Uchochezi wa Mohamed Said na dhihaka kwa Wapigania Uhuru wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar

Uchochezi wa Mohamed Said na dhihaka kwa Wapigania Uhuru wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar

Kadogoo said:
RITZ;
Watakuja na kauli za kudai Waislamu wengine hutumia majina ya Kikristo na Wakristo hutumia ya Kiislamu! wakatihuo huo humtaja JK, Bilali, Said Mwema, Jaji Mkuu na wengine kuwa wamehodhi nyadhifa kubwa nchini na huo ni udini!
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Kadogoo,

Wasomaji wa huu mnakasha ndiyo watapima mambo haya.
 
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Mohamed Said said:
Wanabarza,
Yapo makosa kidogo katika simulizi za TANU zinazochapwa hivi sasa.
Mathalan Mzee Bogohe anasema kuwa Mhasibu Mkuu wa kwanza wa TANU alikuwa Julius Mwasanyangi.

Ukweli ni kuwa mweka hazina wa kwanza wa TANU alikuwa Iddi Faizi Mafongo aliyekuwa mhasibu vilevile wa Al Jamiatul Islamiyya fi Tanganyika.
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Ha ha haaa...mbavu zangu! Mbona unajidhalilisha? Mhasibu Mkuu na mweka hazina wapi na wapi! Kama kawaida unapewa "like" na wale walee! Kweli mgema akisifiwa tembo hulitia maji, napita tu...

...Bado natafakari ile ya "shit list", kwa mbali nimesikia inatumika tu huko Marekani! Mohamed Said, you do know exactly where to direct your messages and the "likes" from the ever faithful start streaming , hongera!
 
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Jasusi said:
Mohamed,
Nina kaswali kamoja tu ka ziada kabla sijaaga mnakasha huu. Katika maandiko yako yoote sijaona mahali ambapo umechambua matokeo ya juhudi za Nyerere kutaifisha shule za misheni ili waislamu nao waweze kupata nafasi ya elimu.
Umekiri kuwa kulikuwepo imbalance ya elimu kati ya waislamu na wakristo na hili limezungumziwa sana na rafiki yangu Lawrence Mbogoni, ambaye kitabu chake The Cross versus the Crescent kinaanzia miaka ya 1880 hadi 1990. Ni kweli Waarabu/waislamu walikuja Tanganyika miaka 700 kabla ya hapo na wakakolonize maeneo kama vile Kilwa Mtwara na Bagamoyo, lakini hawa wamisheni wa kizungu walikuja miaka 600 baadaye na kuweza kufanikiwa katika muda mfupi tu, kujenga taasisi za maendeleo--hospitali na mashule--- kwa wafuasi wao. That being the case, and the fact that Julius Nyerere recognized the imbalance, do we give him any credit for taking steps, never taken before by colonialists, to rectify this imbalance? And taking Njozi's book, could not this be the reason Nyerere patted his regime for taking these steps , did these steps have positive results, or Nyerere was out of touch with reality? What is your comment?
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Huyo rafiki yako ni Mtanzania? Kama una picha yake naomba unitumie.
 
Jasusi said:
Picha yake sina, lakini ninayo namba yake ya simu. Ukitaka nikuunganishe sema.
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nimemuandika barua pepe, akichelewa kujibu nitaomba hiyo namba asap

aisee ile ahadi nimeshindwa kuitimiza, mimi mvivu sana wa ku-scan vitu
 
Ritz said:
Nanren,

Kwa hiyo unataka kuwafunga watu midomo sababu kasema Mkiristo mwenzako ili suala Chadema kusema UDOM kuna udini aliwezi kuachwa lipite linaitaji majibu kama wewe huna data mimi ninazo.

Huwezi kusema UDOM kuna udini wakati 92% ni Wakirsto hao Waislam %8 ndiyo wanaleta udini.
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Ritz
Kwanza hizo percentages nina wasi wasi nazo. Huwa mna kawaida ya kupika na kuleta data from your own imaginations halafu mnazifanya ni factual data. Hivi umeisha andika hapa, baadaye data za 92% na 8% zitaanza kuonekana kwenye alnuur, na baadaye kwenye toleo la nne la Moh Said ilhali umezitengeneza wewe chumbani kwako.

Uchache au uwingi watu wa dini fulani hau-define udini.
Mzee Mwinyi, Rais Shein sio wadini
Lakini wewe na Moh said, mnaqualify kuitwa wadini japo nyie wanne wote ni waislam.

Statement kama "alhamdullilah, I have never seen a christian manyema" ya Moh Said, ni statement inayoashiria udini.


Haya lete data za maana zaidi tujadili.
 
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Nanren said:
Ritz
Kwanza hizo percentages nina wasi wasi nazo. Huwa mna kawaida ya kupika na kuleta data from your own imaginations halafu mnazifanya ni factual data. Hivi umeisha andika hapa, baadaye data za 92% na 8% zitaanza kuonekana kwenye alnuur, na baadaye kwenye toleo la nne la Moh Said ilhali umezitengeneza wewe chumbani kwako.

Uchache au uwingi watu wa dini fulani hau-define udini.
Mzee Mwinyi, Rais Shein sio wadini
Lakini wewe na Moh said, mnaqualify kuitwa wadini japo nyie wanne wote ni waislam.

Statement kama "alhamdullilah, I have never seen a christian manyema" ya Moh Said, ni statement inayoashiria udini.


Haya lete data za maana zaidi tujadili.
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Nanren,
Ulikuwa unazungumza na Ritz lakini nami umenitaja.

Kwa kuwa umenitaja nami nitakujibu.

Hakika nimesema, ''Alhammdulilah hakuna Mmanyema Mkristo.''

Kwa ufupi nimeshukuru kwa hilo.
Kwa nini nimeshukuru?

Naam nimeshukuru kwa kuwa Uislam ni nema na ni kitu ambacho
nakutamania hata wewe uwe Muislam.

Kushukuru kwangu si kuwa siwapendi Wakristo wala huo si udini.

Ikiwa wewe ni Muislam na ukawa mdini kwa maana ya kuwabagua
wasio Waislam hapo umekwenda kinyume na mafunzo ya Allah.

Utakuwa umedhulumu na Allah ameharamisha dhulma kama
alivyoharamisha kukubali kudhulumiwa.

Kumtamania mtu kuwa angekuwa Muislam ni kumtakia mafanikio hapa
duniani na kesho akhera.

Ingeliikuwa sisi Waislam tumeshika madaraka ya serikali ya Tanzania na kisha
Wakristo wakawa wanalalamika kuwa tunawabagua kwa udini wetu kama hivi
leo Waislam tunavyolalamika basi sie Waislam wote wa Tanzania tungekuwa
masuul mbele ya Allah.

Kwa ufupi tungekuwa na kesi ya kujibu kwani Allah hapendi dhulma.

Nimejitahidi kukueleza haya ili uelewe kwa nini nashukuru kuhusu Uislam.

Na ikiwa itakuja siku Insha Allah Nanren ukanambia, ''Mzee Mohamed mimi
nimesilimu sasa ni Muislam, neno nitakalosema kwako ni, ''Alhamdulilah.''

Maana yake, ''Shukurani zote zinamstahiki Allah.''
 
Nanren said:
Ritz
Kwanza hizo percentages nina wasi wasi nazo. Huwa mna kawaida ya kupika na kuleta data from your own imaginations halafu mnazifanya ni factual data. Hivi umeisha andika hapa, baadaye data za 92% na 8% zitaanza kuonekana kwenye alnuur, na baadaye kwenye toleo la nne la Moh Said ilhali umezitengeneza wewe chumbani kwako.

Uchache au uwingi watu wa dini fulani hau-define udini.
Mzee Mwinyi, Rais Shein sio wadini
Lakini wewe na Moh said, mnaqualify kuitwa wadini japo nyie wanne wote ni waislam.

Statement kama "alhamdullilah, I have never seen a christian manyema" ya Moh Said, ni statement inayoashiria udini.


Haya lete data za maana zaidi tujadili.
Click to expand...

Nanren,

Wewe unasema huna data kuhusu UDOM nakupata unasema una wasiwasi nazo.

Chukua na hii pale UDOM wafanyakazi-Wanataaluma Wakirsto 96% Waislam 4%.

Wafanyakazi waendeshaji Wakiristo 86% Waislam 14%.

Lau kama unaona Ritz, muongo mnywa gahawa na kashata na ana akili za madrasa hauwezi kuwa mkweli basi ukipata wasaa chukuwa source hii utazipata ( UDOM Website, announcements of admission) nikipata wasaa tashusha orodha nzima ya viongozi wa Chuo Kikuu UDOM.

Nanren, ndugu yangu umenitaja mie kama mdini unaweza kuniambia udini wangu ni upi halafu kwa nini kwenu huwa hakuna Mkiristo mdini.
 
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Barubaru said:
Ritz,

Mimi mara zote huwa najiuliza kwanini waislam ndio waitwe wadini peke yao ina maana wakristo sio wadini?

Mfano Al marhum prof Kighoma malima aliwahi kuitwa mdini na kufikia hata kusema alijenga msikiti ofisini.
College mate wangu Dr Ramadhwan Dau kila siku anasakamwa?

Dr kawambwa ndio hatulali kuhusu kusakamwa?
Nilipenda sana Jibu aliolitoa Juma Nkamia kuhusu UDOM.

Mimi nafikiri wenzenu huko nao wawe na subra na kukubali kuwa nchi ni ya wote sio yao peke yao kama walivyokuwa wanadekezwa hapo awali kiasi cha kujiona kuwa wao wana hati miliki ya kila kitu na nyie ni kwa ihsani tu

Je kulikoni huko tanzania siku hizi.
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Barubaru, ulikuwa na sababu gani za kuukana utanzania wakati moyo wako bado unaihusudu Tanzania yetu?
 
Mohamed Said,

Nakukumbusha darsa kuhusu kadi za TANU nani alikuwa anazigawa au kuziuza na rangi ya kadi za TANU ilikua rangi gani.
 
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Mag3 said:
Ha ha haaa...mbavu zangu! Mbona unajidhalilisha? Mhasibu Mkuu na mweka hazina wapi na wapi! Kama kawaida unapewa "like" na wale walee! Kweli mgema akisifiwa tembo hulitia maji, napita tu...

...Bado natafakari ile ya "shit list", kwa mbali nimesikia inatumika tu huko Marekani! Mohamed Said, you do know exactly where to direct your messages and the "likes" from the ever faithful start streaming , hongera!
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Mag3,

Si wewe ndiyo ulisema humu jamvini kuwa mikutano mingi ya TANU ilikuwa inafanyika nyumbani kwa Nyerere Pugu, na haya maneno nayo utayakana na kukimbilia kwa Invisible, ili nipigwe BAN

Ninamnukuu Nyerere maneno yake mwenyewe kutoka hapo juu yenye maandishi ya blue.

Nyerere alisema hivi "Miezi minne baada ya kuanza kazi Pugu nikawa ninakuja Dar es Saalam kwa miguu kila jumamosi, baadaye Wazee wakanipa baiskeli ni kawa nakuja mjini kukutana na wenzangu kufanya mikutano". Mwisho wa kunukuu.

Hakuna kitu ambacho Mungu akipendi kama mzee kuwa muongo.
 
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Nanren said:
Ritz
Kwani kuwepo kwa majina ya kikiristo ndio inaashiria udini!
Kama ni hivyo basi taja viongozi wa juu wa serikali kwanzia Rais, makamu wake, IGP, jaji mkuu, Mkrugenzi wa TISS n.k halafu tuseme huo ni udini pia.

Kiongozi katika kitengo fulani anaweza kuwa muislam, mkristo, mpagani, mhindu n.k lakini asiwe mdini. Na mwingine anaweza kuwa muislam au mkristo au dini nyingine katika kitengo kingine akawa mdini, ni matendo yao katika utekelezaji wa majukumu yao ndio yanayoonesha kuwa huyu ni mdini na yule sio.

Jambo lingine ni kuwa hakuna haja ya kushupalia issue ya udini wa UDOM wakati hatuna data zozote mbali na maelezo yaliyotolewa bungeni. Tuendelee na maudhui yaliyomo kwenye hii thread ya Yericko.
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Hata na wao hawako salama.Pamoja na kwamba hata maneno wanayozungumza ya kutiliwa vinywani mwao lakini kila siku wanaelekezwa vidole kwa udini.
Hata udini wa Kikwete unaomkera mpaka Mkapa hauna takwimu yoyote.Ni wivu na fitna za mfumokristo
 
One among the point which should be taken into consideration is the political situation which obtained in 1969.By 1965,it was quite clear to the Muslims that the Christian-dominated goverment was not interested at all in resolving the Muslim Question.Musilm decided to depend solely on their own efforts.They reorganised themselves under the East African Muslim Welfare Society(EAMWS),Westerlund(1980)said that it would probably never be known why Nyerere decided to ban that Muslim organisation.
Sivalon(1992) has revelead that it was actually the church leaders who requested Nyerere to ban tha Muslim body which actually he did,
Nyerere Went on to impose a puppet oganisation on the Muslims.
Bakwata was formed in December 1968 and adopted TANU's constitution by substituting the word TANU with Bakwata.Many Muslim sheikhs who opposed that puppet organisation were secretely arrested(Westerlund,1980,).It was against that background Nyerere who was all along opposed to the nationalisation of church schools hurriedly took that step.It was essentially meant to please the angry Muslims rather than to rectify the imbalances..
THIS IS THE MUSLIM QUESTION AS SEEN BY MUSLIMS..
 
Kadogoo said:
WildCard;

Kumbe sio Mtei alieunda Chadema? nani basi muasisi wake? kwasababu kuna mtu mmoja mbishi sana ati anasema muasisi wa Chadema alikuwa Bob Makani na Brown Ngwilulupi! anadai Mtei alikaribishwa Chamani kama alivyokaribishwa Nyerere ktk Tanu!
Hembu tupe darsa!
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Mtu mmoja anaundaje chama? Anachotaka kutuaminisha Mzee Mohamed ni kuwa AA ni mali ya Sykes; TAA ni mali ya Kleist; TANU ni mali ya Abdu! Hakuna siku wala saa mzee Mohamed atakiri kuwa RAIS wa KWANZA na pekee wa TANU alikuwa Mwalimu. Hasad mbaya sana hii sijui inatokana na Umanyema au UDINI wake.
 
Ritz said:
Assalam Aleykum.

Attitude can take away your beauty no matter how good looking you are or it could enhance your beauty, making you adorable.

Cc.. gombesugu,
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Ritz,

Waalayka Salaam Al Akhiy. Niwie radhi kiduchu,nimepata ile bayana yako lakini tangu siku chache zilizopita nimepata uzito kiduchu maana nina ugeni wa Khaloo yangu na Aunt yangu wapo hapa toka huko Unguja kwa matibabu na mapumziko kiduchu.

Wallahi nina furaha iso mfano kuona umerejea. Ni wajibu wetu kila mmoja baina yetu kipatwa na madhila basi soote tuwe na simanzi.

I noted what you said,always remember that;not every person is going to understand you and that's ok. They have a right to their opinion and the so called facts and you have every right to ignore it.

Insha Allah,tuendelee na hii shughuli.

Ahsanta.
 
Mohamed Said said:
Wild Card,
Inawezekana ni ujuvi.
Inawezekana pia ni kutojua historia ya Tanganyika.

Halikadhalika inawezekana na hasad na mengine mengi
kwako wewe kufananisha siasa za kikoloni na siasa hizi
za wakati huu tulionao.

Hakika mimi nakubaliana na wewe Nyerere si mtu wa
kusubiri Abdu Sykes aunde TANU Nyerere unavyoona
wewe ni mtu wa kuunda chama chake.

Tatizo liko hapa inawezekana kweli Nyerere alikuwa na
fikra ya kuunda TANU toka Butiama.

Na ikiwa utakuja ushahidi wa hilo labda alipata fikra hizi
kwa baba yake Chief Burito au kwa namna yoyote ile nani
atapinga?

Abdu mimi nasema kaunda TANU kwa sababu historia yake
yote kuanzia kwa baba yake ndiyo hiyo za siasa za mapambano
na ukoloni.

Huo mfano wa yeye na Chief Kidaha ni mmoja wa mifano hiyo.
Ukitaka mingene na iko mingi utarudi nyuma kwa baba yake na
yeye mweyewe katika maisha yake hadi TANU ikaaundwa 1954.

Ikiwa Nyerere aliunda TANU uwanja ndiyo huu uletwe ushahidi.

Isiwe Nyerere kuunda kwake TANU unafungamanishwa na historia
yake na Abdu Sykes na TAA pale New Street.

Lameck Bugohe mmoja wa waasisi wa TANU alipata kuandika makala
katika Raia Mwema akasema yeye alikuwa na fikra ya kuunda TANU
Mwanza katika miaka ya awali ya 1954.

Mimi niliandika makala ya kumuunga mkono.

Katika makala ile alilaumu wana historia kujikita kwa Nyerere bila ya
kufanya utafiti kwa wanasiasa wengine wa wakati ule yeye akiwa
mmojawapo.

Kuasisi TANU si milki ya Abdu Sykes peke yake yawezekana wako wengi
walikuwa na fikra kama zake.

Huu ni wakati muafaka kwa sisi kusikia habari za wazalendo hawa pamoja
na historia ya Nyerere katika juhudi zake za kuasisi TANU ama iwe Butiama,
Makerere au Tabora.
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Mzee Mohamed,
Unataka ushahidi gani wa Mwalimu kuwa mmoja wa waliounda TANU? Yeye ndie mwenye kadi namba moja; Mwalimu ndie RAIS wa KWANZA na pekee wa TANU tangu ilipoundwa hadi tunarudishiwa uhuru wetu; Mwalimu hakumpigania mkoloni kama walivyofanya babu, baba na Abdu mwenyewe; Abdu alipotea kabisa kwenye siasa za TANU baada kuanguka Urais.
"Kuasisi TANU si milki ya Abdu Sykes peke yake yawezekana wako wengi
walikuwa na fikra kama zake." Haya ndio maneno. Wala Abdu hakuunda TANU.
 
WildCard said:
Mtu mmoja anaundaje chama? Anachotaka kutuaminisha Mzee Mohamed ni kuwa AA ni mali ya Sykes; TAA ni mali ya Kleist; TANU ni mali ya Abdu! Hakuna siku wala saa mzee Mohamed atakiri kuwa RAIS wa KWANZA na pekee wa TANU alikuwa Mwalimu. Hasad mbaya sana hii sijui inatokana na Umanyema au UDINI wake.
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WildCard,

Hakuna mahala popote Mohamed Said amesema kuwa TANU ni mali ya Abdul na Ally Sykes wala AA mali ya Kleist.

Mohamed Said kaeleza kwingi kuhusu waasisi wa AA, TAA, TANU, ametaja majina mengi ya wazee ambao walikuwa waasisi.
 
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