Mkataba (MoU) kati ya Serikali na Kanisa Katoliki na Taasisi nyingine za Kidini

Topical said:

Wakuu sasa mmeishiwa na hoja..

Vyuo vinavyotoa diploma na cheti waislamu viko vingi sana ...

Tunaongelea vyuo mushrooms after 1992 MoU mlipopata pesa za umma na kodi zetu..

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Wewe ndiyo umeishiwa hoja , unalikumbuka swali lako lakini?

By Topical

Before 1992 MoU nitajie chuo kikuu kimoja cha kikristo Tanzania?

Before 1992 MoU nitajie hospitali moja ya kikristo Tanzania? usinitajie Bugando, wala KCMC kwasababu zote zilijengwa na serikali ya mkoloni, unajua serikali maana yake ni kodi za watanzania wote..

Acha hizo nyie mkiiba seriaklini si juhudi hiyo hakuna tofauti na RA na EL

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Ngoja nikuongezee na hospitali kabla ya so called MoU, kulikuwa na Itete Hospital, Igogwe Hospital, Mbozi mission hospital, Ilembula hospital kumbuka hospitali zote hizi hakuna hata hospitali ya wilaya moja ya Dar es Salaamiliyoweza enzi zile na hata leo kufanana nazo kwa majengo, huduma bora. On top of that hospital hizi pia zilikuwa na vyuo vya manesi. Tatizo naloliona pia kwako na mashabiki wa MS ni ufinyu mlionao kuhusu jiografia ya Tanganyika.

Jasusi said:

Viweke hapa. Siyo kubwabwaja tu kwamba viko vingi sana. Vitaje basi!

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Uncivilized language ya nini..

Uliwahi kusema hatuna hata hospitali nikakutajia tano zenye hadhi kupita hospitali za wilaya zilizopo..

Ilikubadili chochote katika thinking yako kuhusu waislam na taasisi zao No!

It doesn't make any difference lakini tumia ustaarabu usifikiri mimi nashindwa..kutumia lugha chafu najizuia ..

Topical said:

Mkuu wewe una rafiki hata moja muislam? just curious

Unajisikiaje kuchukua kodi yake kupelekwa kanisani in the name of social services (unaudited)??

Hata kama mbeya ilikuwa na shule nyingi ndio iwe halali kuchukua kodi za umma kupelekea kwenye vyuo na hospitali ya kanisa wakati kuna shule kibao za kata za serikali zinahitaji walimu na madarasa mazuri..

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Hahaha ahahaha aahaha, ngoja nikudokeze tu ndugu yangu best man wa ndoa yangu ni mwislam, wikiendi hii watoto wangu wanaenda kuspend siku 3 to my lovely brother's family ambaye ni mwislam kutoka Iran. I have live with muslims all my life, I alwayz meet some smartest muslim academicians in my daily living. I work with muslims and enjoy. They are my true brothers huku ughaibuni sasa nashangazwa sana napoona hizi sentiments za kibaguzi zinazopeperushwa kwa hisia na mihemko nyumbani Tanzania. That is not the way I grew up, that is not the way our country was built on , that is not us.

Nyambala said:

Wewe ndiyo umeishiwa hoja , unalikumbuka swali lako lakini?



Ngoja nikuongezee na hospitali kabla ya so called MoU, kulikuwa na Itete Hospital, Igogwe Hospital, Mbozi mission hospital, Ilembula hospital kumbuka hospitali zote hizi hakuna hata hospitali ya wilaya moja ya Dar es Salaamiliyoweza enzi zile na hata leo kufanana nazo kwa majengo, huduma bora. On top of that hospital hizi pia zilikuwa na vyuo vya manesi. Tatizo naloliona pia kwako na mashabiki wa MS ni ufinyu mlionao kuhusu jiografia ya Tanganyika.

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Baada ya MoU na kuchukua hela za umma zikawa bora zaidi au hali ni kama zamani na bei ni ya juu kama muheza (nimewahi kutumia)

Je kuna auditing ya kamati za bunge kuhakiki kama mnanunulia vifaa vya hospitali kwa ajili ya watu wote au shughuli za kanisa

Kuna tofauti gani ki-huduma baada ya ruzuku ya umma na kabla ya ruzuku ya umma...

Nyambala said:

Hahaha ahahaha aahaha, ngoja nikudokeze tu ndugu yangu best man wa ndoa yangu ni mwislam, wikiendi hii watoto wangu wanaenda kuspend siku 3 to my lovely brother's family ambaye ni mwislam kutoka Iran. I have live with muslims all my life, I alwayz meet some smartest muslim academicians in my daily living. I work with muslims and enjoy. They are my true brothers huku ughaibuni sasa nashangazwa sana napoona hizi sentiments za kibaguzi zinazopeperushwa kwa hisia na mihemko nyumbani Tanzania. That is not the way I grew up, that is not the way our country was built on , that is not us.

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Ala..

Hajajibu swali la msingi..utajisikiaje kutumia kodi yake kwa ajili ya shughuli ya kanisa

So called great thinking!!!!!!!! hahaha ahahaha ahahaha. All this went in sequence!

Hoja

Mdondoaji said:

Zing,
Kuhusu MoU ya sheikh Ponda na wenzie waachie serikali wajibu kwanini waliikataa maana waislamu wana shauku ya kutaka kujua kilitokea nini mpaka ikakataliwa. Hii interpretation yako kuwa ati MoU yao ilikuwa kidini zaidi ni sawa sawa na interpretation ya Mohamed Said kuwa MoU ya akina Ponda ilikataliwa kwasababu imetoka kwa waislamu na ina nia ya kunufaisha waislamu which kwa mtazamo wa serikali ya Tanzania wao ni SECOND CLASS CITIZEN AMBAO KAZI YAO NI KUIFANYIA KAZI SERIKALI HII NA KULIPA KODI ILA WASINUFAIKE NA KODI ZAO!!!.

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Swali

Mwita Maranya said:

Mdondoaji,

Umeshawahi kuiona MoU ya sheikh ponda iliyokataliwa na serikali? Ama niseme ushawahi kuisoma? Je unaweza kufanya mpango wa kuifikisha hapa JF?

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Jibu

Mdondoaji said:

Sijawahi kuiona Mwita niseme ukweli ila nimesoma kwenye Vitabu vya Mohamed Said labda waulizeni akina sheikh ponda au Mohamed Said watuletee MoU tuijadili humu ndani!

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Topical said:

Ala..

Hajajibu swali la msingi..utajisikiaje kutumia kodi yake kwa ajili ya shughuli ya kanisa

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Hahahah ahahaha unajua kuongelea mambo jumla jumla bila kusubstantiate ndiyo tabu yake, just tell me kanisa lipi na limetumia sh. ngapi za kodi ya serikali kuendeleza mambo ya kanisa. Lete details ntakujibu.

NGUVUMOJA said:

Nyie wafuasi wa paulo kazi yenu matusi na kashfa. Huna hoja mpuuzi wee, udini umekujaa. Nenda kwenye mihadhara ya dini upeleke upuuzi wako kule.

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mimi ni mdini kwa unataka niwe nani ?jinga ww

Nyambala said:

Hahahah ahahaha unajua kuongelea mambo jumla jumla bila kusubstantiate ndiyo tabu yake, just tell me kanisa lipi na limetumia sh. ngapi za kodi ya serikali kuendeleza mambo ya kanisa. Lete details ntakujibu.

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Kanisa katoki bil 3 kila mwaka

Topical said:

Baada ya MoU na kuchukua hela za umma zikawa bora zaidi au hali ni kama zamani na bei ni ya juu kama muheza (nimewahi kutumia)

Je kuna auditing ya kamati za bunge kuhakiki kama mnanunulia vifaa vya hospitali kwa ajili ya watu wote au shughuli za kanisa

Kuna tofauti gani ki-huduma baada ya ruzuku ya umma na kabla ya ruzuku ya umma...

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Acha uongo mkuu wangu jambo usilolijua??????? Usitake ku-speculate vitu usivyovijua, halafu hiyo tabia yako ya kujumlisha jumlisha mambo inakuondolea sifa ya kujadiliana na mimi just for your info. Unaposema "kama mnanunulia vifaa vya hospitali kwa ajili ya watu wote au shughuli za kanisa" inaonyesha how immature you are, huwezi kujenga hoja mpaka umtumbukize unayejadiliana naye kwenye group unaloli-attack!

Besides hujajibu hoja pia kwa nini 1988, 4 years kabla ya MoU, Mbeya kulikuwa na shule nyingi binafsi kuliko Dar es Salaam? Je watoto ambao hawakuchaguliwa kwenda sekondari za serikali in Dar walienda kusoma wapi?

Nyambala said:

So called great thinking!!!!!!!! hahaha ahahaha ahahaha. All this went in sequence!

Hoja


Swali



Jibu

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Kwani wao wameiona MoU ya akina ponda?? Kwanini wasiibandike humu jamvini tuijadili? Je serikali haikukataa MoU ya akina Sheikh Ponda? Si wajibu? Nyambala IQ yangu iko juu kuliko yako ndio maana nimekushushua ulivyo kuja juu kama moto wa kifuu. Umekimbia! You are dealing with a person of different calibre dude.

Topical said:

Kanisa katoki bil 3 kila mwaka

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And yo call that substantiating? Inatosha mkuu wewe endeleza mihemko na mabishano lakini ukileta data ya uongo especially kuhusu shule, I will always be there! Na kwenye hilo siendi Mwanza, wala Kilimanjaro au Iringa, najikita mkoa wa Mbeya tu na all emotional motivated agenda kuhusu historia ya elimu can easily be defeated on Statistics from just that area.

Nyambala said:

Acha uongo mkuu wangu jambo usilolijua??????? Usitake ku-speculate vitu usivyovijua, halafu hiyo tabia yako ya kujumlisha jumlisha mambo inakuondolea sifa ya kujadiliana na mimi just for your info. Unaposema "kama mnanunulia vifaa vya hospitali kwa ajili ya watu wote au shughuli za kanisa" inaonyesha how immature you are, huwezi kujenga hoja mpaka umtumbukize unayejadiliana naye kwenye group unaloli-attack!

Besides hujajibu hoja pia kwa nini 1988, 4 years kabla ya MoU, Mbeya kulikuwa na shule nyingi binafsi kuliko Dar es Salaam? Je watoto ambao hawakuchaguliwa kwenda sekondari za serikali in Dar walienda kusoma wapi?

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Wewe unayejua si ndio utueleze..

Wewe nani anakulazimisha kujadiliana na mimi..if you think you cannot just quit..

Nyambala said:

Hahahah ahahaha unajua kuongelea mambo jumla jumla bila kusubstantiate ndiyo tabu yake, just tell me kanisa lipi na limetumia sh. ngapi za kodi ya serikali kuendeleza mambo ya kanisa. Lete details ntakujibu.

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Kasome Thread ya MoU ya Kanisa katoliki na makanisa mengine na serikali ya Tanzania. Utayajua makanisa gani yalishiriki katika hiyo memorandum!!!! Unataka uletewe details wakati zimo humu jamvini tunakutuma nenda ukaisome vizuri halafu urudi tena.

Nyambala said:

And yo call that substantiating? Inatosha mkuu wewe endeleza mihemko na mabishano lakini ukileta data ya uongo especially kuhusu shule, I will always be there! Na kwenye hilo siendi Mwanza, wala Kilimanjaro au Iringa, najikita mkoa wa Mbeya tu na all emotional motivated agenda kuhusu historia ya elimu can easily be defeated on Statistics from just that area.

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Fanya bidii kutetea uwizi wa kanisa through MoU eti kwasbb utakuwa good christian for doing that kama alivyofanya nyerere kubagua waislam ili apate dhawabu kwa mungu wake..

Lakini acha ku-pretending kuwa una urafiki na waislamu lakini deep inside you are just different person pole sana

Hela za MoU hakuna mtetezi hapa ni uwizi sawa na epa, richmond etc.

Wanajamvi, naona mnakasha unaendelea vizuri ila nawaomba kitu kimoja tu kwamba ya MOU yapelekwe kwenye jukwaa lake kwani lipo tena sana tu na linaendela (mods naomba msaidie kwenye hili). Hapa tuna moja tu nalo ni kuhoji ukweli wa madai kuwa Wamanyema na Wazulu ndio waliokuja kuwafungua macho Watanganyika, na hasa wenyeji wa Dar es Salaam, na kuyaongoza mapambano dhidi ya mkoloni ya kudai uhuru. Mkuu Nyambala naona kuna wakati alimwuliza "scholar" Mohamed Said kama naye ana asili ya Kimanyema au Kizulu lakini sikumbuki kama jibu lilitolewa.

Wakuu, labda kwa kuwa uelewa wangu wa kiingereza ni mdogo nimeshindwa kuielewa vizuri hii hati. Kwanza hati inahusu Roman catholic (RC) na makanisa mengine na siyo RC tu kama thread inavyotutaka tuamini. Pili sijaona article yoyote katika hii MoU inayosema walau, "As far as this MoU is concerned no other denomination or religion registered in the United of Tanzania shall be allowed to sign a similar MoU with the Tanzania Government". Kama hivi ndivyo madhebu au dini zingine zinashindwaje kuishinikiza serikali kusaini hati kama hiyo nayo? Kitu kingine nilichokiona ni kwamba MoU yenyewe imeandaliwa kienyeji mno, hivi ni nani anayeweza kututajia kwa uhakika majina ya waliosaini hiyo MoU, maana zaidi ya saini za waliosaini hati husika, majina ya waliosaini hayaonekani!!!

Topical said:

Fanya bidii kutetea uwizi wa kanisa through MoU eti kwasbb utakuwa good christian for doing that kama alivyofanya nyerere kubagua waislam ili apate dhawabu kwa mungu wake..

Lakini acha ku-pretending kuwa una urafiki na waislamu lakini deep inside you are just different person pole sana

Hela za MoU hakuna mtetezi hapa ni uwizi sawa na epa, richmond etc.

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Hahahaha ahahahah ahahaha!!!!!!!!! unajua mkuu ungekuwa unajenga hoja na kusimama na ID yako moja ningeendelea kukjibu sasa unapoibua ID nyingine kujipa shavu, sometimes kuji-contradict inaniwia ngumu kuendelea na mjadala ati!!!!!!!!!!! besides nina urafiki na watu nilio karibu nao sio eti tu kwa sababu wewe ni dini flani au ni kabila langu basi automatically u are my friend. That is a big big NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wewe endelea na mijadala kwa mtindo uliouzowea, bila facts, blah blah na sensitization. I am out kujibu hoja zisizo kichwa wala miguu!!!!!!!!!!

Mdondoaji said:

Kasome Thread ya MoU ya Kanisa katoliki na makanisa mengine na serikali ya Tanzania. Utayajua makanisa gani yalishiriki katika hiyo memorandum!!!! Unataka uletewe details wakati zimo humu jamvini tunakutuma nenda ukaisome vizuri halafu urudi tena.

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Mkuu details za Tshs Bilioni 91 hazimo mle, hii ni wewe unaipigia debe kwa siku hata mara mia. Sasa lete details hizo hela zinagawiwaje, kwa nani na kwa nini, na ni namna gani ni dhuluma. Anyway kwa kufuta ushauri wa Mag3 mimi naishia hapa kwenye masuala ya MoU ila mkiendelea kuleta uongo lazima records ziwe st straight.

Duh.. .. Samaki wakasirika