuu.

 

[Mamndenyi]

Sometimes naona Lissu hana tofauti na Lema

Wote ni debe tupu

 

[Ng'wamapalala]

Nimeangalia video sijaona Lissu aliposema Nyerere alizoea kuishi kwa uongo, nadhani una ajenda yako ya siri ya kutaka kupotosha aliyoyasema lissu baada ya kuona amewashika pabaya.

Mkuu, Mh. Lissu ametushika vibaya kina nani?.

Mimi ni muumini wa serikali moja au kama ikishindikana, basi kila nchi ichukue fito zake.

 

[bantulile]

Sio kosa kubadilika.Mwakyeme wa jana hawezi kuwa Mwakembe wa leo. Akiwa yuleyule wa jana atakuwa amedumaa au amekoma kukua kielimu. Mtu hubadilika kulingana na kupata maarifa mapya au elimu mpya, hata akibadili mazingira hubadilika pia. Mtu hawezi kuwa na fikra mgando hata baada ya kupata elimu na uzoefu mpya. Tundu Lisu wa leo sio yule alivyokuwa alipo maliza LLB. Ungemuuliza Mwakyembe ni kwa nini amebadili msimamo wake angekujibu, hali kadhalika ungemuuliza Prof. Shivji anayo majibu, lakini kusema ni mwogo ni kukosa kujua maana ya elimu kuwa hujengwa juu ya elimu nyingine na wazola leoni bora kuliko wazo la jana ' a second thought is better than the first thought. Kadiri mtu anavyoishi hupata maarifa mapya zaidi ya yale ya jana

acha kupotosha ukweli wewe aliposema kuwa kuna uwongo na udanganyifu alikuwa anamaanisha wana ccm wa hivi leo kama akina HARRISON MWAKYEMBE alipotamka wazi huko nyuma mwaka 1995 katika kitabu chake cha kupatia hiyo Phd aliyonayo huko ujerumani kuwa muungano pekee ambao utaleta usawa zanzibar na bara ni wa serikali tatu tu leo kapewa cheo kageuka

 

[Songambele]

Kama Nyerere alikubali kukosea manake yamekwisha na Tundu naye anakosea pia hakubali kukosea sio kila anachofikiri yeye ni sawa. Sio kweli kama alizoea kuishi kwa uwongo na udanganyifu na amewaambia chukueni mazuri yake sasa iweje mifano ya Lissu iwe ile mibaya tu. Kama mtoa hoja alichoandika ndio Nyerere alikuwa hivyo hata Wakatoliki wasingefikiria kumtangaza ktk mchakato wa mwenye heri. Sasa anavyofikiri Lissu isiwe sababu ya kila mtu kumtoa maana Julius.

Lissu hakutukana ameongea kilichondani ya nafsi yake.Na Nyerere kabla ya kufa kwake alikubali na kukiri makosa yake,hivyo japo hakuainisha makosa yapi amefanya lakini alikiri nakuomba kwa wanaoendeleo kukimbiza kijiti cha URAIS basi yale mema ayafuate na mabaya ayaache.

Inawezekana pia Rais Nyerere alikuwa na sababu za msingi za kulazimisha Muungano kwa njia yoyote ile bila kujua kasoro hizo zinaweza kuwa sababu ya UFA wa Muungano,na kwa sababu pia ni binadamu anamazuri na mabaya aliyotenda.Tumsamehe kwa mabaya na tumuenzi kwa mazuri ambayo ni mengi kuliko mabaya.

Angalizo Tundu Lissu hajakosea ,amesema anayofikiri na ametoa mifano kwa nini amesema,sidhani kama ametukana,inawezekana isingefikia huko alikoongelea kama Waliowengi(Wajumbe wa CCM) wangekubali kusikiliza mawazo ya waliowachache na kuyajengea hoja na kutafuta MUAROBAINI ambao utliweka Taifa salama.

 

[jogoolashamba]

Katika mwendelezo wa kupinga mawazo na mfumo wa utawala wa Mwl. Nyerere. Tundu Lissu amepasua jibu ambalo wengi huwa wanaogopa kulipasua pale aliposema kuwa Mwl. Nyerere alikuwa ni "msanii wa kisiasa" kwa sababu aliyokuwa anayasema siyo yale aliyokuwa anayatenda kuhusiana na suala la Muungano. Haya ameyabainisha wakati akitoa hoja kwenye Bunge Maalum.

Mh. Tundu Lissu ameenda mbali na kusema, Mwl. Nyerere alizoea vya halamu na vya halali hakuviweza. Katika kuthibitisha maneno yake, Mh. Tundu Lissu alisema, mwaka 1968, Mwl. Nyerere aliudanganya ulimwengu pale aliposema kupitia gazeti la Observer la UK, "Iwapo umma wa Zanzibar bila ya ushawishi kutoka nje, na kwa sababu zao wenyewe, wataona kuwa Muungano una hasara kwa uhai wao, sitawapiga mabomu kuwalazimisha......Muungano utakuwa hauna tena sababu ya kuendelea iwapo washiriki wake wataamua kutathmini na kuthibitisha jambo hasa tukio la kihistoria kama Muungano'.

Mwaka 1984, Wazinzibari walipohoji Muungano, Alhaji Aboud Jumbe akafukuzwa kazi kwa amri ya Mwl. Nyerere na amewekwa kizuizini Mjimwema mpaka leo. Wolfgang Dourado akawekwa kizuizini, Bashiri Swanzy akapakiwa kwenye ndege ya kwanza akapelekwa Ghana.

Mh. Tundu Lissu aliendelea kusema, kwa vile Mwl. Nyerere alizoea vya kunyonga, kwenye Kitabu chake cha Uongozi Wetu na Hatima ya Tanzania, Mwl Nyerere alisema, 'huko nyuma baadhi ya viongozi wapinzani wa Muungano wameishawahi kusema tufanye referendum kwa Zanzibar kuhusu Muungano, tukakataa kwa sababu safi kabisa'.

Tundu Lissu anadai, Mwl. Nyerere hakukataa hoja ya Muungano kwa sababu safi kabisa, bali aliwaweka kizuizini wale waliohoji Muungano. Mwl. Nyerere alizoea kuishi kwa uwongo na hakuweza kusema kweli.

Kitu muhimu kabisa cha kujiuliza na kufikiria. Kama kweli Mwl. Nyerere alikuwa anaishi kwa uwongo na udanganyifu, ina maana hata hati ya Muungano haipo na kama haipo, ina maana amewaingizwa 'mkenge' wananchi na hasa wanaCCM kwa kusimamia hoja ambayo kiuhalisia haipo. (Muungano wa serikali mbili).

Tukikubaliana na hoja ya Tundu Lissu, inabidi tujiulize, Kwa nini Baba wa Taifa alikuwa anaishi maisha ya uwongo na udanganyifu?. Alikuwa anafanya hivyo kwa manufaa ya nani?.

Kama hoja ya Tundu Lissu ni kweli basi hatuna budi kusema, kweli uwongo hupanda lifti wakati ukweli hutumia ngazi kuwafikia walengwa!.

Hoja hii inanipeleka kwenye angalizo la sababu ya baadhi ya wajumbe wakiongozwa na Leticia Nyerere kushauri bunge kwa nguvu zote liweke mipaka kwenye kanuni za bunge zikiwataka wabunge kutowadharirisha waasisi wa Muungano. Kumbe nyuma ya hoja zao walikuwa wanaogopa ukweli usijulikane!.

Mpaka katiba mpya ipatikane, tutaona na kusikia mengi!.

Kauli mbiu ni serikali moja au kila nchi ichukue fito zake kwa sababu watu tuliowatuma kwenda kumalizia mchakato wa katiba kwa sasa wanahoji uharali wa Muungano huku wakitaka mpaka makaratasi yenye sahihi za waasisi wa Muungano. Hawa wabunge wameshindwa kufanya kazi ya kumalizia mchakato wa Katiba badala yake wanaanza kuuliza kama Muungano ni halali au batili. Yaani baada ya Miaka karibia 50 ndiyo tunaanza kuuliza Muungano kama ni halali huku waasisi wa Muungano tukiwasema ni waongo na wadanganyifu.

Ninadhani kuna kitu hakiko sawa kwenye baadhi ya hoja za Wabunge!.
[video=youtube_share;bB7BxxMepR8]http://youtu.be/bB7BxxMepR8[/video]
[video=youtube_share;jE7oTPXtpas]http://youtu.be/jE7oTPXtpas[/video]

Haya Tundu Mwalimu Nyerere alikuwa na udanganyifu, aliwafunga akina Aboud Jumbe na Dwarado. Nakuona kijana una ushawishi mkubwa sana wa kisheria na kiHistoria ambayo wengi hatukuijua.

Nakuomba unifanyie kitu kimoja tu, ufukuze Wazanzibari wote waondoke wakati sisi WaBara tunajadili mambo ya Bara. Wakati wao wanajadili mambo ya Zanzibar na walipokuwa wakiunda Serikali ya Mapinduzi hawakuleta hoja zao katika Bunge la Jamhuri, walimaliza huko huko kwao, iweje sisi tuwakaribishe kuja kujadili mambo ya kwetu mpaka watupigie kura ya theluthi mbili katika mambo yasiyowahusu?

Katiba ya Jamhuri ina mambo ya Bara pia, yatenganishwe, mbona mnakwenda kama vibaka msiokuwa na elimu kutekwa akili na Wazenj. Halafu mnashangilia CCM,CCM, CCM ndani ya Bunge la Jamhuri. Hilo ni Bunge la Katiba na siyo la CCM? katiba ni ya Jamhuri siyo ya CCM, ni ya Jamhuri (CCM,CUF, NCCR, TLP........). Hatuwezi kuingia ushindani wa vyama katika Katiba ya Jamhuri. Kikwete ameonyesha utoto kwenda kihubiri msimamo wa chama chake katika Bunge la Katiba, mwelimisheni haraka, sifa ya uKiongozi Bora isitukanganye kwa sababu ni boya lililoandaliwa na Sumaye wakati amekwenda huko walikokwishajikusanyia washabiki wa kununua.

 

[Kimweri]

Sio kosa kubadilika.Mwakyeme wa jana hawezi kuwa Mwakembe wa leo. Akiwa yuleyule wa jana atakuwa amedumaa au amekoma kukua kielimu. Mtu hubadilika kulingana na kupata maarifa mapya au elimu mpya, hata akibadili mazingira hubadilika pia. Mtu hawezi kuwa na fikra mgando hata baada ya kupata elimu na uzoefu mpya. Tundu Lisu wa leo sio yule alivyokuwa alipo maliza LLB. Ungemuuliza Mwakyembe ni kwa nini amebadili msimamo wake angekujibu, hali kadhalika ungemuuliza Prof. Shivji anayo majibu, lakini kusema ni mwogo ni kukosa kujua maana ya elimu kuwa hujengwa juu ya elimu nyingine na wazola leoni bora kuliko wazo la jana ' a second thought is better than the first thought. Kadiri mtu anavyoishi hupata maarifa mapya zaidi ya yale ya jana

Very well said, We all change our positions so many times, Unless Mwakyembe said, he has never changed a decision in his life.The Lissu would have decency of calling him a lier. Mwakyembe a student is of insignificant stature compare to Mwakyembe the minister, who sits in the executive branch of the government, the second Mwakyembe has Access to unimaginable secrets of this country.I will expect him to have a very different view of a lot of shit than the mwakyembe slugging it in German.
I am also sure this Lissu might have stood Jukwaani na kumnadi Zitto siku moja back in the days, can he do the same now?The same Lissu, can't call zitto katibu mkuu msaidi wangu, because he has sued them and they are wrangling it in court. Je Lissu ni Muongo. I don't think so.
Huyo Dr. Slaa aliwahi kuwa kada wa sisiemu, probably kuna siku aliimba Zidumu fikra za mwenyekiti,je Lissu akipata transcript ya Slaa anamsifia mwenyekiti wa CCM atamuita katibu wake Muongo?
Wajapani walishawahi kupigwa Bomu la Nyuklia na Wamarekani leo ni allies, je waendelee kuwa Maadui kwa sababu ya makosa ya miaka 80 ya nyuma?
What's sadder is whatever Lissu wanted to convey will be buried by his extremely stupid examples.
What happened to innocent until proven guilty ? really st*pid lawyer

 

[funza]

Tundu Lissu ni smart lawyer na very good mwanaharakati but he is a lousy politician....huwezi mtukana Nyerere na isi ku cost

Nyerere ktk Hotuba zake amekiri Kuwa Serikari yake ilitenda mabaya na Mazuri ,ilikuwa na mapungufu yake,ikija Serikali mpya inachukua Mazuri hasa ya msingi na kuyaendeleza ,na kuachana na Yale mabaya,huenda mojawapo ya mabaya ni huu Muungano kukosa Hati ,Nyerere asilaumiwe sana Maana alishakubali alichemsha ktk baadhi ya mambo,ni wajibu wa Serikali ya Sasa kuhakikisha Tanganyika inarejea ili kupunguza kasi ya lawama juu ya Nyerere .

 

[bantulile]

Angalia kabla ya kusema! Sio tu unasema, lakini unaseama nini? Sio tu unasema nini, unasema namna gani? Sio unasema namna gani, unamwambia nani? sio tu unamwambia nani unamwambia wakati gani? Tundu haangalia mambo hayo yote lakini pia kuchamba kwingi mwisho kushika mavi.

Ukweli lazima usemwe hata kama ni mchungu, Mzee wa watu anavuliwa nguo akiwa kabulini. 'Walio wengi' vumilieni na kukubali kubadilika ili kuiponya NCHI.


Historia haiishiwi wino.