Wana sayansi waanza kukukbali uwepo wa Mungu

[Kiranga]

Hahaha! Another dumb example!
Very amusing aisee!

If it's so dumb, could you explain away the contradiction? Why it dumb?

 

[Kiranga]

'Kama binadamu hawezi kupaa angani basi vingine haviwezi kupaa pia"

Hapa kama hesabu tungesema umegawanya kwa sifuri.

How do you get that?

I want a logical explanation showing a direct correlation at the very least if not causation.

Otherwise you simply must admit to having a brain funk that misprocessed and analogized backasswards.

 

[Eiyer]

How do you get that?

I want a logical explanation showing a direct correlation at the very least if not causation.

Otherwise you simply must admit to having a brain funk that misprocessed and analogized backasswards.

How did you conclude that kama Mungu hakuumbwa na binadamu hakuumbwa?

Nahitaji maelezo yanayokubaliana na mantiki kuhusiana na hili ......!!!!!!!

 

[Kiranga]

How did you conclude that kama Mungu hakuumbwa na binadamu hakuumbwa?

Nahitaji maelezo yanayokubaliana na mantiki kuhusiana na hili ......!!!!!!!

Hujanijibu swali langu.

First of all, let's get the quote correctly.

Nilichoandika ni

If god can be uncaused, everything else can be uncaused.

Do you understand the difference between what I wrote and what you reported that I concluded?

Au brain funk inaendelea?

 

[Eiyer]

Hujanijibu swali langu.

Hakukuwa na swali bali mhemko tu

First of all, let's get the quote correctly.
Nilichoandika ni
Do you understand the difference between what I wrote and what you reported that I concluded?
Au brain funk inaendelea?

Hakuna tofauti ya kimantiki hapo

Ulimesema "kama Mungu ni kisababishi kisichokuwa na kilichosababisha akawepo basi hata binadamu anaweza kuwepo bila kusababishwa"

Mimi nimesema "How did you conclude that kama Mungu hakuumbwa na binadamu hakuumbwa?"

Kuna tofauti gani kimantiki hapo?
Au brain funk imekukamata?

 

[Kiranga]

Hakukuwa na swali bali mhemko tu

Hakuna tofauti ya kimantiki hapo

Ulimesema "kama Mungu ni kisababishi kisichokuwa na kilichosababisha akawepo basi hata binadamu anaweza kuwepo bila kusababishwa"

Mimi nimesema "How did you conclude that kama Mungu hakuumbwa na binadamu hakuumbwa?"

Kuna tofauti gani kimantiki hapo?
Au brain funk imekukamata?

I will cut to the chase since you seem bent on your brain funk to understand even the simplest of concepts.

Mungu, supposedly the most complex entity in the universe, akiweza kuwepo bila kuumbwa, any less complex entity itawezekana zaidi kuwepo bila kuumbwa.

Ikiwa jumbo jet lililo complex enough kuruka linaweza kuwepo tu bila kuumbwa, kiti cha kawaida cha kukalia ambacho hakiruki na hakina complexity kubwa kina uwezekano mkubwa zaidi wa kuwepo bila kuumbwa.

After all kwenye jumbo jet kuna kiti na characteristics zake zote, kwa hiyo ukisema jumbo jet limetokea bila kuumbwa, linaruka na lina viti mia kadhaa ndani, tayari ushasema kwamba kiti kimeweza kutokea bila kuumbwa.

Huwezi kusema mungu huyu aliye infinitely complex yupo tu hakuumbwa, halafu mtu ambaye ni infinitely less complex awe hawezekani kuwepo bila kuumbwa.

That is a contradiction, an inconsistency, an illogical thought process that exposes how faulty and arbitrary the whole thing is.

 

[Good Guy]

I guess you forgot that science as we always mean it needs repeatable experiments under controlled evironment.
And let me remind all buddies here that Evolutionists cannot go back billions of years to do any test/observation and according to their religion, no body was there: there was nothing! So everything about it is sheer speculation.

On other hands, we creationists were not there thousands of years ago but we have a trustworthy report from one who was there. Its insane that those who do not believe in Biblical Creation report try to paint themselves "scientific" while painting us who believe the Bible as "ignorants". The truth is, its insane to believe report from Mr. nothing!

CC: Kiranga bona Tiger et al

brother you can not say it that way. Not everything can be recreated or measured directly!! Laws can be replicated and proven again and again but just because the same can't be done to Theories doesn't mean its not in the realm of science. Theories zinashindwa kufanywa laws simply due to low tech, usually technology inakua too low to prove em, its good to have theories around, one they explain the unexplained and two they usually push the technology forward.

Electrons ilikua ni theory na couple of models ziliundwa tryna explain it ila now the existence of electrons is well known and fact. Hivyo hata that theory you're criticizing who knows inawezekana in the future a guy anaweza invent time machine na kuproove everything said is right!

 

[Mtangoo]

brother you can not say it that way. Not everything can be recreated or measured directly!! Laws can be replicated and proven again and again but just because the same can't be done to Theories doesn't mean its not in the realm of science.

Origins falls in History not Science Period!
No one can put creation/evolution in lab to do any test whatsoever. So they are not Observational and hence Historical.
History Must have eye witness who wrote it. Creation have God: Evolution have got mr. Nothing!

Theories zinashindwa kufanywa laws simply due to low tech, usually technology inakua too low to prove em, its good to have theories around, one they explain the unexplained and two they usually push the technology forward.

Are you into fantasy of going back in time to test how things happened? If no, how can you test, for example, that first human was created or he evolved? Or that Life came from God or Non life?

Electrons ilikua ni theory na couple of models ziliundwa tryna explain it ila now the existence of electrons is well known and fact. Hivyo hata that theory you're criticizing who knows inawezekana in the future a guy anaweza invent time machine na kuproove everything said is right!

Electrons are there and you can do repeatable test even now as we speak. That cannot be done o origins...so?

 

[Tiger]

I guess you forgot that science as we always mean it needs repeatable experiments under controlled evironment.
And let me remind all buddies here that Evolutionists cannot go back billions of years to do any test/observation and according to their religion, no body was there: there was nothing! So everything about it is sheer speculation.

On other hands, we creationists were not there thousands of years ago but we have a trustworthy report from one who was there. Its insane that those who do not believe in Biblical Creation report try to paint themselves "scientific" while painting us who believe the Bible as "ignorants". The truth is, its insane to believe report from Mr. nothing!

CC: Kiranga bona Tiger et al

Subiri kidogo, nakuja mkuu.
Ha ha haaa!

 

[Kiranga]

I guess you forgot that science as we always mean it needs repeatable experiments under controlled evironment.
And let me remind all buddies here that Evolutionists cannot go back billions of years to do any test/observation and according to their religion, no body was there: there was nothing! So everything about it is sheer speculation.

On other hands, we creationists were not there thousands of years ago but we have a trustworthy report from one who was there. Its insane that those who do not believe in Biblical Creation report try to paint themselves "scientific" while painting us who believe the Bible as "ignorants". The truth is, its insane to believe report from Mr. nothing!

CC: Kiranga bona Tiger et al

And that is the strength science has over religion, this is not a weakness.

The fact that science allows and calls for peer review, research, confirmation, doubt, experimentation, repeatability is a good thing.

Do not make that sound as a weakness.

You are burying your head in the sand in a world that trusts without verification, and somehow portray that as a virtue.

I find the Big Bang Theory, the reigning theory in cosmogony, incomplete, if not wanting altogether.

If this was in religion, I would be considered a heretic. But sciences accommodates dissent and questions on the reigning thinking. People are trying to find holes in Einstein's relativity up to today.

Indeed, had Einsten (and his likes) not tried to find holes in Newton's laws, we wouldn't be able to use GPS and send satellites in orbit today.

 

[Mtangoo]

And that is the strength science has over religion, this is not a weakness.

The fact that science allows and aclls for for peer review, research, confirmation, doubt, experimentation, repeatability is a good thing.

Do not make that sound as a weakness.

You are burying your head in the sand in a world that trusts without verification, and somehow portray that as a virtue.

Who said its weakness? I was showing your religion is not science since it fails to pass the test!

 

[NullPointer]

brother you can not say it that way. Not everything can be recreated or measured directly!! Laws can be replicated and proven again and again but just because the same can't be done to Theories doesn't mean its not in the realm of science. Theories zinashindwa kufanywa laws simply due to low tech, usually technology inakua too low to prove em, its good to have theories around, one they explain the unexplained and two they usually push the technology forward. Electrons ilikua ni theory na couple of models ziliundwa tryna explain it ila now the existence of electrons is well known and fact. Hivyo hata that theory you're criticizing who knows inawezekana in the future a guy anaweza invent time machine na kuproove everything said is right!

Hakuna ambaye aliwahi kwenda against Law of Conservation of energy, ila am sure ni rahisi mara mia kwenda against Law of conservation of energy kuliko kutengeneza hicho kitu in red hapo "TIME MACHINE" ukisema mtu atengeneze time machine unafuta kila kitu kwamba binadamu ana free thinking manake tuko controlled simply because mtu ataweza kwenda nyuma na kurekebisha kitu, sasa je nenda nyuma umuue babu yako, itakuaje hapo?? machine ya kwenda mbele ningekubali simply cause inakupa illusion na kuslow ubongo kuona kila kitu kinaenda slow kumbe in reality muda unasonga...

 

[NullPointer]

And that is the strength science has over religion, this is not a weakness.

The fact that science allows and calls for for peer review, research, confirmation, doubt, experimentation, repeatability is a good thing.

Do not make that sound as a weakness.

You are burying your head in the sand in a world that trusts without verification, and somehow portray that as a virtue.

I find the Big Bang Theory, the reigning theory in cosmogony, incomplete, if not wanting altogether.

If this was in religion, I would be considered a heretic. But sciences accommodates dissent and questions on the reigning thinking. People are trying to find holes in Einstein's relativity up to today.

Indeed, had Einsten (and his likes) not tried to find holes in Newton's laws, we wouldn't be able to use GPS and send satellites in orbit today.

Mkuu usiongee basi kama umemeza sana science, field ya quantum physics waachie wenyewe, hata wababe kwenye hiyo field bado wanasema theres something beyond, sababu science inastudy nature doesn't mean it goes against creation, we unadhani hata wanaoamini Mungu hawaamini science? ulipewa akili ili uweze kustudy uumbaji ulivofanyika vilevile.

Kama watu wanakubaliana na BigBang theory, basi wapingane na Law of conservation of energy maana watakua wanakubaliana kua all this energy simply came from nothing, who has proven the bigbang with concrete evidence?? simply, No one.

Kama ambavyo hamna aliyeshawahi kutengeneza devices za perpetual motion, basi vilevile wasiamini bigbang... Religion unaweza ukaidharau simply cause hujaingia deep kujua what really goes on inside, we mbona uchawi upo na unaonekana? mtu anapaaje bila fuel? au coz vimefichwa machoni kwako huoni? nenda swanga ulizia utaonyeshwa maajabu, human teleportation kwa kutumia rungu ndio utakavorudi kuanza kuelezea ma string theory hapa kua ulipelekwa parallel universe kwa kua simply hutotaka kuamini..

 

[Good Guy]

Hakuna ambaye aliwahi kwenda against Law of Conservation of energy, ila am sure ni rahisi mara mia kwenda against Law of conservation of energy kuliko kutengeneza hicho kitu in red hapo "TIME MACHINE" ukisema mtu atengeneze time machine unafuta kila kitu kwamba binadamu ana free thinking manake tuko controlled simply because mtu ataweza kwenda nyuma na kurekebisha kitu, sasa je nenda nyuma umuue babu yako, itakuaje hapo?? machine ya kwenda mbele ningekubali simply cause inakupa illusion na kuslow ubongo kuona kila kitu kinaenda slow kumbe in reality muda unasonga...

That's the famous "GRANDFATHER PARADOX". Its among couple of other paradoxes in physics! Kuna some explanations proposed that a new time line would be created ila forget it its still sci-fi for now, mkuu time is a delicate and very complex thing, kwanza it all begins What is time?

Is it the numbers on your watch? Is it the marks put on ongoing events? Kuna experiments I'm not sure where they were conducted they were able make a photon of light new again which kinda means they made it travel back in time(i'm not overly sure on the details here ila experiment involved a photon of light na the conclusion ni kua it went back to/ slowed down time for micro/nano sec).

Maswala ya muda ni very complicated as far as i can remember Einstein's relativity theory portion ya time slowing down ilikua proved na satellites, so mkuu just keep an open mind the possibility are endless

 

[Good Guy]

Origins falls in History not Science Period!
No one can put creation/evolution in lab to do any test whatsoever. So they are not Observational and hence Historical.
History Must have eye witness who wrote it. Creation have God: Evolution have got mr. Nothing!


Are you into fantasy of going back in time to test how things happened? If no, how can you test, for example, that first human was created or he evolved? Or that Life came from God or Non life?


Electrons are there and you can do repeatable test even now as we speak. That cannot be done o origins...so?

Sorry but I'm gonna sum up my argument based on your last comment, Sir!! First off until early 1900s before J.J.Thompson atoms were considered to be indivisible particles and it was crazy at the time he proposed of electrons to even think that more particles are in an atom, but yet here u are are now, secondly electrons just like fairies have never been observed by anyone on earth the reason we believe their existence and not in fairies is not because we have seen them in the lab like what you're saying science is all about but we do believe in electron theory more than fairies theory simply because the evidence collected to support electrons far exceeds the latter!!

The theory of origin proposed by hawking sawa kuna flaws here and there but there are alot evidence observed that supports it and that is what keeps it afloat to date mkuu. Sio lazima tumuone mtu ana evolve in the lab to prove evolution, if there are enough evidence to support it basi ni kweli!

 

[pleo]

Hii mambo ndio ilinifanya nisipende fizikia, kama unaweza kurudia kidogo sijaelewa mantiki ya jaribio la fotoni.
Ni kama unaweka mpira mezani leo ili uuone jana!?
Nani atakuwa amesafiri kwenda nyuma ya muda photon au mfizikia, au wote kwa pamoja.
Niwie radhi kwa uelewa wangu mdogo wa fizikia.

That's the famous "GRANDFATHER PARADOX". Its among couple of other paradoxes in physics! Kuna some explanations proposed that a new time line would be created ila forget it its still sci-fi for now, mkuu time is a delicate and very complex thing, kwanza it all begins What is time? Is it the numbers on your watch? Is it the marks put on ongoing events? Kuna experiments I'm not sure where they were conducted they were able make a photon of light new again which kinda means they made it travel back in time(i'm not overly sure on the details here ila experiment involved a photon of light na the conclusion ni kua it went back to/ slowed down time for micro/nano sec). Maswala ya muda ni very complicated as far as i can remember Einstein's relativity theory portion ya time slowing down ilikua proved na satellites, so mkuu just keep an open mind the possibility are endless

 

[Good Guy]

Hii mambo ndio ilinifanya nisipende fizikia, kama unaweza kurudia kidogo sijaelewa mantiki ya jaribio la fotoni.
Ni kama unaweka mpira mezani leo ili uuone jana!?
Nani atakuwa amesafiri kwenda nyuma ya muda photon au mfizikia, au wote kwa pamoja.
Niwie radhi kwa uelewa wangu mdogo wa fizikia.

haha mkuu fizikia mara nyingine inachanganya kweli. Ila labda nimechagua mfano mbaya kuelezea hii phenomena(ikumbukwe hili jaribio lipo japo najitahidi kuvuta kumbukumbu kwa sasa bila mafanikio, nikisearch online nikaipata I'll post it up). Ila kwa sasa angalia hiki ki2, telescopes zimeweza kurekodi radiation emitted from dying stars light years from earth, light years kama hujui mkuu ni umbali mwanga umesafiri ndani ya mwaka mzima. Sasa fikiria tunarekodi mwanga uliotoka million lightyears.

Inamaana tukio tunaloliona kwenye huo mwanga limetokea miaka million iliyopita ila mda wote mwanga ulikua unasafiri mpaka umetufikia hapa, hivyo technically we're looking at the past na tukisema tulinganishe muda tunaoona matukio hayo ya kwenye huo mwanga sasa na mambo yaliyopo pale mwanga ulipotoka technically source inakua miaka million 1 mbele ya tunachokiona sasa. Vp you there?

 

[Tiger]

I guess you forgot that science as we always mean it needs repeatable experiments under controlled evironment.
And let me remind all buddies here that Evolutionists cannot go back billions of years to do any test/observation and according to their religion, no body was there: there was nothing! So everything about it is sheer speculation.

On other hands, we creationists were not there thousands of years ago but we have a trustworthy report from one who was there. Its insane that those who do not believe in Biblical Creation report try to paint themselves "scientific" while painting us who believe the Bible as "ignorants". The truth is, its insane to believe report from Mr. nothing!

CC: Kiranga bona Tiger et al

Binafsi ninachoweza kusema so far nikwamba sifahamu tumetoka wapi na sidhani kama ni kosa au ni kutokwa na akili kusema hivyo.
Evolution theory imejitahidi kutueleza tumetoka wapi japo sikubalianinayo kwa mengi, aidha dini inajaribu kufanya hivyo isipokuwa namna dini inavyomuelezea Mungu na utendaji wake ndivyo vitu hasa vinavyofanya baadhi ya watu kum-doubt huyo Mungu na hivyo kufikiri pengine kuna kitu hatufahamu kuhusu Mungu.

 

[Tiger]

Mkuu,
Huwa najiuliza sana

Hivi inakuwaje mtu anaedai kuwa anafikiri kabisa aseme kuwa Binadamu [achilia mbali dunia na ulimwengu wote na vilivyomo] kuwa alitokea tu

Hii inaingiaje akilini?

Nibora mara elfu nyingi wale wanaokubali kuwa kuna muwekaji wa vyote ila hawajajua ni yupi au ni nani ....!!!!!!

CC: MaxShimba !!!!!!

Nihesabu na mimi kati ya hao wasiojua tumefikaje hapa tulipo.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Binafsi ninachoweza kusema so far nikwamba sifahamu tumetoka wapi na sidhani kama ni kosa au ni kutokwa na akili kusema hivyo.
Evolution theory imejitahidi kutueleza tumetoka wapi japo sikubalianinayo kwa mengi, aidha dini inajaribu kufanya hivyo isipokuwa namna dini inavyomuelezea Mungu na utendaji wake ndivyo vitu hasa vinavyofanya baadhi ya watu kum-doubt huyo Mungu na hivyo kufikiri pengine kuna kitu hatufahamu kuhusu Mungu.

Evolution theory haikidhi kabisa swali la chanzo chetu.